Red Pill Consensus on Veganism?

PaperStreetVilla · 2017-06-25T17:44:16+00:00

Doesn't matter, it may help with certain social Circles, but that's it.

RedTenet · 2017-06-25T17:44:19+00:00

This is The Red Pill not a sub dedicated to diets. Do your own research, get your own opinions, and do as you see best. This is Asktrp if anything: not content for this sub.

My 0.02 though; Veganism isn't really the way to go. You limit way too much of your diet - and it isn't really that healthy. If you look at the number of infant deaths due to veganism you'll see how the body isn't designed for the Vegan diet.

kamikazelifestyle · 2017-06-25T19:11:09+00:00

Will you reject or adopt veganism based on the consensus of TRP? TRP is about learning how to be a man, which includes learning to trust yourself and make your own decisions. So regardless what I, or anyone else here, tells you, you should form your own opinion on this topic. Furthermore while TRP is a lifestyle philosophy in a sense, it doesn't include things like what diet you should follow or what car you should buy. It's more of a foundation of principles for how you should conduct yourself in the world, not a detailed manual.

As for my two cents: veganism is the best option to prevent (and in some cases reverse) major chronic diseases. But, just like any diet that is not the standard American diet (or whatever you grew up with), you need to educate yourself and make sure you execute it properly. You seem to know this but you're looking for validation and you're not going to find it since most people (TRPers or not) are biased for omnivorous diets and there's almost a stigma associated with veganism.

What if you're right in speculating that veganism is the optimal diet to prevent disease but instead you heed the advice of the average joe simply because there's many of them saying the same thing (a "consensus")? You'll probably die of a heart attack like most Americans. So back to the principle: make your own decisions.

theamazingswayze · 2017-06-25T20:11:58+00:00

This thread was about having an open discussion. Most of you guys are just bugging the fuck out. Lmao.

legion_of_madfellows · 2017-06-25T18:34:41+00:00

Life feeds on life. We're part of a billion-year-long line of animals that scraped, clawed, and killed to get to the top of the food chain. Veganism is a rejection of all that your ancestors sacrificed for.

Or more seriously: do what you do bro.

Veganism at its best comes from the empathetic desire to not cause pain to any being, animal or human, who has the capacity to feel pain. Empathy is a normal human emotion, but empathy leads to loss of frame, loss of frame leads to betahood, and betahood leads to cuckoldry. That is the path of the Blue Pill.

One of, if not the most important RP tenet is control of emotions. Veganism is fine if you're worried about the environment, personal health reasons, or if you just like animals. But it's also a magnet for those who allow their emotions to overrule their reason. That's why it's so popular in places where BP runs rampant - it's a emotional response to a reality that they don't want to acknowledge.

Life feeds on life. Always has. Always will.

duvagin · 2017-06-25T19:47:08+00:00

Perhaps it's my own confirmation bias but this guy's talk "How Not To Die" pushed me over the edge and I've been close to vegan for 10 months with zero adverse effects on my personal biology.

As OP says the challenges are all social, all BP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7rNY7xKyGCQ

Patam247 · 2017-06-25T17:59:37+00:00

I am personally a vegan and I'd say there is nothing wrong with it. We are herbivores by nature (will explain in another comment that claims we are omnivores) and it's the healthiest diet.

A lot of people hate vegans because no one likes to be reminded of their objectively bad choices. Still choosing to be vegan besides knowing that kinda proves you're a strong individual who thinks for himself

schmolch · 2017-06-25T19:12:50+00:00

Every higher animal eats meat. Even herbivores happily accept meat when offered. If you are healthy and i eat you, per definition you will supply me with every nutrient my body could possibly desire. Since canibalism sucks i choose to eat the next best thing, animals with a similar biology to mine, not plants who barely have any nutrient-requirements in common. Do what you want but objectively veganism is a horrible diet.

tanqop · 2017-06-25T20:45:12+00:00

Do whatever you want, but to be healthy being a vegan is going to be hard because you will need to compensate the lack of nutrients you won't be getting from meat anyway...

mallardcove · 2017-06-25T22:31:01+00:00

Bat signal for militant vegans has been lit and they are going to flock to this thread like flies on shit

mushroom_overlord · 2017-06-25T23:02:15+00:00

As a lifting bro who was led to believe we need absurd amounts of protein to build muscle, this is false. 0.6-0.8 g/ lb of bodyweight is actually sufficient. I actually feel so much better with my current macros, by dropping protein back a bit, and upping carbs. Since I've started eating more plant-based, fat intake is naturally lower. I'm not full vegan yet. It's going to be a tremendous challenge for me socially. However, I think something that anybody can do is gradually cut out crap. Cutting meat isn't hard, but animal products in general is more challenging. Take cheese, milk, or yogurt. Some people eat this daily.

Protein is necessary for your body especially if you are trying to get gains. I can't tell you how much you need, so if you're feeling good on your current 0.6-0.8 then why change it? However this does not have to be meats, do your research and figure out what works for you to cover your necessary amino acids.

The better question is why are animal products "crap" to you if they contain the nutrients you need? My take on this, could be wrong since I'm not a health scientist, is that veganism makes it a lot more difficult to meet your nutritional needs. Simply continuing a diet with plenty of both veggies, meats, and various other products. ensuring you get both fats, complex carbs, and proteins, is just simpler and lets you focus on your mission.

And also, if I ever go full vegan, it's not because PETA persuaded me to do so. It's going to be because it's evidence based. Because of scientific data. Because it works best for me and my lifestyle. So although it's not about the animals for me personally, I would still like to reduce my environmental footprint. Also, any of the vitamin/mineral deficiencies associated with veganism can be easily solved. So im not worried about that.

Well if you've found or will find boatloads of scientific evidence supporting your potential switch to veganism, and how to compensate for deficiencies, then go the fuck ahead and try it. Would love to see all this evidence though...

I'm a nursing student, so I constantly deal with patients who are admitted to the hospital often because of chronic/lifestyle diseases. Not acute illness, like trauma or gunshot wounds, but because of slow-killers like heart disease, kidney failure, and type 2 diabetes. I am convinced that there is a way to age gracefully, and just because you get old doesn't mean that your whole body needs to fall apart. People are just accepting all types of shit as a consequence of aging (Low T, ED, Obesity, Depression, High Cholesterol, Blood Pressure, etc.) Why is our health care at its most advanced stage, with new medical breakthroughs surfacing yearly, yet people are at their fattest, and sickest?

Here's where your post falls apart... these people don't need veganism they need moderation, diet-planning, and cutting of simple sugars and other garbage. Or maybe they need to stop drinking. Or its also possible that these people weren't going to avoid going to the hospital in the first place.

If you think veganism is a miracle cure so you can "age gracefully" then you've bought into some propaganda. People are at their fattest/most obese because typical American consumption is ridiculously unhealthy. If you've already adapted your diet to a more healthy lifestyle you've escaped the epidemic. It sounds like you're to fix what isn't broken.

LinuxAndBash · 2017-06-26T00:26:57+00:00

The calorie density of meat allowed humans to climb down from the trees and gave us time to think instead of spending all our time feeding ourselves.

/shittylogicthatikindofagreewith

theamazingswayze · 2017-06-25T17:29:29+00:00

Veganism is not popular on here.

I am not endorsing him or his beliefs (because dude can be crazy) but I recommend you go on Youtube and look up a guy called "Vegan Gains" - he has good insights, though naturally biased, about this type of diet.

harsha_hs · 2017-06-25T17:43:21+00:00

Vegetarian here. I would like to hear some insights too.

I lift and play badminton everyday and consider myself having very active lifestyle. I'm healthy and not missing any vitamins/minerals. I eat egg and milk based products and not a strict vegan.

Zero_Ultra · 2017-06-25T19:44:45+00:00

One of the least autistic posts in here but people are getting so mad lmao.

theamazingswayze · 2017-06-25T17:39:04+00:00

It doesn't matter. Why are you asking an online community what to eat?

You know your body. You know your goals. Eat what you want.

I want to stay big and fuel my workouts. I love meat. Do what you want.

iwasbornred · 2017-06-25T17:47:28+00:00

My opinion is that any negatives vegans or vegetarians will associate with meat are not about meat being bad for the body, but people misusing it.

You can have a lower protein intake and still eat meat.

Humans are omnivorous. We evolved eating meat, you should eat meat.

oVerde · 2017-06-25T18:19:48+00:00

Vegetarian here for about 10 years, no problems at all, I keep on with a vegan bodybuilding group (only over the internet, not a bb myself) so to catch up with diet specific themes.

Also as others said before, TRP has nothing on diet specifics so go on with what best suits you.

george-stark · 2017-06-25T18:36:40+00:00

It's posts like this that make me think this sub is going to the dogs. YOU ARE PREDATOR WHO DEADLIFTS! (I hope) You might as well give up pussy because it's 'unhealthy'... FFsake.

russbussdp · 2017-06-25T20:28:50+00:00

Weird timing coming across this now, as my friends and I have been leaning toward a plant based diet. All of the research does provide strong evidence that a plant based diet is the way to go. It is not to say that you should rule out meat completely, but here in the U.S. almost all the animal food products available are shit. This is because of how the United States production philosophy focuses on profit margin first and product quality errr.... somewhere very much further down the line, That being said if you can afford to get your meat products from a rancher or farmer who's livestock doesn't live in a cess pool of their own shit during development and doesn't use drugs on their livestock that would be a reasonable source of animal based protein. Otherwise the evidence shows that a vegan diet is probably the best dietary decision you can make.

From the beginning to the end of our digestive system we are not anatomically equipped to handle meat in large doses. If your'e looking for a reason to go vegan a small amount of research is all you need, but if you are looking for an argument to defend meat consumption I haven't found any yet. I have started a slow transition into ruling out animal based products and within a month or so intend on being 100% plant based diet. If you make the same decision transition slowly to allow your body to adjust as you need to get used to food not being so calorie dense.

A few good movies to watch on Netflix: "What the health" "In defense of food" "Food inc." "What the health," was the one that did it for me and it basically connects the most common morbid health issues in the U.S. with the meat products we consume. "In defense of food" is the most unbiased and doesn't support the idea of omitting meat from the diet, but does cover evidences that a vegan diet consistently leads to a longer lifespan.

This is a very controversial subject and even my friends and I are trying to find loopholes to the evidence, so that we can with good health conscience, continue to consume animal products. The evidence, however, always points us in the other direction.

SamuraiPizzaCatz · 2017-06-25T19:34:36+00:00

Carbs = Glucose = insulin spike = fat loss halted = body fat gain.

Veganism is naturally deficient in so many vitamins, such as D3/K2/B12/Iron, which (mostly) comes from meat. Vegans also have extremely high Omega 6:Omega 3 fatty acid ratios, due to the fact that vegans only have access to Alpha-Linolic-Acid, which is absolutely HORRENDOUS at converting to EPA/DHA, both of which are found readily available in fatty fish.

The Egyptians were almost exclusively vegan, and they also died from heart related issues en masse. Veganism takes the already flawed 'cals in/cals out' logic and throws whatever sanity was involved in it out the window. Your body absolutely does prefer specific sources of vitamins, absolutely does convert different vitamins more/less efficiently, and micronutrients absolutely do matter when looking at overall health.

There's too much correlation between the resurgence of rickets and the rise of veganism to ignore. Rickets, for the unaware, is a disease that deforms leg bones because a diet is too low in K2 and D3, two vitamins extremely important in calcium distribution.

EDIT: Be mad all you want, but when you look these things up you'll see them as fact. Humans have always been designed to eat mainly meat and fat.

Title	Red Pill Consensus on Veganism?
Author	theamazingswayze
Upvotes	0
Comments	81
Date	June 25, 2017 5:25 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/6jfiti/red_pill_consensus_on_veganism/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/red-pill-consensus-on-veganism.44268 https://theredarchive.com/post/44268

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