[Traditional ethics] favors “male” ways of moral reasoning that emphasize rules, rights, universality, and impartiality... (discussion on feminist ethics)

ignatiusloyola · 2012-06-08T11:34:43+00:00

Pay close attention to the implications that the "traditional ethics" fail women, and are therefore bad. Also pay close attention to how things like "universality" and "impartiality" are included in that.

a_weed_wizard · 2012-06-08T13:27:08+00:00

So feminist "ethics" are basically self-serving emotive rationalizing garbage that has nothing to do with fairness or any sense of justice. If it feels good or benefits you, do it! That is the essence of feminist "ethics." "Feminist ethics" sound like they'd lead to a world like Mad Max.

sixofthebest · 2012-06-08T18:55:09+00:00

Care ethics is not new or unique to feminist ethics. It is not particularly a 'feminine' way of thinking. Confucianism is a form of care ethics and most Confucians were men.

I don't think what the author referred to as traditional ethics means what you think it is. Ethical theories like Deontological ethics and consequentialism are typically considered traditional ethics and while they do emphasize rules and universality and all that it does not mean that these theories are flawless. e.g. Kant famously claimed that lying is always wrong no matter the situation which can lead to ridiculous conclusions. It is not clear that the author argued against the concept of universality on the principle ground but rather pointed out that they are the more distinctive features of traditional ethics. I do agree that the claim "traditional ethics discriminates women" is bogus but I also agree that philosophers in the past didn't have many nice things to say about women.

2012-06-08T14:05:46+00:00

Among others, feminist philosopher Alison Jaggar faults traditional ethics for letting women down in five related ways.

First, it shows less concern for women's as opposed to men's issues and interests.

As traditional ethics was written by men with male audiences in mind, this is probably true.

Second, traditional ethics views as trivial the moral issues that arise in the so-called private world, the realm in which women do housework and take care of children, the infirm, and the elderly.

Also probably true.

Third, it implies that, in general, women are not as morally mature or deep as men.

It is debatable whether these things are universally implied in traditional ethics. If they are, they are claims to be argued on their merits, not perfunctorily dismissed because they do not adhere to feminist doctrine.

Fourth, traditional ethics overrates culturally masculine traits like “independence, autonomy, intellect, will, wariness, hierarchy, domination, culture, transcendence, product, asceticism, war, and death,” while it underrates culturally feminine traits like “interdependence, community, connection, sharing, emotion, body, trust, absence of hierarchy, nature, immanence, process, joy, peace, and life.”

These so-called "culturally feminine" traits happen are things that have been written about at great length by many male authors, poets and philosophers. This is a blatant appropriation to the feminine of those attributes the author thinks are desirable.

Fifth, and finally, it favors “male” ways of moral reasoning that emphasize rules, rights, universality, and impartiality over “female” ways of moral reasoning that emphasize relationships, responsibilities, particularity, and partiality (Jaggar, “Feminist Ethics,” 1992).

The feminist critique that "logic is a tool of the patriarchy" is in fact a true statement. The patriarchy - i.e. all of civilization as we know it - is built on these principles, for they are the foundation of success. It is no accident that all non-patriarchal societies are small, isolated and poor.

Malkor · 2012-06-08T13:48:14+00:00

This distinctive moral voice, says Gilligan, speaks a language of care that emphasizes relationships and responsibilities. Seemingly, this language is largely unintelligible to Kohlbergian researchers who speak the dominant moral language of traditional ethics—namely, a language of justice that stresses rights and rules.

I don't think that the point is that 'traditional ethics' are bad, but that they don't address some of the things that women are concerned with.

Women are taught to live for others; to always give and never take; to submit, yield and obey; to be long-suffering. They are also taught to demur to men because they are not as smart and strong as men. (J.S. Mill, The Subjection of Women, 1970).

That should be 1870? Mill's point doesn't hold as much water now than it did 200 years ago, women have made strides that I'm sure he couldn't even imagine back then. But if the experiences and responsibilities of women have (and maybe still are) different, then the ethics that they have that would address them would be different from a man's.

Lines are blurring now, and there are men who do now what women traditionally did then. Those ethics would apply to them too. But since no one as hashed them out supposedly, I guess its up to someone, anyone to do it...

pocketknifeMT · 2012-06-10T15:00:18+00:00

equal application of logic doesn't fit the "rules for thee, but not for me" mentality. No surprise why they need to invent a rationale for themselves.

Title	[Traditional ethics] favors “male” ways of moral reasoning that emphasize rules, rights, universality, and impartiality... (discussion on feminist ethics)
Author	ignatiusloyola
Upvotes	4
Comments	9
Date	June 8, 2012 11:34 AM UTC (14 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/urfgl/traditional_ethics_favors_male_ways_of_moral/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/traditional-ethics-favors-male-ways-of-moral.1020192 https://theredarchive.com/post/1020192

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