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Congresswoman compares an attempt to engage in political debate to sexual harrassment [I don't have a dog in this fight, I don't support democrats or republicans, and I'm not a fan of Ben Shapiro, but I object to the transparent attempt to treat political debate as criminal abuse]

[deleted]

August 10, 2018
38 upvotes
/r/MensRights
https://archive.is/oC2RA
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Title Congresswoman compares an attempt to engage in political debate to sexual harrassment [I don't have a dog in this fight, I don't support democrats or republicans, and I'm not a fan of Ben Shapiro, but I object to the transparent attempt to treat political debate as criminal abuse]
Author

[deleted]

Upvotes 38
Comments 29
Date August 10, 2018 9:51 PM UTC
(7 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/96b7hr/congresswoman_compares_an_attempt_to_engage_in/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/congresswoman-compares-an-attempt-to-engage-in.896383
https://theredarchive.com/post/896383
Red Pill terms in post
feminism

Comments

[–]mwobuddy 6 points7 points8 points 7 years ago* (10 children) | Copy Link

since when is sexual harassment criminal abuse?

She’s campaigned on several major progressive promises, including “Medicare for all” and the abolishment of U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement.

Holy shit. She wants literal open borders, no need for checks.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 7 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link

Well, the internet tells me that "In 1980 the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) issued regulations defining sexual harassment and stating it was a form of sex discrimination prohibited by the Civil Rights Act of 1964."

Catcalling may or may not fall under that heading, but given the #metoo climate, and the fact that numerous European countries are in the process of passing very specific laws outlawing catcalling, the intention behind her words seems pretty clear. EG: "Any man who disagrees with me and tries to talk to me about it is sexually harrassing me". That's a pretty unhelpful attitude for a "public servant".

[–]mwobuddy 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

That pertains to workplace, catcalling is street.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 7 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

The point is not that she's actually reporting him to the police. She doesn't need to, the public accusation itself is enough. As Shapiro himself noted, "slandering someone as a sexist catcaller without reason or evidence does demonstrate cowardice and bad intent." But anyway, since she's responding in her capacity as a member of congress, this does pertain to the workplace.

[–]mwobuddy 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

She's not really calling him a catcaller, though. She's saying its equivalent by continuing to persist.

She's piggybacking on the #metoo wave to try to shame him into silence, which is disgusting, but she's not really calling him a catcaller. Just a "patriarchal man perstering women because he thinks hes entitled to their time".

Which basically tells you how many squirrels are running in her head (all the squirrels).

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 7 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Quoting directly from the article: "Just like catcalling, I don’t owe a response to unsolicited requests from men with bad intentions. And also like catcalling, for some reason they feel entitled to one."

[–]mwobuddy 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Exactly, she wasn't saying he was catcalling.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I believe this is what's called a distinction without a difference.

[–]TheMythof_Feminism 4 points5 points6 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Holy shit. She wants literal open borders

I am from/in Mexico, I can tell you that with our president, AMLO, a socialist (Read: Communist), if you go with open borders, your nation will collapse near-instantly rather than gradually as people have projected.

Those of us in Mexico that are hard working and honest do NOT want you to do the open borders thing. It would literally make no difference because the vast majority of citizenry has access to a password and visa. It's only the criminals and people with high flight risk that don't.

What a lot of people in the U.S. do not seem to want to understand is that most of Mexico that wants to go to the U.S. for whatever reason, can already do it. The Mexico/U.S. border, if I recall, is the most active border in the world, second to none.

[–]mwobuddy 3 points4 points5 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Theres a phrase, people who have empathy are socialist when they're young and conservative when they're old.

It seems like people are doing the leftist politics out of a sense of empathy, but they've never experienced what it would be like. They're asking for a radical change without having ever experienced that change firsthand.

[–]Gaesesagai 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This is very disappointing. Her electoral platform was generally much better than corporate democrats and republicans. And then she shows the delusional entitlement of feminism. Pathetic.

As for the "right" answer, like a few others have already mentioned in comments, it is very simple. Had she answered with "No. Thank you." no one could have accused her of anything (or ask him to have the debate on "neutral ground" so to speak). As a bonus this would have probably caused the hyper Shapiro to go into a frenzy and shoot himself in the foot with some nonsensical comments.

Instead she chose to be a cnt and at the same time gave Shapiro the perfect justification for his crazy rhetoric and made him look like the reasonable one... Unbelievable.

[–]LabTech41 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You cannot claim that you are a strong woman who's willing to fight for 'the people' AND claim that someone who's challenging your platform is some mean creepy guy that you think is icky. Those two things are at odds: either admit that you're weak, or accept that you don't want to go on his show because the first time you were 'seriously' questioned, you struggled to define what your own philosophy means.

If you can't even say with authority what democratic socialism MEANS, then you're smart enough to know that a discussion with Shapiro, whether he's right or wrong, would eviscerate your political career before it's even started. You're so afraid of Shapiro, not because of what he'd do but because of what he represents, that you're willing to pull the sexism card to avoid the feather in your cap that is a conservative pundit putting 10K in your war-chest voluntarily. Given what I've seen of her so far, that's probably a smart move on her part, but it's completely hollow and transparent.

She's running on a shortlist of collectivist issues, but it's highly unlikely she'll actually accomplish anything outside of increasing funding for local entitlement programs, thus largely maintaining the status quo.

[–][deleted] -4 points-3 points-2 points 7 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link

The correct response to Shapiro's offer is the same correct response to cat-calling: there isn't one. Ignore him and you're either scared of him or stuck up. Humor him and you're a tease. Give him shit back and you're a bitch. Take him up on it and you're a whore.

Shapiro isn't her opponent. Offering her money to appear on his show (as opposed to trying to book things through normal channels via producers) was basically him calling her a whore and making an opening offer. It's an entitled, shitty thing to do.

[–]CaptSnap 4 points5 points6 points 7 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

She could politely decline or if I were her I would have invited him to my own show and offered $10,000 to planned parenthood in his name or something. She lost the opportunity to control the engagement.

You dont have to be a shit-ass. If youre running to be a senator then act like a fucking senator. If the likes of Shapiro have you pulling the "harassment" card then holy shit.

[–][deleted] -4 points-3 points-2 points 7 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

I believe her words were "cat-calling," and I still think it's an apt metaphor because like with cat-calling it's not a sincere offer; it's an attempt to puff yourself up at the expense of someone else by putting them in an impossible situation.

If she politely declined she's dignifying the offer. He's a talking schmuck, not her opponent; its not appropriate for him to publicly try to goad her into debating him. Engaging him at all would be a no-win situation. "Maybe if I'm polite enough to this troll he'll be reasonable..." is not how trolling works. Paying ten thousand dollars for the privilege of being trolled is very much letting him control her.

[–]CaptSnap 2 points3 points4 points 7 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

"I don’t owe a response to unsolicited requests from men with bad intentions. And also like catcalling, for some reason they feel entitled to one."

Here I thought the essence of cat-calling was the demeaning power differential and of course the objectification. How do you feel objectified when someone wants to debate the ideas of your mind?

I got a wedding invitation in the mail today. I didnt ask to be invited. It is literally an "unsolicited request" from a woman of course rolls eyes. They want me to go to their wedding, it will be all about her. Thats a pretty selfish and therefore bad intention. Yet....just like catcalling, they feel entitled to some kind of fucking response. The narcissistic bastards even sent a reply card knowing full well what society expects me to do. But then we remember its just a wedding invitation and Im not 4 and I can handle it.

And I disagree. Schmuck to you and me, he may well be, but the son of a bitch is still a fucking citizen. Im guessing you dont think citizens should question their political servants or what? They dont have to answer (though I would prefer they do).

let me take another stab...

My senator received another letter from me in his email yesterday. Like so many it too was an "unsolicited request" for his rationale. And just like with "catcalling" I do honestly feel entitled to a response.....so fucking what? I aint getting one.

Its bullshit and you know it. She handled it poorly. She should have put on her big senator panties instead of throwing sexism and being a poor oppressed minority woman all the time. By definition senators arent oppressed, even if they arent quite in the seat yet.

one final thought:

its not appropriate for him to publicly try to goad her into debating him.

Keeping in mind I fervently and completley disagree.... but do you extend this same appropriateness when people try to goad the president? just curious

[–]TheMythof_Feminism 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

demeaning power differential

.... u wot m8?

Cat-calling is about one thing and one thing alone. Some chick has a nice ass, a guy is oafish and probably working class, so he whistles. Nice ass = whistle.

Not all men will be slick and suave and that is what is being observed in those instances.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 7 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

What he did was trolling and entitled in a way your other examples aren't.

But yes, if someone offered to pay the president $10,000 dollars to debate them as opposed to debates being only between opponents, yes, that would be disgraceful and disrespectful. You're focused on the part where people can and should question their political leaders, which is fine, but this is more like paying someone to have a spousal argument with you rather than their spouse, and then when they inevitably turn you down acting like they're too afraid or too much of a bitch to take you up on it. It's just fucking rude.

[–]CaptSnap 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

and then when they inevitably turn you down acting like they're too afraid or too much of a bitch to take you up on it. It's just fucking rude.

Maybe I havent gotten the entire tweet thing but didnt she refer to him as an entitled catcaller? I quoted that bit so forgive my rhetorical question.

Did he ever call her anything? this is the part I havent seen

but he is still the rude one?

I dont think we're going to see eye-to-eye on this one. I dont see anything inherently rude in an invitation. But I do think its rude to call out his gender and liken him to an entitled catcaller as though being invited to a debate over twitter is somehow a gendered issue akin to street harassment. I think its the stupidest weakest bullshit Ive seen from a person running for office yet.

He didnt have to call her too much of a bitch to act like an adult, she did that herself. But if you found where he did stoop to her level and call her names that would definitely change my stance.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Hm, let's think of this a different way. If you did interpret the way I do and she did (as a condescending and entitled troll), would you begrudge her responding the way she did?

[–]CaptSnap 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

If she were running for hall monitor or 4th grade class president then her response might not seem so......out of place.

But she isnt, she is running for the US senate. A senator should do better.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 7 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

The correct response to Shapiro's offer is the same correct response to cat-calling: there isn't one.

There is. It's called grow up and be an adult rather than a petulant child.

Ignore him and you're either scared of him or stuck up. Humor him and you're a tease. Give him shit back and you're a bitch. Take him up on it and you're a whore.

So? Stop giving a fuck what other people think, again this is not middle school. Feminism continues to infantilize women and treat them like pathetic helpless victims. Seriously, you people have a victim complex.

Shapiro isn't her opponent. Offering her money to appear on his show (as opposed to trying to book things through normal channels via producers) was basically him calling her a whore and making an opening offer. It's an entitled, shitty thing to do.

He offered her a debate for charity, the goal was to get her to debate him and have an open exchange of ideas.

She could've just as easily said "Sure let's do it, but let's both give money to charity" or "Sure, let's do it but keep your money, destroying your ideas will be enough".

Instead she chose to whine and cry - like a child, like a feminist. You people wonder why women won't identify as Feminist - you make them look pathetic.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

"But maybe if she just fed the trolls they'd suddenly start being fair to her..."

Suuuuure.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 7 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

If you want to act like a child so be it, I don't expect better from feminists. You are the kind that pull fire alarms and blow noisemakers to avoid being destroyed ideologically after all.

Again, by all means stay ignorant to what's happening there's a reason women hate your movement. Feminism is a dirty word thank to you and I can't thank you enough for that, you do good work.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Oh dear, my self-confidence is crushed. I realize I've been on the side of evil this whole time. Let me take a kerosene bath and light a match to atone for my sins against men.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No thanks, I'd rather you keep doing what you do, if even one person can witness your ignorance and hatred I'm sure you'll be another nail in the coffin for your movement.

Every time I hear someone say "Feminism is a dirty word" I'll think of you and smile.

[–]bassofkramer 1 point2 points3 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The correct response to my own idiotic comment is same correct response to cat-calling: there isn't one.

[+]ForAndAgainst1 points 7 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

You might want to examine your fixation on sexualized, gendered insults, it practically seems like an obsession. Ms. Ocasio-Cortez is a public servant and as such, she does have a responsibility to engage with the press. If she objects to Ben Shapiro's journalistic methods, or his offer of money, she could have said that, or said nothing, but instead she chose to turn this into another fake #metoo moment.

[–]TheMythof_Feminism 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

You might want to examine your fixation on sexualized, gendered insults

Who gives a fuck about political correctness.

You might want to examine your fixation on regulating the behavior of others.... it is very much an SJW/feminist move to try to subjugate others for things like speech. That being said, the guy's argument was trash, but not because of the nonsense you're talking about.

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