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Serious question, why are you in this subreddit?

Iamflirtingwithyou

June 1, 2017

2 upvotes

/r/seduction

/r/seduction/comments/6epepr/serious_question_why_are_you_in_this_subreddit/

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Post Information

Title	Serious question, why are you in this subreddit?
Author	Iamflirtingwithyou
Upvotes	2
Comments	18
Date	June 1, 2017 8:09 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/6epepr/serious_question_why_are_you_in_this_subreddit/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/serious-question-why-are-you-in-this-subreddit.1425518 https://theredarchive.com/post/1425518

Comments

[–]Iamflirtingwithyou 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

Personally I'm here to share any advice I can give. I've made some really stupid mistakes. The best thing I ever learned was just be honest. I used to go to a lot of strip clubs. I craved the touch of a woman more than sex. I stopped when I realized most of the girls would tell me I was cute and "why are you here? You really don't have a girlfriend?" Another I liked about strip clubs was I wasn't afraid of saying anything. I loved giving compliments. And I just started speaking that way to women I would meet during the day. They responded the same way. They really liked it. I was hooking up with women very quickly after I started to approach them that way. I figured the worst they could do was say no and I would respect that. I got rejected a lot. But most of the women really liked receiving massages from me. Just a moment ago I asked a woman to meet me in my car so I could kiss her in private. She was shy. She let me squeeze her ass and thighs. Grazing her pussy with my fingers once or twice. She was wearing leggings. She let me massage her scalp and gently pull on her hair. She said no to my request. She said she was afraid we might do more. I asked "like what?" And she said I might finger her. And I just responded honestly that I would really enjoy that. In the end we parted ways but My point is it's really sad that I used to pay women for their company when women want us just as much. I watched a documentary that talked about sugar babies and sugar daddies. One guy said he would never approach a woman he really liked. He felt he needed to pay and that's really not true. Many women would enjoy it. I wish I could have reached through my television screen, shook him with both hands, and told him that.

[–]Aeon199 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]Iamflirtingwithyou 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

First of all, we all want love. We all want affection. Men and women. All people. We're all just people man. We all have feelings. I think you should accept yourself. No matter where you are in your life. Expressing yourself honestly feels amazing and you should do it just because of that. RSD max has some great stuff on YouTube about facing fear when approaching.

Before I was super honest I would talk to random women trying to use pick up techniques and it didn't go far. People can sense what you really want, in a way. If you go out and say "you know what I never approach strangers and it's a scary thing" people will respect that. You might not dive in to going up to the most beautiful women but I'm telling you most of the time the experience will be good. If you see a woman you think is amazing and you tell her that, she might ignore you, she might say she has a boyfriend, but some times she will look right at you and smile a great big smile because you've given her a gift. I don't approach people to get reactions. You're successful if you've made the approach. You're successful if you are able to express yourself honesty. That's how I look at it.

Honesty is one of the most difficult things in the world. That's why most people aren't honest. Look up an article about radical honesty. I forget the name at the moment but if you look it up you should find some good stuff. You can do this.

[–]Aeon199 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]Iamflirtingwithyou 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

So I've read some of your comments on Reddit. In my opinion you think too much. When you try to rationalize why why women could never sleep with you, it forces your brain to only think of reasons why. But that's like sports commentators predicting the outcome of a match or game. Dating is unpredictable. Sexual attraction is not rational. I've known plenty of women who say they prefer tall, athletic, rich men have sex with short, fat, poor men. I know some women who actually prefer short men, fat men, hairy men, bald men, etc. I like skinny women. There are men who prefer fat women. Attraction isn't a choice. You don't choose what you like and women are the same. There is at least one woman out there who wants to fuck you once and never see you again. Or whatever your preference is.

It's like food. Lets say you really like pizza. And you prefer one place to another. You can rationalize why you like papa johns more than dominos but who gives a fuck why you like something. You just do.

Some people hate onions. The reasons don't matter. They just hate onions. But some people really like onions. So if you were an onion, would you waste time arguing with people who hated you or would you spend time with people who love you?

You might meet a woman tomorrow who really wants to fuck you. And yesterday she might have told her friends "I'd never fuck a virgin." Her reasoning might have lead her to the conclusion that she doesn't want a virgin, but her emotions, instincts, or whatever you want to call them might override those reasons.

Why do people do drugs like heroin even though we have plenty of stories of addicts ruining their lives? Why do people eat and drink more than they should? Why do people procrastinate? Why do people complain about things they can easily change? Because people don't act rationally most of the time. Emotions win out reason most of the time.

Why don't you choose to be celibate for the rest of your life? Because you're horny and you want to fuck. Women get horny too. And you can learn to make a woman horny. You can learn to make a woman feel pleasure. You can learn to give a woman orgasms. You can offer women great sex, if you learn. If a woman had a choice between you and another guy identical in appearance to you with exactly the same attitude as you, why should she choose you over your doppleganger? Wouldnt she want to fuck the guy who could offer more in terms of pleasure? I often massage women almost immediately after meeting them. They love it. They ask me if I'm a professional all the time. What if your twin was unbathed and sloppy dressed. And you were clean, smelled great, dressed well, and put effort into your appearance, who do you think she would choose? I told a woman yesterday that I though she was beautiful and she said "you too! I think you're beautiful too!" If the situation were reversed and 2 women wanted to fuck you right now, but you could only choose one, how would you? They were twins. But one smelled good and the other foul. One had poorly kept hair and the other well styled. One had an amazing dress, shoes, jewelry, makeup. The other was wearing sweatpants, and a ketchup stained t-shirt. One woman really wanted to give you an orgasm and the other woman just wanted you to stick your dick in her pussy until she got bored and then kicked you out of her bed.

It's ok just to want sex from a woman. Some women just want to hook up too. Not everyone wants a marriage or a long term relationship. Man or woman. And people might criticize me for wanting sex for the pleasure of it, but I don't see anything morally wrong with being sexual. I don't see anything wrong with men or women who want to one night stands or friends with benefits. I think it's wrong that girls are bullied in high school for being "sluts". I think it's wrong to harass women for any reason at all. If you like papa johns better than dominos, leave dominos alone. Don't call dominos a filthy whore.

Don't believe all women think or feel a certain way based on one persons opinion. Be that a woman's opinion or mans. Every person is different. What if a woman thought "all men like a woman who cooks, enjoys going to baseball games, is a virgin until marriage. Men want a woman who has no career goals and wants to be a stay at home mom"? It's true that there might be some men who feel that way but it would be wrong to assume all men felt that way. If I just want to have sex with a woman I don't care if she cooks, likes sports, is a virgin, has a job.

I want to give you some homework. Please watch the ted talk on rejection. A guy has a fear of rejection so he attempted to get rejected like 100 times. It's remarkable how many times people actually gave him what he asked for. Even when the requests were ridiculous.

Feel free to ask me more questions. I'll end my reply with a story I recently heard about 2 men who see a line for free bagels. The first man says "hey let's go get a bagel, they're free!" The second guy says "but the line is long, I really don't want to wait." The point is, some people only focus on what they want. Some people only focus on the obstacles in their way. Can you guess who got a bagel and who didn't? Who would you rather be? The person who goes after what they want or the person who is too busy focusing on why something can't happen?

If you keep doing what you've always done, you'll get what you've always gotten.

[–]MrJesusAtWork 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Iamflirtingwithyou 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Aeon199 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Thanks man, that is indeed a great reply. I feel I should offer something more since you wrote such a long, hella-cool response. And I wish I had something optimistic, but right now optimism would be dishonest.

As you've seen from my posts, I'm still hung up on the idea of this "meritocracy"... SMV (sexual market value).. the evolutionary psychology stuff which in the end suggests value is quantifiable, and the metrics are more demanding as a guy ages.

Sadly I am past 30 with very little-to-nothing of the value my age group is expected to offer. Of course, in theory, career/income and such shouldn't matter much if I don't care about LTR or having a serious relationship; on the other hand, I think it probably still matters to women since it is kinda a "minimum requirement," a kind of screening process for them, no matter what arrangement they desire (short-term OR serious.) The other one being social proof.. e.g. does this guy have an exciting life?

Anyway, that's what I'm hung up on. I imagine women wouldn't even want to spend one night with a guy who doesn't have those things going for him in his 30s. Of course, I could be wrong. I'd like to be so, but..

But real life.. y'know, it's tough. Real life has shown me time and time again, cynicism reigns supreme; always expect the worst of others, because that's usually what happens. Women are elitists if you want something beyond platonic (screening process.) Not that I have much real life experience with women, if any.

But online dating stuff? I've had plenty of experience, and still haven't met up with even one woman. By and large, it really IS just as bad as I was hoping it wouldn't be. Won't get into it much, but everything frustrated guys complain about with women, it proves it right. I've had women send cut-and-paste messages with requests like, "If you message me back, put your occupation in the subject line" and women who've said "I have a thing for tall guys, and you are how tall?" and women who don't like my skinny arms. On and on it goes. No silver lining.

Why would real life be any different?

[–]Iamflirtingwithyou 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

Real life is VERY different than online dating. Guess what? I have not been successful at online dating. I mean, yes I've gotten dates. Yes I've hooked up with a few but it was much more difficult and time consuming for me than real life. Meeting people in person is much easier for me. i know it's not my bio because one time as an experiment I used someone else's pictures and I got more interest. I encourage you to meet people in person because even if you do succeed and meeting someone from a dating website or app, you'll need to be comfortable talking to women in person. However it's also worth mentioning that pictures matter probably more than anything else. And the truth is I'm too lazy to get great pictures for myself since going up to strangers whenever I go outside of my house is incredibly easy for me and I get instant feedback. Online dating is so frustrating for me because you have to wait. You send a message and you have to wait god knows how long to hear a response. I can hookup with a woman within an hour of meeting her in person. Online I could barely meet a woman within a week of messaging them. And most flake. Plus photos lie. Most of the women I've met have been much less attractive than their photos would suggest. Plus you have more competition online. It's like before you even meet a girl you have to jump through so many hoops. Even if you have great conversations online she can still ghost you or flake on the date.

As far as approaching strangers, i don't recommend venues where there are a ton of drunk men hitting on women. Women who would happily speak to me during the day will flat out ignore me in one of those clubs. Day game is the way to go my friend.

As far as not having a great career or wealth, that's stuff is irrelevant to hooking up. It's important for your life but not for dating. You should be trying to do well for yourself. But trust me, there are deadbeat dads, and unemployed players everywhere. There are men in prison with women waiting for them. Women writing them letters. Female prison guards having sex with them. And these men have no money. They're in prison. Some of them have done horrible things.

I personally hated a guy I knew in high school because he was a loser (in my personal opinion) but always had girlfriends. He cut class. He was not athletic. He was failing his classes. And ended up dropping out. He did drugs. Most people thought he was a loser too. I never heard anyone say anything good about the guy. But he was always fixing his hair. I'd catch him in the bathroom at school looking at his hair in the mirror all the time. It turns out this guy was just very persistent in asking a girl out. Eventually they would say yes. Think about that. While you're busy concerning yourself about all the reasons why you're not good enough, this guy disregards any and all negative thought. He just goes for it. He was unfaithful too. He always cheated on his girlfriends. I hated that jerk.

So when you approach a woman during the day, don't worry about what she might reject you for. Let her worry about that. You be in charge of showing your interest in her. I once had a conversation with a woman and all we talked about was her the whole time. She didn't ask me a single question. She didn't ask how old I was or what I did for work. She didn't care. She cared that I walked straight up to her and told her I thought she was very attractive. She said no one has ever done that before. You see, most guys (including myself in the beginning) want to be clever. They want to "convince" the girl to like us by being cool or whatever. But now all I do is basically say, this is me whether you like it or not. It's simple. It's yes or no. And if she says no (which happens a lot) I just move on. You only need one woman to say yes.

Remember that bagel story I mentioned in another comment? Focus on what you want. Don't quit because getting there is difficult. Most guys don't want to get rejected. But guys who are successful know it's necessary to get rejected sometimes. And the only way for you to learn is to make mistakes. Mistakes = learning. Learning leads to improvement. And the more you improve, the higher your chances of success will be. The only way you'll be successful is to fail again and again. Until you inevitably succeed.

If what you're doing now isn't working, what do you have to lose by trying something different?

I'd rather get rejected within seconds of meeting a woman in real life than waiting days for a response online and chatting for weeks until I get rejected. I had great conversations with about 10 women the last time I went out. 10. I didn't even count all the women who ignored me. I am not counting women who responded but avoided eye contact. I'm counting 10 women who were very happy to speak to me. If I had to guess I must have had at least 10 rejections. But they were quick and painless. I forgot about those women immediately. I immediately moved on if I got rejected or I could tell they didn't really want to talk to me. Experience will teach you how to tell.

Edit: so go out there and approach women in real life. Rejection is not a big deal. Just move on if it happens. And please watch that ted talk on rejection

[–]Aeon199 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I encourage you to meet people in person because even if you do succeed and meeting someone from a dating website or app, you'll need to be comfortable talking to women in person. ...I can hookup with a woman within an hour of meeting her in person. Online I could barely meet a woman within a week of messaging them. And most flake. Plus photos lie. Most of the women I've met have been much less attractive than their photos would suggest. Plus you have more competition online. It's like before you even meet a girl you have to jump through so many hoops. Even if you have great conversations online she can still ghost you or flake on the date.

Where do you suggest an awkward guy go for looking for women who "may" be interested in hooking-up? The standard advice, as you imply, is usually go to bars/clubs. When I've asked women about this, universally almost they say "bars/clubs are the only place you should go, if you just want a hook up.." and they go on to explain "you probably shouldn't approach women in public, they're usually trying to get things done and don't want to be bothered." Night game is of course out. So all I can say is I hope that doesn't prove true, should I decide to try day game. And I don't want to creep them out.

What places do you suggest? One of the most common is "meetups" or whatever but I imagine those things are heavy on group socializing. Not my forte, really. Shrugs.

I personally hated a guy I knew in high school because he was a loser (in my personal opinion) but always had girlfriends. He cut class. He was not athletic. He was failing his classes. And ended up dropping out. He did drugs. Most people thought he was a loser too. I never heard anyone say anything good about the guy. But he was always fixing his hair. I'd catch him in the bathroom at school looking at his hair in the mirror all the time. It turns out this guy was just very persistent in asking a girl out. Eventually they would say yes. Think about that. While you're busy concerning yourself about all the reasons why you're not good enough, this guy disregards any and all negative thought. He just goes for it. He was unfaithful too. He always cheated on his girlfriends. I hated that jerk.

Well, and this may sound cynical, but being an autistic/awkward loser is very different from being a socially capable sociopathic loser. I strongly suspect this guy you speak of is the latter. A lot of girls will give guys like that a "pass" because of the masculine, edgy persona. I tend to think women only give autistic/awkward guys a pass if they demonstrate ambition or have a good career, etc. Otherwise what does an autistic guy offer? He doesn't offer social finesse (unlike the sociopath).. so that value has to come from something else. Anyway, that's my thinking on this. I could be wrong. I'd like to be.

If what you're doing now isn't working, what do you have to lose by trying something different?

Reputation, possibly? I live in a relatively small town. Certainly not rural or anything, but not a city, either. Maybe I'm overthinking this though, and women would not tell other women they know "you know, this thin, weird guy approached me and I didn't like it".. that's another thing that prevents me from acting.

[–]Iamflirtingwithyou 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I used to live in a town that didn't have bars and clubs. I'd have to take a 30-60 minute bus ride to the nearest college town. That place had about a dozen bars within walking distance of each other. After I read "The Game" I'd take a bus, practice taking to girls, then get on the bus back home. Eventually I made friends in that town and I was able to spend the night and take my bus back home in the morning. I recall reading (perhaps in the book "the game") that Mystery used to take a train to the nearest big city to practice his pick up artist stuff. He was thin and weird too.

I think what's important to is for you to use your imagination. Your brain, your thoughts can either keep you where you are or they can help you change. You choose what to think about. Really. Try to imagine sleeping with a woman. How would that happen? What are some ways you would achieve that. What events could lead to that? I'm serious. You hold the answers. For me, I would first think about where the sex could happen. Do you have a house, an apartment, or at least a room to take your lady friend? That's important. One time I matched with a girl on tinder. She agreed to sex but she lived a couple hours drive from me. I happened to be passing though her town so we decided to meet up. The problem was she didn't feel comfortable bringing me to her place so I tried to rent a hotel room. Guess what? All the hotels and motels in her town were booked solid. Every room sold out. It was the middle of the day so when we tried to find a park or someplace private we couldn't. People everywhere. My point is, I chose not to give up. I chose to treat this as a problem I could solve with imagination. Eventually I decided to go see a movie with her. We picked a movie I thought would be empty. Theater was not empty. We ended up making out a lot but no sex. I had to meet some people so I said my goodbyes and was on my way.

Going to bars is not a bad idea if that's all there is near you. Use your imagination. Visualize your success and what leads to it. Be like the guy who ran the mile in less than 4 minutes. Everyone told him it was physically impossible. But he visualized himself doing it. He visualized every pace, every step he took on the track.

And just like being an athlete, the mental part is just one part of the game. You have to go out and practice too. Just practice approaching and talking to people. It's not creepy to do that. It's creepy to stare and not say anything. It's creepy if you get rejected but don't leave her alone. Practice my friend.

[–]Aeon199 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I think what's important to is for you to use your imagination. Your brain, your thoughts can either keep you where you are or they can help you change. You choose what to think about. Really. Try to imagine sleeping with a woman. How would that happen? What are some ways you would achieve that. What events could lead to that? I'm serious. You hold the answers. For me, I would first think about where the sex could happen. Do you have a house, an apartment, or at least a room to take your lady friend?

In a roundabout way, I actually do, in theory, have a place I could take a so-called lady friend. It's not actually "my" place but I do have legal access to the place, and no one lives there. (Keeping details sparse, here, what can I say, I'm wary) But anyway I'm hoping that wouldn't be an obstacle to have a place I could go with them that I don't actually live in, would it be weird? It's like a vacant apartment, but of course around normal, occupied apartments, in a populated area. I hope this doesn't seem creepy.

Going to bars is not a bad idea if that's all there is near you. Use your imagination. Visualize your success and what leads to it. Be like the guy who ran the mile in less than 4 minutes. Everyone told him it was physically impossible. But he visualized himself doing it. He visualized every pace, every step he took on the track.

There are plenty of bars around here but I can't stand such places, busy crowded and not for me.

I mean, you did say day game works, right? Then of course there are any number of places, from stores, malls, parks, walking trails, whatever. But again the concern is if these places are improper to approach women, if they would be more likely to get creeped out, etc. What do you think about it? I know I'm supposed to decide, try things out for myself, but just feel I should ask anyhow.

Sorry to be a nuisance.

[–]Iamflirtingwithyou2 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

If you think something is creepy, then those feelings will transfer to whoever you're with. For example, some people effortlessly touch people they just met. They shake hands, then maybe tap on their elbow or shoulder occasionally during conversation, or they briefly place a hand a woman's leg while making her laugh. Other people stare at their hand as they attempt to place it on the girls shoulder. This draws too much focus and attention to the act of touching. And perhaps he leaves the hand on the shoulder for too long, making her feel uncomfortable. My point is, there is a creepy way to do things, and an acceptable way. An appropriate method, and an inappropriate method. Is it creepy to take a woman to the vacant apartment that you mentioned? It certainly can be depending on how you present it to the woman. It could also be erotic, or even romantic, but its all in how you present it to her.

The way you approach a woman on a walking trail will determine if its appropriate or inappropriate. For example, imagine if you walk up to a woman who is alone and say "I promise i'm not going to rape and murder you." I would be pretty fucking scared if anyone came up to me and said that, wouldn't you? Also, people get pretty freaked out if you follow them or approach them from behind. Definitely don't do that.

In general, if a woman appears to be in a good mood, its safe to approach and say hello. Its important that you also appear to be in a good mood. What does this look like? Generally, a relaxed smile, and relaxed eye contact. Imagine if someone walked up to you with a frown and intense gaze. You could guess that perhaps they were angry at you or wanted to pick a fight. So its important not to approach women or even men in this fashion.

One reason why bars are typically a good place to pick up women is they are usually in the mood to have fun. If you appear to be smiling, happy, having fun, you'll be more likely to interact with like-minded people naturally. Women might even approach you.

A note about rejection. If I approach a woman and say hello, and she ignores me, I move on to someone else. Sometimes when a woman pretends she didn't hear you, means she's not interested. If I say hello and she avoids making eye contact with me, I take it as a rejection too. If she says she has a boyfriend or is married, thats a rejection. Always move on when you are rejected. You can smile and say "ok, I'll leave you alone." Its important to me that a woman feels comfortable, even if she rejects me. Many times a man will get angry and say very mean things to a woman who has rejected him. I feel this is quite rude and unnecessary. Many times, a woman will be polite to man because she is afraid he will become violent, or threaten violence.

I saw a beautiful woman who looked like she just stepped out of a perfume magazine advertisement. She had spilled something on her dress and she was standing in the sunshine trying to dry the spot.

I walked over to her and said "You look gorgeous in that dress." We made eye contact. She had incredible grey eyes. I smiled and said hello. I asked what her name was. I extended my arm and we shook hands. She said "I'm sorry but I have a boyfriend." I said, "Ok, I'll leave you alone." The whole time we looked in each other's eyes. She said, "Is that ok?" I said "of course its ok" as i backed away from her, still looking into her eyes. Why did she apologize? I'm certain it was because she's had experience rejecting men. And when some men get rejected they don't walk away. They either keep trying or they say mean things to the woman. Or worse. So keep that in mind and be respectful when you get rejected.

Another thing I just thought of. Comedy. Humor. Its subjective. Attraction is the same way. You can find a picture, a gif, a video on youtube incredibly funny, but when you show it to someone else, they might not laugh at all. Same with a popularly handsome man or beautiful woman. Not everyone will agree that they are very attractive. So its best not to over think things. My opinion is deterministic. Its either a yes or no. She's made her mind about you before you've even approached her. That's why I don't try to "win over" woman who ignore me or say no. No means no. Sometimes I'm watching a stand up comedian on netflix and I just don't like it. They could be standing in front of me in real life, trying their hardest to make me laugh. I could also be trying my hardest to laugh at their jokes. But sometimes we just don't click. And that's ok. There are plenty of other netflix specials. And in dating, there are plenty of other women. So maybe you'll find someone in your town. Maybe you'll have to leave town to find someone. But she's out there.

[–]AncientVigil 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Iamflirtingwithyou 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Murfdigidy 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]tony18215 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ASAP_JAMS 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link