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Lostdreamz
[–]X5R 22 points23 points24 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Run-of-the-mill hypocrisy from a subreddit filled with hypocrites.
[–]nicemod[M] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Just a warning for the benefit of our members:
If you visit that subreddit and start voting, or if you harass any of the users named in the screenshot, the admins will shadowban you.
So don't do it.
I'll remove this whole thread for now. Anyone who wants it restored can message the moderator council with an appeal.
[–][deleted] 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
[permanently deleted]
[–]nicemod[M] -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Ransom_Stoddard 29 points30 points31 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Completely emotionally debilitated. Unable to reason. Spoiled and entitled. The perpetual victim.
[–]luxury_banana 14 points15 points16 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
If they didn't have double standards, they wouldn't have any standards at all.
[–]BSexclusionzone 10 points11 points12 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
The comment has been deleted for derailing. Business as usual... +1 to the names should be blanked.
[–]reallylongusername12 8 points9 points10 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
so why mention it
yes, he made the mistake of thinking this was a rational discussion. of course it's not, any dissent would make people realize how much of a double-standard there actually is in feminism.
[–]blamb211 3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
So his experience doesn't cheapen the experiences of women, yeah? Okay, cool. But he shouldn't bring it up anyway? Yeah, you lost me there.
[–]SharkPrivilege 3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Reading that thread, you can tell how oblivious some people are :
I think asking for a woman's number IS rude, always. If you're interested in her, give her your number. You know you like her, but you have no clue if the feeling is mutual so why demand she give up her personal information because you're interested. Always struck me as a weird entitlement for someone to have.
That comment has to come with someone with either zero experience in dating or very, very oblivious.
[–]nitzua 5 points6 points7 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
zero experience in dating
I'd be willing to bet that most of these women have never been cat called either.
[–]MidNiteR32 2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
How common is cat calling? Is there a valid study or something that shows if it often happens among women & men? Once we see some numbers, then we can have a discussion.
Anecdotal is not enough to go by.
[–]icanseeyou2 3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
and to think i get exposed for being or commenting on men's issues name and all but here we are captain save a hoe this. Jesus turned the other cheek but he also got crucified.
[–]nicemod 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]yelirbear 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That's brutal. I would blank the names on the image though.
[–]Paigeebee -2 points-1 points0 points 11 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
That was one feminist- if ANYBODY makes sexual comments past the point where you feel uncomfortable, it should be stopped. period.
[–]Paigeebee 6 points7 points8 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Her frustration, I believe, was in the fact that this is a daily issue for women, where most men dont experience it. The man who posted, however, totally DID experience harassment and that shouldnt be invalidated.
[–]Feyra 3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
was in the fact that this is a daily issue for women, where most men dont experience it
I'd challenge that fact. Street harassment is based on anecdotal evidence for one thing, which is very subjective. Further, I can counter with equally valid anecdotal evidence that I and my circle of friends don't experience it with any statistically significant frequency.
I certainly don't discount that street harassment happens, and it certainly needs to be addressed, but I'm not convinced that it's the pervasive problem we're led to believe.
[–]Paigeebee 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Youre correct in that my experience is anecdotal, but this is actually a daily issue for me. Ill be straight up, Im an attractive young woman and I like to dress to accentuate that! not that Im super showy, I just look good. But almost daily, especially if I go downtown, someone will either shout something from their car, stop me in the street or make some comment. I remember being a 14 or 15 yo girl and taking the extra long way to school to aviod the construction site where workers would regularly catcall me.
It is a daily issue for me, and it does bug me and I do feel less safe because if it. Are you female?
[–]Feyra 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
It is a daily issue for me, and it does bug me and I do feel less safe because if it.
I'm deeply sorry that you experience that. I have no doubt that experiences vary wildly and there are a huge number of variables involved. My concern is not to diminish anyone's experiences, but to recognize that those experiences are not universal. Applying a universal solution can result in draconian measures that are more harmful than helpful.
I'll also note that my tolerance and interpretation of any attention I receive may be considerably higher than yours, which skews my opinion toward it not being offensive or frightening.
Are you female?
Yes. To compare our situations, I too like to think I'm an attractive woman, and while my main focus in clothing is comfort, I try to keep it reasonably fashionable. I do not wear make-up except in the most formal of situations and even then it's minimal. Comments aren't rare, but they've nearly always been polite and/or non-threatening.
[–]Paigeebee 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I do believe these experiences are somewhat universal though, as I can go anywhere in the country and talk to a class of people and find at least one woman who has felt this way. US and Latina woman report this as an issue much more so than Nordic women, so I get your point that not every woman has this experience.
I agree that applying a universal solution wouldnt be a good idea! I believe the solution lies in teaching people what is/isnt appropriate conduct. I dont see legislation solving this issue, or really even making a dent in it.
I also notice this doesnt happen to me at school so much as it does when Im downtown.
[–]thegrimraeper 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
where you feel uncomfortable
while I agree in principle - I would not tolerate any dude making such comments to my girlfriend - the reality of the situation is that the same comments are frequently unevenly reciprocated across different contexts. what one woman considers a catcall, another woman considers a mating call. in fact, I would go as far as to say that most "older" women love that shit, because without the occasional catcall they feel unattractive and undesirable, as their husbands have long since decided to ignore them. and I'm not pulling this out of my ass, they tell me this. which would make me think, if I were the type that catcalls, then maybe I should catcall even more.
so it may seem counterintuitive, but the problem is with women. they need to send a clear, consistent message, but they don't. hence guys will continue to catcall, because while most times it doesn't work, it succeeds frequently enough that it's a strategy worth repeating.
[–]Paigeebee -3 points-2 points-1 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Wow, because some women have been taught to enjoy male attention, even to the point of harassment Its women's fault for being bugged by harassment? As a woman, Ive never talked to one other woman who appreciates this.
[–]Feyra 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
if ANYBODY makes sexual comments past the point where you feel uncomfortable, it should be stopped.
Agreed, provided the line between comfort and discomfort is clearly communicated or otherwise well established. What one woman finds just fine might cross the line for another, and that's where the disconnect is. Men can't avoid crossing the line when they don't know where the line is, and when the only solution is to avoid any contact whatsoever, there's a fundamental problem.
[–]Paigeebee -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
I dont think the line is so hard to discern, though. If someone is making sexual comments towards me, I will either reciprocate (heey ;) ) or give them a negative response. If you are getting no response, its safe to take that as a negative and move on. If anyone, male or female, says something to make you uncomfortable, say something!
[–]Feyra 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
or give them a negative response
This can be subjective. What I think is a negative response, you might not. Guys commonly complain that women give mixed or vague signals rather than clearly communicating. Women commonly complain that men are dense and can't read 'obvious' signals. There's an clear lack of communication and response happening on both sides.
If you are getting no response, its safe to take that as a negative and move on.
That's a good policy.
If anyone, male or female, says something to make you uncomfortable, say something!
That's also a good policy. Clear communication and mature response from both sides works best, and we should push for that approach.
[–]Paigeebee 2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Completely agree with you, what I take away from this is that we should teach people to vocalize when they become uncomfortable.
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[–]X5R 22 points23 points24 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]nicemod[M] 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] (1 child) | Copy Link
[permanently deleted]
[–]nicemod[M] -1 points0 points1 point (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Ransom_Stoddard 29 points30 points31 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]luxury_banana 14 points15 points16 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]BSexclusionzone 10 points11 points12 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]reallylongusername12 8 points9 points10 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]blamb211 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]SharkPrivilege 3 points4 points5 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]nitzua 5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]MidNiteR32 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]icanseeyou2 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]nicemod 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]yelirbear 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Paigeebee -2 points-1 points0 points (11 children) | Copy Link
[–]Paigeebee 6 points7 points8 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]Feyra 3 points4 points5 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Paigeebee 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Feyra 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Paigeebee 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]thegrimraeper 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Paigeebee -3 points-2 points-1 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Feyra 0 points1 point2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Paigeebee -1 points0 points1 point (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Feyra 4 points5 points6 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Paigeebee 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link