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Daddies, “Dates,” and the Girlfriend Experience: Welcome to the New Prostitution Economy

DougDante

December 28, 2017
19 upvotes
/r/MensRights
https://www.vanityfair.com/style/2016/07/welcome-to-the-new-prostitution-economy
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Title Daddies, “Dates,” and the Girlfriend Experience: Welcome to the New Prostitution Economy
Author

DougDante

Upvotes 19
Comments 53
Date December 28, 2017 6:02 PM UTC
(8 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/7mo71f/daddies_dates_and_the_girlfriend_experience/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/daddies-dates-and-the-girlfriend-experience.908636
https://theredarchive.com/post/908636
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Comments

[–]Underwater_Karma 16 points17 points18 points 8 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

My wife's niece recently got married to a guy the entire family loves and he dotes on her.

Thing is though, the entire family knows she's spent the last 15 years in a "sugar daddy" relationship with a wealthy, married guy, and the new husband has no idea that his new wife has been selling sex to this guy for over a decade.

Eventually, the new husband is going to wonder how his waitress wife was able to afford a half million dollar house...and when they're suddenly unable to pay the mortgage, how the hell that happened. Or she's going to keep going back to the well for the paycheck she's addicted to.

It's a ticking timebomb to disaster, and everyone is just pretending not to see it.

[–]fengpi 11 points12 points13 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

the entire family knows she's spent the last 15 years in a "sugar daddy" relationship with a wealthy, married guy, and the new husband has no idea that his new wife has been selling sex to this guy for over a decade.

Ahh, family secrets. Whatever you do, don't warn the dude and let him know about the goods he is buying.

And, yes, he definitely is buying those goods.

[–]goalposthead 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Seems like he's not asking the right questions BEFORE getting married.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

He gets half a house he's asking exactly the right questions

[–]Underwater_Karma 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

No doubt..."How can you afford this house" would be #1 on my list.

[–]fengpi 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

(Cute smile and high-pitched feminine voice) "Oh, that's just a little detail that takes care of itself, you know? Besides, I'm sure you'll be willing to roll-up your sleeves and pitch-in your fair share when the bank comes knocking on the door."

[–]fengpi 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Or, then again, maybe he'd be flattered? Sure, she's had two kilometers of cock over the past 15 years but she finally chose to be with him for reasons other than green paper. Now that she's tired of trading her body for cash on the barrelhead, she just wants to settle-down, stop bothering with the green paper and enjoy the more conventionally-accepted practice of trading her body for payment in kind.

[–]Underwater_Karma 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

"she's settling down" is exactly how the family is spinning it...at to an extent it's true.

But nothing is going to change the fact that checks from the sugar daddy are going to stop showing up when the well runs dry, and she's not going to be able to afford the mortgage payments...and eventually the new husband is going to ask "how did you afford it up until now?"

[–]fengpi 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

It's a good thing her new beau is all ready to take-over the challenging job of financing her lifestyle!

Unless you say something to him about that, but why on earth would you help the fellow?

[–]Underwater_Karma 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I have my own life to live, his/hers is a minefield they have to navigate on their own.

[–]fengpi 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Drill your own cavities and grow your own food, do you? Awesome.

[–]ZerefGodslayer 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Meh, if a women only wants me when she is settling down I don't want her. She is basically saying that I wasn't good enough for her in her prime. That's not something I would call flattering.

But if that's not the case it is fine, but never flattering.

[–]fengpi 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

She is basically saying that I wasn't good enough for her in her prime.

......

[–]Lethn 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

In a perfect universe, perhaps, but being the cynical bastard I am I could easily see that being a situation where the woman is using the rich guy to get the money she wants and the other guy is just there as her boy toy, the hottie she can bang whenever the rich guy is out of town.

[–]Dembara 25 points26 points27 points 8 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

“If prostitution is really just physical labor,” says the Canadian feminist writer and prostitution abolitionist, Meghan Murphy, on the phone, “if it’s no different than serving coffee or fixing a car, then why would we see rape as such a traumatic thing? If there’s nothing different about sex, then what’s so bad about rape?”

If serving coffee or fixing a car is just physical labor. Why would we see slavery as such a traumatic thing? If their is nothing different about work, then what's so bad about slavery?

[–]omegaphallic 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

To be fair Meghan Murphy is such an embarrassment to feminism, even other feminists hate her. Her own SO refuses to call herself a feminist.

[–]lifeonlockdown 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Because rape is “stealing sex” kind of in the same way as slavery is “stealing labor”.

You can give away sex or labor as a “gift” or either one can be charged for, but it’s criminal and traumatic when it’s stolen from you.

[–]Dembara 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I make that exact analogy in replying to another commentor. I would say it is better to frame it as consent rather than theft. Someone taking your TV is not an issue, so long as you consent to it (whether you charge them or give it for free). But if they don't have your consent, then it is theft.

[–]fengpi 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Her argument seems to be that rape is horrible, therefore sex must be pretty horrible as well.

Am I incorrect?

[–]Dembara 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

She doesn't make that argument. But I do not see how her logic makes sense without that supposition.

[–]fengpi 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Or maybe she means that if a vagina isn't a special, holy kind of extra-sacrosanct body-part, then rape can't be a particularly bad thing. So since it's very important to not dilute the horribleness of rape even a fraction of a percent, prostitution is... like, super-horrible too because vaginas. But what of blow-jobs? And hand-jobs? Those should be fine because no extra-special vaginas are involved!

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Anal?

[–]DavidByron2 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Slavery is much different from taking some small service by force one time. This would make rape more like robbery. And that's an entirely correct way to look at it I'd say and as such the feminists' position is entirely consistent. If rape isn't special then a woman's vagina isn't special and then the whole game is over.

[–]Dembara 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Yes, the scale is different. My point was the idea. The issue with rape is not a matter of sex, it is a matter of consent. The issue with slavery is not a matter of work but a matter of consent. You can sell sex as work, but that is consensual since you agree to the exchange (you can argue people might be pushed to it by circumstance, and while that's true they make the decision that not making that exchange is worse than making it so taking away the decision would make their lives worse).

I do think rape is by default worse than robbery though. Be it the rape of a man or a woman. Because rape is much more likely to be traumatizing. However, a robbery can be as bad depending on circumstance since it can be similarly damaging and traumatizing.

[–]DavidByron2 -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Your argument makes robbery into slavery.

Robbery is not slavery.

Your argument is false.

rape is much more likely to be traumatizing

Evidence? A rather stupid point anyway unless it's always or nearly always worse which it obviously is not. With any other crime like that we treat it as a worse crime if the violence was worse. The violence (and not the theft or rape) is the issue in these cases.

[–]Dembara 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Your argument makes robbery into slavery.

No it doesn't. It equates the problem with slavery to the problem with slavery. Robbery is taking something without consent. Slavery is labor without consent. In both cases, the problem is they lack consent.

Evidence?

PTSD in rape and sexual assault victims (this research has a few flaws though, but none that should relate to my claim as I can tell). Also here.

A rather stupid point anyway unless it's always or nearly always worse which it obviously is not

My point was it is understandable why we consider rape worse. Because it often is more damaging.

The violence (and not the theft or rape) is the issue in these cases.

I would argue that rape can be worse even if less violent, as it can cause more damage. Though that also is situational and depends on the victim. Statutory rape in particular can be extremely damaging.

[–]DavidByron2 -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

People get PTSD for robbery too.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22833477

I would argue that rape can be worse even if less violent

Do it then. Where's the argument?

as it can cause more damage

You're just saying it is worse because it can be worse. Even if that were true it seems like you'd be better of punishing depending on the damage and not on whether the damage was incidental to a rape rather than a robbery. You're not making any argument as to why a rape is by it's very nature something bad that a robbery is not. The feminist says that women's vaginas are somehow sacred or some fucked up bullshit and that is why rape is bad (of women only naturally).

[–]Dembara 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

People get PTSD for robbery too.

Yes. But less common. THe highest number they could get was 8%. Versus, over a third of rape victims.

Do it then. Where's the argument?

Finish the sentence.

You're just saying it is worse because it can be worse

I said, and I quote: "I would argue that rape can be worse even if less violent"

[–]DavidByron2 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

After a certain point of repeatedly asking people what their argument is, I assume they dont have one.

[–]omegaphallic 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

A violent robbery.

[–]DavidByron2 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

By definition all robbery is violent (or threatening violence). A non-violent robbery as it were would be called simply theft.

If anything it's the word rape that can (under feminist definitions anyway) be done without any violence or threat of violence. For example while the victim is asleep. If you steal someone's stuff when they're asleep it wouldn't rise to the level of robbery. It would be theft.

http://blogs.findlaw.com/blotter/2015/01/whats-the-difference-between-burglary-robbery-and-theft.html

[–]DavidByron2 13 points14 points15 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I’m not slaving away at a minimum-wage job. I reject it when people say I’m oppressed by the patriarchy. People who make seven dollars an hour are oppressed by the patriarchy.”

Simple and obvious. This hooker undermines all the pretense that feminism is socialist. It's the opposite of socialist.

[–]Lethn 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

When the fuck will these women stop deliberately searching for the absolute worse men they can find and then bitch about them on the internet like they represent every man out there.

No, just fuck off, I have zero sympathy for them anymore. Ever since the Harvey Weinstein shit started and we found out the exact background of all these feminists the problem has shown to be entirely with them and the people they choose to hang out with.

The women she's trying to paint as victims are even admitting they've been 'tempted' or they basically straight up say once these guys started offering them money they put up with it.

Her adventures in “sugaring” started three years ago when she got hit on by an older guy and rebuffed him, saying, “Look, I’m not interested, so unless you’re offering to pay my student loans,” and he said, “Well . . . ?” After that, “he paid for stuff. He gave me money to help out with my living expenses.”

She fucking shrugged and just went "Okay!" the moment he offered to pay off her student loans! This is how it fucking starts! These women are deliberately latching onto rich and powerful men to further themselves, it's exactly like Hollywood. How many of the supposed victims literally bent over for Harvey Weinstein on the promise of a successful acting career?

It's this kind of utter bullshit that turns men into the very MTGOW and Red Piller types that feminists despise, these women are fucking doing it to themselves. Why on earth would you want to hang out with dishonest women like this?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Irony is they rake up these student loans paying for gender studies!.

Probably should include a mandatory credit course on real 'gender' studies to help these women with their 'careers'

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Of course they will never admit to their background when they meet a man they want to trap.

[–]ee4m 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Of course thats not actually true, because lots of men could handle it and they would prefer to settle down with someone like that.

Of course some of them are incapable of settling down and honesty, and of course some of them are.

Some of them will fool some stupid guy who they will never respect, and others will be with someone they respect because they can handle them.

[–]ThatNinaGAL -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Presumably the johns also attempt to hide this aspect of themselves from their wives, daughter's, mothers and any other woman who they wish to have a real relationship with.

[–]Fortspucking 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

When they hit 35, many of these same women will go to the other side of the argument, suddenly seeing the "immorality" of it all.

[–]fengpi 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

What seems to irk the author is that the existence of prostitutes has some relation to the misogynistic stereotype that certain women are prostitutes.

Fortunately, progressive-minded people already know that all stereotypes are nothing but entirely fantastic lies made-up out of whole cloth. And that anyone who resembles a stereotype is aping the stereotype rather than being a basis of the stereotype. Seeing as how all stereotypes are, ipso facto, without any basis whatsoever.

And, really, the author acts like it's so mysterious as to why someone would want to pay for sex when everybody knows that women are always on the level in all of their interpersonal relationships and men are surrounded by perfect creatures who are always happy to split every bill 50/50 and would surely never have thought of charging money for sex if men didn't require them to take their filthy man-money. Why, oh why would somebody want to pay for sex? Is it the thrill of control? The joy of power-tripping over enslaving somebody's body? How could it be that there is (gasp) MONEY to be made in the world's oldest profession??

[–]solaceinsleep 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

There is some truth in stereotypes otherwise they wouldn't be stereotypes.

[–]StrongAffordance 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Women don’t actually have morality. The only thing they care about is social status, stigma, and perception. So whatever is “acceptable” is fair game.

[–]ee4m 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

This is just the sort of nonsense that comes out of mgtow and incel echo chambers and extreme feminist echo chambers.

Its got nothing to do with us.

[–]StrongAffordance 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Just because you don’t like it doesn’t mean it’s wrong. Ideologies and views of the world aren’t mutually exclusive.

[–]ee4m 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I agree with that logic.

You are still wrong, Ive had plenty of relationships. Don't see any truth in your generalizations that where born in echo chambers in which people don't have a whole lot of contact with women, or judge all women by the one cunt that fucked them up.

These tend to be right leaning echochambers, so are more prone to less rational and ideological thinking.

[–]goodbeertimes 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

You are still wrong

You don't understand how right and wrong work.

Something that is right and can be agreed up on EVERYONE can actually be tested in a laboratory and be reproduced consistently. These can be called as natural laws.

Human behavior DOES NOT come under ambit of natural laws as we know it today; it may be we will have it tomorrow with advancement in behavioral stochastic models. Even when we have it, it will be probabilistic model which still WILL NOT come under ambit of natural laws.

For these we have experiences, anecdotes, personal experiences and experiences of people that we know (in real life) and few generalizations that we make to understand our lives. That means, you say it is wrong means nothing for my life.

So, I will paraphrase the poster

Women don’t actually have morality. The only thing they care about is social status, stigma, and perception. So whatever is “acceptable” is fair game.

I agree with him and double down on it. And yes, I call myself a MGTOW. You may have problems with it.

[–]ee4m 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Kids are born with innate morality.

You are just another conservative following a fundamentalist religion.

[–]goodbeertimes 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

K

[–]StrongAffordance 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I’ve also had plenty of relationships and contact with women, that doesn’t make the truth any less true.

Edit: I mean we are commenting on an article that basically says the same thing to be honest. They don’t like the word prostitute but still do the actions because there’s reduced stigma.

[–]ee4m 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Dont believe ya some how.

Unless you are one of those people that people with personality disorders prey on.

Ive been preyed on by one of those, sent me all anti women for a a while.

[+]Do1t4DaleJ1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

You can hang out at 2schromosomes if you dont want the truth

[–]ee4m 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Im waiting for my gf to get in from work to hang out with her.

[–]fengpi 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

prostitution abolitionist

LOL, that's a bit dramatic.

[–]ThatNinaGAL 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I tend to see these kinds of trends as the social equivalent of a pool vacuum. Suck up the scum (pros and johns alike) and let everybody else fish out of cleaner water.

Prostitition is neither feminist nor antifeminist. It's neither misogynistic nor misandric. It's generally distasteful to people not inclined towards the lifestyle, and particularly distasteful to people who are interested in marriage and family. So let SeekingArrangenent continue to vacuum the dating pool. Who cares?

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