Come up with a plan...

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September 17, 2018

I haven't posted for a little while, been head down stfu'ing, training, reading, and more importantly now.. planning.

I've received helpful feedback, bitchslaps, sage advice in response to my previous posts.

I'm about 6 months into MRP, first couple of months was just pure autistic fucking up and reading, and re-reading, then more autism. Sometimes this shit seems like rocket science to me, sometimes so fucking simple.

I've described previously how, I'm married w/ a wonderful young child. My wife isn't like many of you guys basically well-rounded but lacking in the bedroom. I fucked up totally and picked a low quality partner to marry and i've been working on a way to get out of this without getting totally fucked over.

As a recap, she's refused to go back to work for 2.5 years now, and at the same time refuses to look after our child full time, who has been in nursery nearly full time for a year now next month. She's not a good egg.

I stuck to 5x5 SL over the summer for 15 weeks and made some strength gains. However I strained my shoulder and after taking some advice have switched to Greyskull LP which i've modified for more hypertrophy. I've also started MMA twice a week and it's amazing. Been a beta pussy forever, and all of a sudden, even just working towards my first belt I feel more confident.

I earn decent money, but that's not the problem, without my wife and I working as a team, and with her refusing no matter what to be led. I have decided the following plan.

  • The house is going on the market this month
  • We aim to sell before Jan / ASAP
  • We both move back to our respective parents and share custody of our child in the interim
  • I pay off all the debts we have accrued due to her not returning to work and contributing to the property we bought on the basis of us working as a team
  • The leftovers are put into high-interest investment vehicles whilst we save up
  • Early next year, post Brexit we observe which way the market goes and then it comes crunch time
  • She must choose, fall in line with my plans, trust me as Captain that will guarantee our success and security as a family for the next 20+ years, or she can go it alone and we split up
  • If we split, we would have already ditched the only matrimonial asset we had. And also during this interim period, reduced my work so that I can get my income down and time with child up.

I'm 90% sure that during this time apart, I will be happier apart. Then I move forward with the 'let's be friends and not give all our cash to the lawyers' talk. The 10% reservation I have is that through this action plan, it might blow up her fixed view that I will forever be her betabux...because I won't anymore.

Basically... i've spent a lot of time considering, if I was single... what would I do? The answer is move to a cheaper area with good schools and easy commuting. Buy a property 50% cheaper, and start throwing all allowable tax free savings into investment. All this would free me up for taking bigger risks business wise too. So if she's not down with that, and i've made all the calculations based on my own earning potential as that's the only thing I can count on... she has to decide, if I don't first.

We've been together for 4.5 years, child for 2, we were IM friends for about 4 years before and she totally sussed out I would be a sweet betabux and i'm pretty certain that a) I will always be that to her, and b) it would require an amount of effort fair beyond the value of it to pull her mutinous, bitchy, lazy ass along with me.

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Title Come up with a plan...
Author raywinstonsaysyouwot
Upvotes 7
Comments 12
Date 17 September 2018 02:42 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit askMRP
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[–]Rian_StoneMod / Red Beret7 points8 points  (2 children) | Copy

deleted What is this?

[–]raywinstonsaysyouwot[S] 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

I hear you, the advice I received from my lawyer in April was she really needs to go back to work before contemplating divorce, but she's still unemployed. It's not that she's refusing to work, but she's filtered her job search in such an obsessional manner, she will only apply for jobs she likely won't get and puts an inordinate amount of time into it.

Instead of seeing it as a numbers game. So she has had 3 interviews this year, reckons she's spendning 40 hours a week hunting for jobs, but she's not operating effectively and refuses to accept any help from me when regularly offered.

I bought the house in a rushed decision making process when she fell pregnant.. it was on the basis she would go back to work in a reasonable time frame. Because she hasn't it's nearly led to my financial ruin paying for it and all the money earlier this year in medical bills for private therapy which she got turned away from for not being treatable.

Everything i've seen is, it is virtually impossible to demonstrate she's a useless mother. So slowly extricating myself from the situ is best, so that if she goes weaponised on the SAHM route (which i don't think she will, but never know) I'll of reduced earnings and structured myself so there is less to be raped for.

[–]wkndatbernardus0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I would step back from the D front until she gets a job and has a couple working months under her belt. Then strike with the D filing. If you try to D before that, she can just continue being a lazy POS untill her daughter turns 18+, on your dime.

Source: happened to me and I've been paying CS since my kid was 3 (now 13). Ex still has minimal employment and lives rent free with her BF.

[–]helaughsinhidden3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Ah yes, I remember you. It's a good plan you have here, but I think she is going to probably get super pissed and turn on you once she realizes you don't want to be the betabux anymore.

Couple questions.

  • How is your frame, seriously?
    This seemed to be the elephant in the room as she didn't really respect anything you were saying and treating your authority as if you simply aren't important. Divorce with kids involved doesn't mean the end of disrespect or shit tests, how are doing with regards to passing them?
  • What have you realistically done to try to assert your leadership?
    This is still going to be a key factor in your relationship and to raise a child up properly. Kid need fathers to be alpha even more than the women do. This will become more difficult from a different house from a woman you have rejected.
  • Are you still looking at your family like a small business that has to watch pennies?
    I recall you had a disobedience issue with your daughter and were explaining the cost and waste of tearing up a book. Teaching a child to listen and obey hasn't anything to do with petty things like the cost of a book, but everything to do with teaching them how to be responsible, respectful, well adjusted, and to understand social hierarchy. Much of your complaints of the wife are about expenses too. Why are you so petty and superficial? Why are you down playing the importance of a male leader? Are you avoiding it or do you not believe it yourself?
  • Why haven't you asserted dominance in the childcare vs get a job front?
    Forgive me for making light here, but this seems easy. I will concede that you can't make her work, but you could certainly call up the nursery and cancel services and announce to her that she will now handle those responsibilities on her own. If you are afraid of her now (you clearly ARE), what makes you think this will change if you move out? You don't think she KNOWS you are afraid?
  • Are you ready for her to switch gears?
    "Hell hath no fury like a woman scorn" You don't have frame yet, you don't seem to have attempted to lead, your boundaries are shit and not followed, and you want to sneak list the house and sell her betabux castle from under her feet, send her to her parents, then divorce, cancel the nursery, and you somehow think she's gonna just take this like you are still friends? She will try to upend everything and rightfully so. You have shown very little to imply you are anything but a cowardly pushover that dreams of knowing who he is outside of her frame.

You gotta start owning your shit now. This plan you got probably sounded good in your head and would work for a lot of people in a lot of circumstances, but unless I am missing some really big events in your absence, I don't think you are that guy and your wife isn't going to be that woman. Not yet anyway.

[–]ChadwickChadington3 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy

Is getting her to increase her contribution your preferred outcome, and you'd divorce if a good effort fails? Or is setting up for divorce your preferred outcome and you'd only reconsider if she surprises you?

In either case, you've only been turning things around for 6 months, so you may not yet be wise enough to evaluate precisely your a and b conclusion that you'll always be a 'betabux to her and that it would require an amount of effort fair beyond the value of it to pull her mutinous, bitchy, lazy ass along with me'.

Maybe you're right, or maybe with more work on yourself, leadership skills and advice from the forum it wouldn't be so much effort. But if that's not even your goal, then there's no point discussing it.

Your post is a bit confusing on what you're trying to achieve. You go from saying you're 90% sure you'd be happier apart, then you'd give a let's be friends talk followed by the problem maybe she'd realize you won't betabux for her; then you start the next paragraph with "if I was single" followed by "she has to decide", what's she deciding about if you're now single at this part of the plan?

[–]raywinstonsaysyouwot[S] 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Sweet username!

Umm, preferred outcome is re-structuring myself so i'm less leveraged on the property as it's risky right now in UK, and so that we are no longer tied to it and the danger of having to pay for it for her to live in is reduced as I can't afford it without dual income. And then get myself into a position where my income is going towards financial independence planning for the future.

Whether we stay together or not, i'm not sure I have a bias either way.. I have low expectations of her as a person and if she indicated she would align with what I want to do, i'd continue, and if she doesn't I'd be in a safer position as the house would be gone and i'd of temporarily manipulated my earnings down too. I think this is outcome independence in practice for me?

[–]ChadwickChadington2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

If your primary concern at the moment is financial then I suggest you focus on that, which you seem to already have a good plan for.

For the rest, since you're wife doesn't seem to be bringing your life down, she's just passive and doesn't want to work, it's possible you're more angry with the social expectations than with your wife herself. A big part of MRP is accepting that the social expectations are one sided: the man is held to a much higher standard in terms of career, romance, sexual satisfaction and decision making and expected to do as much parenting and house work (that's what society considers a "normal" relationship; women can have a career, can do romance, can participate in decision making, but it's opt-in; the moment she doesn't feel like it there's zero social pressure to do otherwise).

The "let's have an easy life TRP" approach is to avoid LTR and certainly marriage at all cost precisely because over the long haul these social expectations cannot be overcome, so why try.

The MRP approach is "why not meet this ridiculously high standard" since having a great career, being charming man, incredible at sex, make and execute long terms plans that contribute to loved ones and society, be an amazing parent and be able to cook and know how to turn on a washing machine; all these things are good attributes to have so why not achieve them.

The other part of MRP is how to gain all these attributes without being a slave.

My point is that if your issue is with the social expectations, discovering that your wife can behave this way and no one cares (whereas if you decided to just not work and not even stay at home dad it would be instantly to the curve with your useless ass), then it's not going to change by changing your women, you'll have the same frustration with any women (nearly every women falls back to these social expectations over the long term, because it's way easier, so why not). If you want to be a dad with a good family for your kids (the only reason to get married) then it's possible your completely passive wife is ok and things can be improved. Your wife might be dumb, but dumb mixed with loyalty can be a good asset. Your wife might be passive, but passive mixed with deferring all the important decisions to you can be very convenient. Look through the stories on here, it can be many times worse. 90% sure you'll be happy single seems like a low threshold based on the problems men bring here (many are 100% totally sure, but kids, divorce, common history, liking the married life as-such etc.).

For instance, if she can just stay at her parents, then consider renting a small office/apartment that's not big enough for a family to live in but where you can work and after a great romantic time a place you can go for sex (presumably with your wife). With less outlays, you can reduce your workload to be more with you kids. If she's lazy, let her parents subsidize her lifestyle and if her parents bring it up just say "yeah, jeez, finances are tight, economy uncertain, would really love for for our family to be a two-income to afford a house again, but you know jeeper-jeepers she's just not quite ready and I don't want to push her, we all have our own rhythm right." Let her parents deal with the zero social expectations your wife does anything, and simply insist any other arrangement is financially impossible: they say get a house, you say "two-income".

(Edit: for this last option to work you have to be the best husband and best parent you can be; with money saved going on great vacations etc. that you're wife and kids are totally happy with the arrangement, which will confuse any attempt of her parents to change the situation)

[–]The_LitzRed Beret4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

Your plan is slightly confusing.

Are you hoping the separation will wake her up to the good thing she is messing up? Covert contract.

Or is it a baby step for you to get to your goal of being single?

Your plan for living your life as a single person and a single income sounds good, but I am unsure how she fits in.

Am I understanding that you want to leave the backdoor open for her tontag along even though she adds little value?

[–]raywinstonsaysyouwot[S] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's been a few months to get to this and I think I agree... the confusion is what I thought might be the outcome independence.

Good shout on the covert contract, I need to reflect on this as I don't feel as thought i'm doing this in the hope that she gets a point so to speak. I just don't ever think in certainties and in the small eventuality where she gets out of the dingy and grabs hold of the main mast on the deck then that's ok too.

[–]lionmenden2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

I know you're working hard, and your plan makes sense to you, but this is a fucking mess. Your decision to stay married or divorce is predicated on Brexit. You are expecting her to turn 180* in 6 months out of a 4 year marriage. Your plan is logical, but your wife is not. Your plan is long term, but you need short term goals and measures.

First, have you fixed yourself? Can you go to a pub and get a girl to go home with you in an hour? Would you tell said girl to knock it off if she started acting like a bitch, or would you put up with her behavior like you do your wife? Are your wife's friends jealous of her for having you as a husband? If the answer to these is no, you're not ready to throw ultimatums or even make a decision on whether your wife is leadable and good wife material, because you are not ready to lead.

it would require an amount of effort

This is your problem. You realize it will take effort. It's easier to divorce her. Guess what, next girl, same issues, because you haven't fixed yourself.

bitchy, lazy ass

You not only allowed this, you enabled it by letting her not work, not take care of her kid, and still have a bed to sleep in. You need to fix whatever part of you is afraid to tell her to cut this shit.

Once you do that... once you do that, and you know you can replace her, and she knows you can replace her, and her friends hint that they're surprised you haven't replaced her, and you've given her time to accept and process that and make corrections in her behavior....

You fix house, kid, and wife by saying:

"I make the money, I will make and be responsible for the financial decisions. We are selling this house and buying something cheaper in a better school district." End, no justification required.

"My kid will not be raised by daycare. I have cancelled it. From now on you're a stay at home mom." Or maybe you prefer she work, this is personal preference. But she either gets a job or takes care of the kid. "Don't like it? If you want to leave, you know where the door is."

Talk to a lawyer, I don't know the laws in your country, but they will help you with logistics. Improve yourself. You should see her very slowly improve. It will be frustratingly slow. If you improve to the point you can replace her and she refuses to improve at all, skip the ultimatums and do what your lawyer says, because she's a lost cause. If she improves even 10% of what you want, keep going. When you hit the point you know you can say the words "if you want to leave, then leave" then go for it, or just hit the lawyer and divorce her. You're 2 years away, by my totally uninformed guess. Good luck.

[–]MrChad_ThundercockBig Red Machine1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You do sound like a good catch for someone looking for a “sweet betabux”. I think you’re right- she will always see you as such.

Good progress. Glad to see you finally owning your shit.

[–]RedPill-BlackLotusRed Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

You never really know the woman you married untill you divorce her.

Your plan sounds solid. Your 100% sure this plan will move you closer to where you want to be? Most of the time men here (new men) play the divorce card in a failed attempt to hurt their wives because their words have zero effect while in their wives frame. You have only been at this for 6 months, you are not one of these guys right?

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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