Without Income Tax and Property Tax... How would we pay for roads?

wildfireboat · 2018-11-15T14:14:26+00:00

Like everything else - private businesses would build and maintain them for profit.

DWShimoda · 2018-11-15T15:31:11+00:00

First of alll, NEITHER income NOR property taxes pay for "roads."

In nearly all states the major "tax" that pays for roads is either "tolls" and/or gasoline/diesel fuel & vehicle taxes.

Property taxes are basically a virtual direct transfer of money from citizens to school teachers & administrators (the BIGGEST expense of any so called "schooling" system is the salaries, pensions, and other "benefits"; the cost of the buildings & etc is trivial in comparison).

Income (and sales) taxes... fund nearly all of the rest of the "bullshit" (including all of the welfare nonsense -- effectively taking money from productive citizens and handing it to non-productive ones -- in net end effect taxing MEN and paying WOMEN).

Next... Go learn some history: like HOW the US federal & various state governments managed to fund themselves BEFORE property & income & sales taxes?

Those "direct" taxes are ALL 20th century things.

Note: federal income taxes only began in 1914; property taxes didn't kick in until the 1930's; and most state sales taxes didn't get put in place until well after WWII.

So how did they fund the "necessary" expenses of government for the first 100+ years??? (Including BTW building all of the fancy arsed "iconic" capitol buildings.)

The answers are below your subsequent question:

Are there other sources of revenue for a government without having to take it from some citizens?

Ever hear of "Seigniorage"? i.e. some would call it a tax, but it's basically is a fee for "minting" coinage.

Or when it comes to roads & bridges, canals, etc... ever hear of TOLLS? (Like in a "tollway" instead of a "freeway") Similar to annual License plate fees, "right of use" stickers COULD be required for every vehicle in the state, based on weight/axles, etc. (And sold right at main highway borders of states -- or indeed much like lottery tickets {and often hunting licenses, etc} at various private gas stations & markets, etc.) Point of fact most states already HAVE this kind of thing for TRUCKS; and they could implement it for cars anytime they wanted (some have). Yes these are "taxes"; but they are essentially "use fees" -- and are more or less voluntary.

Then of course there are "tariffs" on imported goods... which are generally "luxuries" -- this has the added benefit of encouraging DOMESTIC production of goods, as well promoting a "buy your own country's products" (and thus provide JOBS for your fellow citizens) mentality. (And yes I know you were almost certainly taught {incessantly} the "Free Trade" [sic] mantras that "tariffs = BAAAAD/EVIL" but other "taxes = GOOOOD" ... that's called NPC programming, those are BARE dogmatic assertions/claims: they're also FALSE.)

Nearly ALL of those either HAVE been used, or even are STILL being used... at (significantly) varying "rates/prices" over time.

There are actually a host of other things that HAVEN'T, but easily COULD easily be implemented:

Per example a "contract registration fee"* -- a business (especially some "corporation" entity) that decides it MAY WANT to use a state court system to "sue" could readily be required to FILE & register a copy of any/all signed contracts and PAY A FEE (or purchase a "blanket" one in a manner similar to how software companies sell volume/site licenses for software), and the cost could be a very progressive one based on word count; that is price goes UP on a per word basis as the contract gets bigger/longer. (BENEFIT to customers, whether other businesses OR private individuals: much, MUCH simpler & more straightforward contracts -- no more of that 50 pages of "tiny text" bullshit with the hidden "gotcha" clauses... it'd be too damned expensive.)

Again yes that would be akin to a "tax" -- but it would really be another "usage fee" -- and entirely VOLUNTARY. That is you company would not HAVE to file/register, it would simply suffer the consequences of NOT being able to use the state courts as an "enforcement" system (which they presently get to do as a sort of "free rider" to the detriment of everyone else).

* Nowhere near as "odd" as one might think: note that all sales/purchases and/or "title changes" to "real estate" generally have various filing requirements and "fees" (usually some % of the price) that have to be paid, typically to the local county and/or city clerk. These are essentially a "private business contract fee/tax."

801735 · 2018-11-15T14:01:21+00:00

road maintenance

Road maintenance?

how would a State government afford the National Guard without these revenue sources?

How do the firefighters get volunteers? Serious question. By being something worthwhile volunteering for.

Just print papers and hand them out, kinda like they do now, actually. That 'Ramsfeld' guy (lazy today, won't check names) talked about 2 trillion buck$ 'missing'/untracked from some military/defense budget around 11th Sept event, no? Where did that money go/come from? Who lost track? What has been done about it so far? How much has been unmissed/retracked? Look at that window over there, I think there's a sni

ZeroTrust · 2018-11-15T14:20:20+00:00

Commercial taxes (import/export duties, transaction taxes), use taxes (road tolls), royalties (like from mines) and rents. Income tax is relatively new concept when it comes to tax.

The real problem isn't how you pay for roads, it's how you pay for a large standing military and social welfare (unemployment, education, health, etc), assuming you want such things.

nonchalantfool · 2018-11-15T14:42:40+00:00

Highway toll

RunawayGrain · 2018-11-15T14:51:24+00:00

Income taxes were only instituted around World War I in the U.S. Before that the government was mostly funded via import taxes, taxes on property sales, and excises on things like alcohol. Turns out they could do that because they weren't sitting on a vast welfare state or a shit ton of agricultural subsidy programs to pay for.

jamocadyn · 2018-11-15T18:41:09+00:00

funny how before the income tax was implemented in Canada and the USA (around the same time period -- USA 1913/Canada 1917) roads, ports, schools, universities, hospitals, railroads all existed. Don't ever let the government tell you how income tax is required to ensure all these things exist.

DarthSchadenfreude · 2018-11-15T15:04:52+00:00

A larger gasoline tax... since it taxes the people doing the driving. If you are doing more driving, you are burning more gas and doing more wear and tear on the roads.

eduardkoopman · 2018-11-15T14:20:57+00:00

Probably only a small percentage of the tax revenue goes to these necesairy things.
The mayority probably goes to welfare related items.

2018-11-15T14:47:57+00:00

Road maintence? Hahah have you ever been in Rio de Janeiro? Lol

It works the same in any country, man. Less income forces the State to set priorities like disabled people support, roads and security, Hospitals, etc.

When the State has too much money it starts to create welfare state BS. And guess who the welfare state doesn't care about? Yeah the asshole who pays the cash to support it...

hellrete · 2018-11-15T14:53:39+00:00

You vote. You choose bigger taxes.

Taxation without representation and all that.

lonewolfsigma8917 · 2018-11-15T16:36:45+00:00

This should be re-directed to Ask Wahmen 😞😞😞

yohoho1776 · 2018-11-15T14:09:54+00:00

Have a sales tax on fuel so the more road you use the more you pay. So only owners of vehicles would pay for roads.

NietzscheExplosion · 2018-11-15T14:10:32+00:00

How did we get along before income tax.... yea do that.

Property tax I Have no problem with.

MXRNate77 · 2018-11-15T14:19:40+00:00

This is where legalizing cannabis comes in. Legal recreational states are making tax revenue hand over fist. Even in a bad economy it will still generate funds.

2018-11-15T15:47:35+00:00

The argument is sound. We trade part of our income and in exchange we get things like roads and first responders.

What has gone disastrously wrong is that government began offering more and more "services" and established and ever-growing bureaucracy to manage it. Now the management costs more than the service, we have spiraled into massive deficit spending, and the government is consuming more and more of our income.

Governments used to also collect by taxing imports, but in free trade eras, that idea isn't so popular.

ThePlague · 2018-11-15T16:39:28+00:00

Gas tax for roads or, in the event of electric, per mile tax. That's the fairest way to pay for roads, as it is wholly proportional to use.

Any other state function could be paid for via the sales tax. Again, proportional to use of the predominant function of government, making a safe environment for commerce.

CeleritySteam · 2018-11-15T21:20:55+00:00

Last I checked roads are maintained through sales tax. Income tax mostly subsidizes single mothers, property tax mostly subsidizes schools (so single mothers again, before or after sudden yet inevitable divorce rape).

Is that wrong?

GamingYourMom · 2018-11-15T22:19:25+00:00

The roada suck shit in my city. Make them privately owned. Just pay a toll.

CiceroVoltaire · 2018-11-15T23:13:29+00:00

see how the USA did it before 1913 and the addition of the 16th amendment.

The Federal government is doing more than it should and not enough of what it was supposed to do (see the Federalist Papers).

We can't / won't go back; it's too late. The crash, burn and end is inevitable. See Glubb's essay "Fate of Empires".

IMO

theoracleofosiris · 2018-11-15T23:20:41+00:00

We need income and property taxes! Just not from me lol

MethaCat · 2018-11-16T00:44:11+00:00

A single car even with 4 people in it, won't impact a road as much as a trailer loaded to the limit.

It would only be fair to have companies that use those those roads pay the most for using them, which in turn would have to be paid by the final customers, making it so that the further you have to drive to deliver the goods the more you have to pay, as it should be, so we either consume locally or learn to live with the over price until we figure out a way of doing it more efficiently or find an alternative.

sidel3 · 2018-11-16T11:18:26+00:00

If you are around when this whole shit show collapse on its self, you'll find out how.

Without Income Tax and Property Tax... How would we pay for roads?

Comments

First of alll, NEITHER income NOR property taxes pay for "roads."

Nearly ALL of those either HAVE been used, or even are STILL being used... at (significantly) varying "rates/prices" over time.

LOL, not really.

Title	Without Income Tax and Property Tax... How would we pay for roads?
Author	wildfireboat
Upvotes	26
Comments	44
Date	November 15, 2018 1:58 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MGTOW
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comments/9xbe1f/without_income_tax_and_property_tax_how_would_we/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MGTOW/without-income-tax-and-property-tax-how-would-we.458883 https://theredarchive.com/post/458883