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Woman statutory rapes 50 times child schoolboy. She is sentenced at 10 days worth of community service. Imagine the sentence if the genders were reversed

girl-red

January 16, 2016
160 upvotes
/r/MensRights
http://www.unilad.co.uk/articles/teaching-assistant-had-sex-with-schoolboy-over-50-times/
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Title Woman statutory rapes 50 times child schoolboy. She is sentenced at 10 days worth of community service. Imagine the sentence if the genders were reversed
Author

girl-red

Upvotes 160
Comments 25
Date January 16, 2016 9:24 PM UTC
(10 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/41acw5/woman_statutory_rapes_50_times_child_schoolboy/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/woman-statutory-rapes-50-times-child-schoolboy-she.958383
https://theredarchive.com/post/958383
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Comments

[–]xynomaster 26 points27 points28 points 10 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

This story is actually from a few months ago and has an update that's good news. After the initial story came out, the kid went on TV to talk about how sickened he was by the abuse and the fact that she got away with it, and a lot of people here and who heard about it through the news, etc (including an MP) wrote to the attorney general expressing concern.

The sentence was ultimately overturned as unduly lenient and she's currently serving a two-year jail term (source)

[–]garglemesh42 21 points22 points23 points 10 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Two years for 50 times. So that's a little over two weeks for each time.

That's still a fucking joke.

[–]xynomaster 15 points16 points17 points 10 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

The judge said the sentence was "tempered" by her family situation (ie she's a single mother). In my personal opinion that shouldn't be taken into account for serious crimes like child sex abuse, because it does a huge disservice to the victim.

At least she got SOMETHING though. 2 years in jail, even if you get out after 1, is still a hell of a lot more severe a punishment than some community service. Shows the victim that he matters and shows other women that this is not something society will tolerate.

[–]under_score16 11 points12 points13 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The judge said the sentence was "tempered" by her family situation (ie she's a single mother). In my personal opinion that shouldn't be taken into account for serious crimes like child sex abuse, because it does a huge disservice to the victim.

I think it also would do a disservice to the woman's children to be left in custody with a parent that would do something like that.

[–]garglemesh42 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I agree that it is better than nothing. I hate the fact that they will make up any excuse to give a woman a lighter sentence.

They'd never do the same thing for a single father that had done what she did.

[–]xynomaster 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No, they wouldn't. But in my view the fact that the UK's top appeals court ruled that a jail sentence was needed here makes it a victory anyway. That's happened a lot in the UK recently and hopefully will set some sort of precedent.

[–]FeierInMeinHose 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

In fact the father would lose his ability to ever see his kids again.

[–]zen_affleck 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

He would never be allowed around any kids in any context. He would be forced to stay away from public schools, parks, and anywhere children might gather. He would be required to inform all of his neighbors that he is a sex offender, so that he is under constant observation.

[–]tothecatmobile 6 points7 points8 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

She was charged with 3 counts of sexual activity with a child.

The '50 times' comes from an interview with a newspaper, not from the court case.

[–]GoldenGonzo 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

That is 14.24 days for each time she raped him.

They sure threw the book at her. /s

[–]xynomaster 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

She was only ever charged with 3 counts (presumably all they could prove). Of course it's low, the judge even said it was because she was a single mother, but imagine you were being sentenced right now. Think about the difference between going home to your family and moving on with your life but spending a few hours over the next few weekends doing community service, or putting the entirety of your life on hold to spend two years in a prison cell. It's massive.

One is pretty much getting away with it, one is actually being punished. And the fact that there is some significant punishment is so much more important than the length of the punishment.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

http://metro.co.uk/2015/11/17/teacher-jailed-for-having-sex-with-pupil-80-times-after-sentence-review-5508467/

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Anyone else notice that in the original story they keep saying alleged even though she was already convicted.

[–]Capitalsman 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Even with the updated sentence she got because the 1st one was so lenient (though the 2nd is as well) I don't think a woman will get a similar sentence or treatment by society and the law like men unless she sodomizes a boy, otherwise they'll say he wanted it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

In Denmark, age of consent is 15. What she did would have been legal here, unless she abused him or you could otherwise argue that there was a significant power differential at play in the arrangement...which, if she wasn't grading his stuff, I don't think you could argue.

What do you all think about the danish laws? Bear in mind, the laws go both ways (and are applied evenly).

Personally, I tend to think that unless a person is developmentally stunted, 15 is old enough that the government doesn't need to be involved, unless abuse is taking place. I'm not sure I understand why we'd need to infantilize a normal 15 years old - surely, they are old enough to make a determination of their own volition as to whether they want to sleep with somebody ?

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yes, I agree, but

unless abuse is taking place.

this is important. Later, apparently, the kid went on TV and said it was abuse and he was sickened by it.

[–]xynomaster 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

He did. He said he was "scarred for life" by the abuse and called the sentence "atrocious". (source)

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I'm not sure I understand why we'd need to infantilize a normal 15 years old - surely, they are old enough to make a determination of their own volition as to whether they want to sleep with somebody ?

I disagree. I don't think 15 is old enough to be able to make that kind of judgement (in general). Here in America 15 isn't even close to being an adult so I don't see why sex would be the exception. They still have 3 years of mandatory school so we obviously don't think they're educated to go out in the real world. Unless a 15 year old can be considered an an adult in virtually every way there's always going to be a pretty significant power differential between the minor and adult.

I'm not sure if my opinion is the popular one, as I do see people making similar comments as yours. I personally don't see the problem with having the age of consent being close to or at the age of adulthood. We're fine restricting the rights of minors in other areas, but when a horny adult can't sleep with one suddenly the 15 year olds desires matter

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Actually, there's another argument beyond the moral one: Prohibiting teenagers from having sex doesn't prevent it - it just makes it happen in secret.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prevalence_of_teenage_pregnancy#/media/File:Teenage_birth_rate_per_1000_women_15%E2%80%9319,_2000-09.svg

See this? Denmark is in the incredibly low category. The US is...well, you can see for yourself.

Another fun fact - legal age limit on buying alcohol here? Also 15. You'd think with all of these legal boozing teenagers, they'd be getting into all sorts of trouble. You couldn't be more wrong.

By infantilizing young people like the US and a lot of other nations are doing, you are creating people who make massive mistakes before age 20. Binge drinking also result in far more teen deaths per capita in the US, and the US rate of abortions is also higher. You could almost say that by treating teenagers as if they are irresponsible children, you are turning them into irresponsible children.

I would always argue that most 15 years olds are perfectly well developed to make these decisions for themselves, and that this is really all the argument you should need - but if you want to protect adolescents, in general, the numbers seem to indicate that they are also better off under a system with a more realistic age of consent as compared to when adolescents start having sex with eachother.

That way, it's possible to have a completely open and honest conversation about everything that is going on.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

You know who has higher teen birth rates according to that list? Bulgaria and Greenland. You want to know the age of consent in those countries? 14 and 15 respectively. It has more to do with sex education and contraceptive use and availability not infantizing them like you claim. Hong Kong has an age of consent law of 16 and even lower teen birth rates than Denmark. I'm not saying teens don't have sex, but they shouldn't be having sex with adults.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Greenland is an excellent example, since it illustrates that it's not just about the law, you are quite right - that's because Greenland is actually danish in terms of most of its laws.

It's about a culture of prohibition vs. a culture of acceptance. In parts of the western world, there is massive sexual prohibition of teenagers, that reaches far beyond the point where most adolescents wish to become sexually active. This leads to secrecy and isolation.

Age of consent laws are one contributor to sexual openness, but it's true, there's many other factors, and I may have overstated it's importance.

That said, my point is, where you could have informed, empowered and responsible young men and women, you have a ban in place that reaches 3-4 years beyond the time where a lot of them want to have their sexual debut.

Instead of making a conscious, deliberate effort to get it right, they try to stick by 'sobriety' in isolation till they break down, or they end up in group environments where they egg themselves and their peers on. They could have had older family members for support, but they have to stay hushed up.

And listen - getting sex right is not super complicated. You sort out your own feelings, you make sure your partner has their feelings sorted out, and you use protection. Even the dumbest adults can manage it fairly easily. What's important is that you have people around you, who you can go to, and who you can talk to about it.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

We obviously have different views on this. I don't see these laws with higher age of consent laws as banning teens from sex but banning adults from having sex with young teens. In most cases if the teens are of similar age no crime has occurred (say a 18 yr with 16).

I also disagree with your view that sex isn't complicated. Sure you can put it simply like that, but that's not how the real world works. The dumbest adults manage to make a lot of mistakes concerning sex and it ends up damaging their lives. Maybe sex shouldn't be complicated but it definitely is. And I don't think 15 yr olds are as mature and in touch with their feelings as you think. I just don't think they should be having sex with adults.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Alright fair enough - but there are byproducts to criminalizing it using age of consent. Even if you see it as a strict ban on adults having sex with teenagers, that doesn't mean this is the only effect.

There's a lot of examples of teenagers being punished due to a small age difference, sometimes as little as a single year, in spite being sexually active for 2-3 years while neither was over the age of consent.

This will necessarily create a chilling effect on the subject. You can't just criminalize something and not expect side effects.

Secondly, as for how complicated it is - it becomes far more complicated if there is a taboo around it. When the age of consent matches the time where teenagers wish to become sexually active, that doesn't mean they get exploited by adults - it just means they take that responsibility upon themselves, with a lot of help.

For instance, in this pertinent case, the boy kept silent from his parents and brother for an extended period of time. Had it been legal, he would likely have told people, but because he felt the need to protect her, he kept his mouth shut. It may have simply been a one-night-stand instead of an abusive relationship.

[–]Eryemil -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

For people here that get worked up about feminists, look at the comments in that article. Most of them written by average, non-feminist men.

The world is complicated.

[–]foxyramirez -2 points-1 points0 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

If I were in the same situation, I'd be at the front gate of that prison the day she gets out with a loaded 12 gauge in hand.

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