I don't know what to believe

AssistTemporary8422 · 2023-03-16T03:43:27+00:00

On the liberal/feminine side they'll tell me that I am just crazy and toxic and need to somehow unlearn toxic masculinity. On the conservative/ red pill side, they'll tell me that I'm just an apparent week data mail and I need to get stronger.

The problem is you are playing with these labels like feminism, toxic masculinity, beta male, and strength. But the failing of these ideologies is they don't translate these labels into actionable specific advice that actually works. I don't care about the labels, I care about the specific advice.

As a matter of fact I've had more success and probably the worst mental space I've ever been with girls than I ever did when I was more in shape or mentally well.

What specifically do you credit this success to?

Lonny-zone · 2023-03-16T18:08:29+00:00

You don’t become a feminist because it’s a way to get girls or success.

You do it because you believe it’s the right thing to do.

What might happen as a by product of unlearning misogyny and toxic masculinity is that you might be happier with yourself because you’re free of the expectation that comes with being “the men”. Being dominant, getting respect through violence, not allowing emotions and so on.

There are plenty of toxic males who are successful and respected in their community, and they might even have families but their egos are massively fragile. Also you don’t know if they’re really happy and how real their family relationship and connections are, how stable their mental health actually is.

BabbitCohen · 2023-03-16T02:37:52+00:00

It always comes down to: work on yourself, be the best version of yourself possible, improve your empathy and kindness broadly, put yourself out there socially and then see what happens. There are unfortunately no guarantees, but ideally the goal isn't to find the ideology that attracts the most women or equates to the highest success, but the one that makes you the best and happiest person.

Redpill mentality uses the same tools all shitty ideologies do, some good advice and common sense tips embedded in destructive and hateful rhetoric. It sounds cliche but the hate route is always the wrong route.

fathergoose77 · 2023-03-16T16:19:43+00:00

Why do you feel you need to label yourself and your beliefs? Can you just focus on figuring out what Bittersteel1818 wants in life and who he wants to be?

Do you value traditional values or more modern values? Do you want to be a primary breadwinner and provider to a family? Or do you want a more financially equal relationship? Are you religious? Do you want to advance your education? Do you want to travel? What do you want out of life aside from “a woman”?

I think it’s insightful that you’ve figured out that everyone operates differently and has their own sets of values and principles. People don’t all fit into neatly labeled boxes because all humans are multifaceted and complex beings. So, instead of trying to fit yourself into a box with a strictly defined label, just focus on figuring out who you actually are and what you want instead of what society/parents/culture/social media expects you to be.

Ideologies like feminism aren’t about increasing your chances of dating, it’s about the belief that women should have equal legal rights as men at the core (because previously, women couldn’t vote, get higher education, have their own bank accounts, choose who they marry, etc). None of these are about increasing your chances at dating, it’s about seeing women as equal human beings who deserve the same legal rights to work, go to school, vote, and have their own autonomy. I’m a feminist, and a man, but I don’t expect my ideology to increase my dating chances, however I do expect to have a partner who values the same ideologies as me (which my current partner does).

Figure out what you really believe and then you can focus on finding a partner with similar beliefs. You don’t need any labels. If you believe all women want a rich dude to use for his money, then that’s the kind of woman you most likely will end up with if you use money to attract women.

bluemagex2517 · 2023-03-17T14:10:41+00:00

I've been both a male feminist

I doubt you were much of a feminist. What kind of feminist were you? Radical, liberal, ecofeminist, socialist, libertarian, intersectional? What authors did you read/ were you influenced by?

I suspect you labeled yourself based on a vague and inaccurate interpretation of what you perceive feminism to be.

You sound very much like a christian who claims they were an atheist in college. They had no philosophical underpinnings to their atheism, they just didn't go to church or pray for a couple of years, drank a bunch, and then went back to Church with renewed conviction when it was convenient.

I just have the best intentions and I didn't want anybody hurt and I did not want to play second fiddle or get played myself.

This is very much in line with feminism. It's mystifying as to why you would think that it's not.

Why would you think that fulfilling your gender role would protect yourself from being cheated on? What does fulfilling gender roles have to do with doing "everything right?" Lots of things gender roles ask you to do are immoral. Lots of times going against your gender roles would be the more moral and less harmful path. Not all gender roles are bad, but lots of them are "toxic," they harm people.

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528lover · 2023-03-20T14:09:38+00:00

OP, feel free to message me. I was a female feminist, then a female redpill, and now, neither. The truth is always gray. All the political realm of social media is really toxic because it involves selective empathy and group polarization.

Aka, redpill people are empathetic towards young men's struggles (which is good - think of certain things Jordan Peterson says) but then they go off the rails with their conclusions (aka Andrew Tate - yucky misogyny and he's literally a sex trafficker).

And then the left wingers are empathetic towards minority struggles, which are so valid - I'm a minority woman myself and understand the feelings of cultural appropriation I see around me - but then their conclusions can go off the wall with radical activism towards cancelling white people or allowing children to transition without recognizing the lasting medical impact that results if a child would want to undo their decision in the future, for example.

At the end of the day, I avoid labels. I believe in Love, and having empathy for all sides. We are all humans and deserve to be treated that way.

Title	I don't know what to believe
Author	Bittersteel1818
Upvotes	2
Comments	26
Date	March 16, 2023 2:05 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/11sgyo0/i_dont_know_what_to_believe/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/i-dont-know-what-to-believe.1180701 https://theredarchive.com/post/1180701

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