Hobby Lobby ruling - A lot of misinformation out there

rg57 · 2014-07-02T16:27:27+00:00

Seems like there is a fair amount of misinformation out there.

Unlike the reporter, I actually did read the entire decision.

This case was not about abortion. It was about (any) religious belief trumping generally-applicable law.

Alito liked to pretend that this was really only about Hobby Lobby and Conestoga, and really only about 4 of the 20 forms of contraception required to be funded, and not the other 16.

However where it went off the rails is when he declared that he was fit to judge how "sincerely" the belief was held (even if it had nothing really to do with the religion itself) but could not determine how "reasonable" it was (even though the court regularly claims to determine what a reasonable person would believe). However the RFRA law states that the burden on the religious can't be just any burden, to be removed. It must be a substantial one. The plaintiffs didn't even attempt to prove that they had paid for an abortion. It was entirely about the possibility that some day, at some point, maybe, a woman might use a day-after pill, and one of the times she uses that pill, it will cause a fertilized egg not to implant because she guessed right that there was fertilization. A plaintiff typically doesn't even get access to the federal courts without proving injury in fact. There was zero injury in this case. It was all hypothetical.

Since the court claims not to be able to determine how "reasonable" a belief is, just because the belief is religious, then ANYTHING can now become an exemption to the regular laws, if there is ANY way to accommodate the exemption, even if everyone else has to pay for it through the creation of a new program, which may not even be legal (as the majority admitted).

Consider that again. The religious nuts get their exemption, EVEN if the accommodation proposed to be found by the court may be ILLEGAL.

DavidByron2 · 2014-07-02T17:17:50+00:00

It's not about either. It's about corporations being above the law.

seego79 · 2014-07-02T23:41:19+00:00

its just another example of why america needs to join the civilised world and have universal healthcare.

thereyouwent · 2014-07-02T08:06:44+00:00

The IUD and Plan B are not aborticides so the fact is that their religious objections were allowed to trump science and law at the expense of thier employees. It is the same kind of redefinition that was attempted and has failed in multiple person hood amendments in several states at the ballot box. If Hobby Lobby didn't want to follow the law then they should lose the tax benefits and subsidies they are going to receive from the government. I don't feel obligated to provide subsidized prices for them to provide religiously guided healthcare so that they can pay their employees in a separate market from the rest of the country. If they don't want subsidies and tax breaks then don't take them.

In addition if their company is so closely held that they can extend their religious views to the benefits of their employees then they can pay the same tax rate that i have to as a self employed person.

Even if it was about abortion, Last time i checked that was a constitutional right. It is time to repeal the Hyde amendment and additionally we will have to get a public option to shield employees from the religious whims of their self righteous employers.

MRSPArchiver · 2014-07-02T06:18:26+00:00

Post text automatically copied here. (Why?) (Report a problem.)

saint2e · 2014-07-02T14:51:48+00:00

My favourite thing about this is that people are spinning it as Hobby Lobby denying access to something.

1) you can still access it, you just have to pay for it yourself.

2) It's 4 types of contraceptives out of many, that you have to pay for yourself

3) Before Obamacare made it mandatory for companies to have insurance plans for employees, what did people do? Oh, they paid for it themselves.

The whole thing is much ado about nothing, but because it involves a contraceptive that women use, it's suddenly about women's rights and freedoms. Your rights and freedoms are intact. If you work for Hobby Lobby, you'll have to pay as much for those 4 prescriptions as you would before Obamacare.

Now, if you'll excuse me I need to go pay off my $2500 fertility treatment bills.

Title	Hobby Lobby ruling - A lot of misinformation out there
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	3
Comments	22
Date	July 2, 2014 6:18 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/29mpu5/hobby_lobby_ruling_a_lot_of_misinformation_out/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/hobby-lobby-ruling-a-lot-of-misinformation-out.998473 https://theredarchive.com/post/998473

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