I'm teetering on the edge.

dmcnelly · 2014-09-29T17:58:37+00:00

What are they saying that's "making sense"? Be specific here.

LiftThingsUpThenDown · 2014-09-30T23:53:50+00:00

Everyone is manipulative so I won't talk about that.

Except this isn't true. Everyone has wants and desires and will try to achieve them, but not everyone is dishonest and insincere about it. Manipulation is born of fear that you won't get everything you want all the time. Move past that fear, accept that not everything is always going to break your way, and you can be a decent, nonshithead.

Sure, lots of people are manipulative. Lots of people are also weak. Lots of people are also cowards. Lots of people spend their entire life feeling from the fear of pain. Why accept and aspire to that?

Gunlord500 · 2014-09-29T23:35:07+00:00

There's an old saying--the most believable lies have a grain of truth to them. Same with RP. Yeah, getting ripped will get you more girls, and there's some truth to the whole "chicks dig jerks" thing. But it's hardly as if those tiny bits of truth are the exclusive property of TRP. There's no need to buy into the rest of the silliness there.

Now, I can't speak for you, but for myself, I admit that I might have bought into the TRP ideology a few years ago. What brought me out of it? A few things:

1: The racism and conspiracy theories infesting it. I'm a non-white man: Even if I hated women as much as TRPers do, I'd want nothing to do with the racism, anti-semitism, and other assorted nonsense that infects their ideology. And as I started to think, if those guys are wrong about blacks and Jews, they're probably wrong about a bunch of other stuff too.

2: The incoherence of their ideology. They talk a lot about how women want "fried ice," but what red-pillers want is even less clear. If you go the PUA route, the MGTOW guys will call you a "pussy beggar." If you go the MGTOW route (that is to say, the male equivalent of lesbian separatism), the PUAs will call you an "omega." If you can't win with those jagoffs, why even bother trying?

After that point, I just said "screw it" and decided to live life without RP. And I'm pretty happy for it.

dipdac · 2014-10-03T10:16:35+00:00

The misogyny is self-perpetuating there. They will tell you that a woman is manipulative in all cases, and that they will only be as mature as a teenager, so they then deploy manipulative tactics that impress only teenagers, while trolling scenes where there are bound to be few mature adults. Then they write off more women by calling them feminazis (instead of women) and not worth associating with when they don't fall for the BS. Many times they won't even talk to women past their mid 20s. They then state that since the only women left (a tiny sample size) are immature and manipulative, their original hypothesis must be correct. Classic circular reasoning.

If you want to hunt ducks, you use a duck call. If you want to catch a catfish, you use stink bait. If you want to seduce a manipulative young person, manipulate them and act like a jerk. If you want to meet an adult woman and have an earnest relationship with them, conduct yourself like an adult and don't be a dick.

MrsUnderwood · 2014-10-10T07:28:58+00:00

The part of taking TRP that includes self-improvement, health, exercise, working on social skills, etc. is excellent.

The only problem is you can do those things without taking TRP and all the baggage that comes with it (unless you truly believe that a woman's worth is directly tied to her sexual partners/think they are pure evil - in which case you can stop reading my post now).

So, what is the premise for being part of the red pill community? To avoid becoming like the dudes whom pedestalize women and worship them? To move away from blaming an external force and to take responsibility for one's physical appearance and social skills?

Great. Except, from my perspective, a large majority of them have just again fallen into a pattern of blame via hatred of women and very misogynistic attitudes.

And this is the problem. They are insistent that women play a game, some of the more extreme types go so far as to believe that women intentionally marry men so they can divorce them later for all their assets. I'm not saying that hasn't happened or doesn't happen, but really? This shows how little they've actually interacted with women in some humanistic way.

I think this is the important part: the way they treat women will FOREVER deter the kind of woman they are apparently looking for: one that isn't emotionally 19, one that doesn't "play games", one that won't engage in "divorce rape", etc.

It's like TRP is the male version of Cosmopolitan for women - it works on a few random dudes but it's likely going to perpetuate your purpose for being there.

Of course, I need not mention the men that believe women are inherently evil, that no woman can mature beyond teenage years, that a woman is not a person with gasp the same possible interests as men, that all women are seeking to take advantage of them via divorce, that a woman is not a human in the same way and her value is directly tied to her sexual partner count, etc.

People that believe that regressive nonsense will always exist - and of course TRP philosophy will attract those types due to its very nature.

I feel like TRP is a different side of the same coin as TBP - they both engage in this fantasy world regarding women and it becomes a whole lot speculation, anecdotal evidence, bias, and blaming women for their problems.

How do men get along with other men? I would assume they keep the guys they like around and ditch the douchebags. Yeah, maybe it gets complicated when one's aim is to just stick a dick in the other person, but maybe if men treated women as other people they'd have a much easier time finding someone compatible and reduce attracting the same game-playing "whores" that they claim to have so much disdain for.

Because let's be real here: TRPers are playing a game, and the only other players are the people they're supposedly trying to avoid.

TurnPunchKick · 2014-09-29T18:04:40+00:00

You can be a "Alpha Male" without manipulating people or hating women. You can be a Man's Man without blaming everyone for you're shortcomings.

Not going to say they are violent but they damn sure tell everyone to be passive aggressive to anyone who isn't "on their side".

Redpill is full of bitches telling bitches that everybody else is to blame and if you hate someone inbjust the right way you will get your rocks off.

If you're ok with putting you need to validate yourself through sex above the mental/physical well being of other people then maybe trp is for you.

If not your going to have to try to be a man who can get women without any dirty tricks or manipulation and yes it can be done.

JayCKey · 2014-09-30T20:45:54+00:00

Ultimately we're all humans. We're all beautifully flawed broken humans looking for a place of comfort and acceptance. The Red Pill teaches you that humans are fundamentally different, but I just can't accept that. We love the same, we feel the same hurts, we thrive on the same comforts. The Red Pill is an easy answer to the question "Why am I alone?" It says the world is broken.

But the world isn't broken, at least not in a way that specifically targets men. We each have flaws and weaknesses. The things you hope to gain from the red pill, perhaps you need to gain from within yourself.

Love? Love yourself.

Acceptance? Accept yourself.

Happiness? Seek it on your own.

There's no singular answer to gaining these, but until you can love yourself no one can love you. And loving yourself means acknowledging your flaws and strengths.

I hope you can find these answers, and through them you can see that women and men aren't so different. With this you can hopefully find a lasting happiness that doesn't come from bringing anyone down.

Ryuudou · 2014-10-05T06:42:40+00:00

The problem with that goes something like this:

Some RP member - "If a girl doesn't wanna fuck after 3 dates, I next her! Simple as that."

followed by ...

Same RP Member - "If I can fuck a girl on the first date, she's clearly no LTR material, so she'll always only be plate-status."

Same RP member, again - "So you see, clearly utilizing my superior logic skills ... if a girl doesn't wanna put out on the first date, she's wasting my time; if she's too easy, she's a slut. There are no good LTR prospects, QED, bitches."

The hamstering going on in those two statements is so massive that it takes over my entire field of view. I come from a scientific background (engineer/science); I was trained an inch from my life to spot logical contradictions and fallacies, and this is the biggest one plaguing TRP right now. You cannot say you want to date homely, family oriented girls who know their value (hence, they don't fuck on the first date), who only fuck in comfortable relationtionships, next them, and then come on this subreddit and brag about it to stroke your e-penis.

This is just but one example of the vehemently illogical and unproductive place TRP is. There are a lot more healthy places to focus on improving yourself for the opposite sex.

2014-10-01T22:58:23+00:00

[permanently deleted]

qwerty_asd · 2014-10-21T01:23:15+00:00

Dude, it ultimately come down seeing women as people. You can love a girl without being a push-over.

If you like lifting, that's cool. It's fucking fun to be strong, and a lot of chicks dig it. If you are drawn to /r/theredpill, then you probably are like me in that regard.

You can read still read the stuff they say for fun, but don't take it as dogma! There are some girls out there who are kinda bitches as they like to characterize them. Simply don't date girls that you find to be like that. If you have to game the hell out of a chick to have any sort of relationship with her, then it's a clearly not a good relationship.

Another thing that they are correct about is the obvious fact that it is good to be desirable. Still, that doesn't mean that you have to be an asshole.

At the end of the day, theory about women doesn't matter once you find one with whom you have mutual respect and a good sexy loving relationship, and you are going to scare such women away if you are dogmatically employing the /r/theredpill strategies.

2014-11-01T16:33:29+00:00

I see a lot of red-pillers as people who just haven't expanded their social radius enough to meet people (specifically women, but males friends play a big role too) they vibe with well.

Have you ever moved out of your hometown because you had other pursuits in life, only to return one day and see it a little differently? You feel like you don't have much in common with your old friends that stayed and never left, you see people that are unhappy because they never made that decision to leave their cookie-cutter suburb? That's kind of what red-pillers are like.

Red-pillers stayed in these toxic social environments and never learned to just meet people who they see eye to eye with (women and men alike) and maybe feel low self-esteem around them because of it. So they develop these strategies for social interactions where they're the "big man" or the "winner" by manipulating others. Why even go through all that trouble when you can just be your true confident self and surround yourself socially with non-manipulative shitty people? Why would you want to win those people over or prove yourself to them? It seems like a big waste of time and an unnecessary headache.

One thing I like about TRP is the people in the group who focus on self-improvement and see sex/relationships as a byproduct of that self-improvement. But this is usually buried underneath the "This hot girl at college I really like is a slut, how can I make her feel like shit about herself so I can get her to sleep with me?" A lot of the women I know who have great personalities wouldn't spend 2 more seconds around a guy who belittles them or uses "dread game"..

What pushed me away from TRP was ultimately the misogyny and regressive-conservatism of it. One poster told me that I "look weak" for hanging out with female friends at a bar. If you can't make friends with a woman, how the hell do you expect to have a relationship with one? Also ideas that women can't have male friends is setting yourself up for the jealousy and anger issues that a 16 year old displays with their first girlfriend.

Ultimately, I think the red pill is a product of a bunch of guys who weren't quite there sexually and socially who became frustrated and bitter.. I don't think that a lot of them really know what they're talking about and they just idolize "olde time" 50's-esque manly things and wish it were that way today (as if that would do any good for someone who spends a good portion of their day in solitude whining on the internet about how they can't get a date.) I've always been curious as to what red-pillers look like and act like in real life.

Poueff · 2014-10-04T21:02:30+00:00

/r/TheRedPill just seems too politically intertwined and too eager to use anecdotes as data. Kinda like show one example, then apply it to all others.

Ignore that then. Reading field reports is not exactly my thing either, but their analysis of /r/relationship posts are pretty good. Also, I'm a liberal and I'm RP.

Even then, I also don't see the racism, misogyny or discrimination in general people spout about it. And if it did exist, you could filter it, like you said.

Title	I'm teetering on the edge.
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	11
Comments	71
Date	September 29, 2014 1:37 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/2hsbyc/im_teetering_on_the_edge/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/im-teetering-on-the-edge.300542 https://theredarchive.com/post/300542

Comments