An apology and some questions.

ImKumarYo · 2011-05-27T02:54:43+00:00

1) It's about being confident in who you are and valuing your time while still being a pleasant guy. You were not valuing your time with this girl when you gave her all of it for nothing in return. It's not a quid pro quo thing but she needs to have earned the right to your time and she didn't. That's why she lost attraction. You could still be nice without listening to her bullshit.

2) Bars. Pre-game and drink water and Red Bull at the bar. Easiest places to find lots of sets and improve fast. Make a couple friends that go out a lot (hopefully fellow sedditors) and get out there.

3) No. Stop trying to salvage anything. The easiest way to get her back is to be as attractive as possible to every female out there. Ignore her and improve yourself. If you do this, you'll be able to get what you want (a chill, non-awkward friendship). Trying to do it right now is only going to fuck with your head. Also, I bet you she's back with, or at least sleeping with, her asshole ex within a week if she's not already. Sorry if that's harsh.

PS Seriously, major props to you for reposting this. Its clear you have a long way to go but it's also very apparent that you're willing to take the necessary action to get where you want to be. Keep it up.

frogma · 2011-05-27T02:57:41+00:00

Shit bro, I wrote a page-long comment for you and then I saw that you deleted the post. Basically everything you did with that girl was coming from a bad mindset. Generally, girls are considered the "prize" and guys chase after that prize. A true alpha male doesn't do that. You have to ask yourself whether you were self-validated, or whether you were externally validated. When you're externally-validated (especially when interacting with a girl), you tend to seek her approval, which is never very attractive. If she's hot and cool, how many other guys do you think have done exactly what you did? Most, if not all of them.

Girls will tell you they want to be treated like princesses- and that's true, they do want to be treated like princesses. But what ends up happening is they'll go after the guy who doesn't necessarily treat her that way. They'll go after a higher-value guy.

As for your own mindset, you were coming from a position of scarcity/neediness. If you want to attract girls more efficiently, you need to come from a position of abundance. Why do players, rock stars, and movie stars get so much pussy? Put simply, it's because they have so many options when it comes to women. Do you think Brad Pitt needs to wine and dine a girl, pay for her affection, and try to win her approval in order for her to fuck him or date him? Not at all. If anything, the girl needs to do those things in order to win his approval (just imagine he's not married- I always use him as an example of the "alpha male").

Several characteristics define a true alpha male- he does what he wants, he's dominant, he has abundance, he's confident, he makes moves, and above all, he doesn't put the pussy on a pedestal, which is basically what you did here. What you did here was more due to insecurity than anything else. True alpha males are secure and self-confident. This kind of thinking is called "inner game"- look through the sidebar to read all about it.

The line between "alpha" and "asshole" is pretty thin, and it's dependent on the mindset. Alphas are self-validated (no ego, or a healthy one at least) while assholes are externally-validated (inflated ego). Both can be successful with women, and both have many "alpha" characteristics. When you're just starting out and trying to go out there and have success, it's generally a good idea to push the envelope and figure out where those boundaries are. Many things that you consider "asshole" behavior may actually just be assertiveness or confidence/self-love. I usually feel a sense of entitlement when it comes to women, which may easily be perceived as douchey to an outside observer, but it works. You should feel supremely confident in yourself and your abilities.
Like chish said, you don't necessarily have to spend money at bars. I get free drinks all the time from random guys and girls. I've also met plenty of girls at concerts before, so you need to get rid of that belief. You're making an assumption that isn't very true in my experience. When you have a limiting belief (which is anything that limits your potential, like "I'm too fat/short" or "There aren't any hot, cool, single girls at concerts"), it'll negatively affect your outlook, and you won't make an effort. Get rid of every limiting belief you have. Write em down if you want- make a huge list of any negative thoughts and tell those thoughts to fuck off.
I'm too lazy to look back at the post and I forget what exactly happened, but generally when you pull "beta" moves like what you did, that's the easiest way to get in the friend-zone. So you can probably make friends with her unless she's really turned-off by you.

Basically everything I've said can be found in the sidebar, and you can look at the Top posts all-time on seddit.

2011-05-27T04:53:03+00:00

Girls like nice guys too, just not weak guys. Most "nice" guys are weak guys, and so the two get unfortunately bundled together, but it doesn't have to be that way. I used to be a weak guy growing up that felt more comfortable just going along with whatever people wanted. When I started to come into myself, I remained a genuinely good person but stopped letting people trample me. The thing you need to get in your head is that most girls like to sit back and let the guy call all the shots. It's normal. You don't have to become an asshole, just become comfortable taking the reigns and occasionally calling bullshit when you see it. I think Joe Rogan had it right when he said "The goal in life is to be as nice as humanly possible to people without getting walked on". Totally possible to be a nice alpha. I constantly run into asshole alphas out at the bar and can't recall one instance where any of them have been able to out game me being the "nice" guy.

2011-05-27T01:55:08+00:00

You don't HAVE to drink at a bar. And, hey, as your game improves, maybe you can get girls to buy you drinks. ;)

n0c0ntr0l · 2011-05-27T02:30:02+00:00

First of all, it is perfectly possible to be alpha without being a douche. It's not about being UNHELPFUL, you simply give value to those who you know will give it back to you. You aren't an asshole/douche you just respect yourself and are confident.

Secondly you don't have to drink. Seriously, you can get by completely sober. Actually sometimes drinking can hold you back, rather than actually getting out and approaching its so easy to be like oh, lets go and get one more drink. Just approach.

Thirdly, if the girl "friend zoned" you (I dislike this term greatly) be friends with her. And then get her to introduce you to her other friends and go for them instead. Abundance mentality.

CharismaWithaK · 2011-05-27T04:52:53+00:00

Thanks for the suggestions so far. I've been working on my self-esteem issues - tied to my weight and past failures - by working out and generally changing my outlook on life. I'm also getting a new haircut next week to make myself look prettier :D My Philosophy major friend has been teaching me about the concept of the subjective universe, and that actually fits really well with abundance theory and the concept of a healthy ego.

My one issue is that I have essentially 3 IRL friends (well, four now, I worked it out with that girl. Hooray I guess?). Two of them are enormously antisocial and one of them, despite already having a girlfriend, would be a pretty terrible wingman. I'd feel really awkward going to a bar solo, so what do I do?

Dorman010 · 2011-05-27T07:55:59+00:00

Okay, I'm going to address mostly your first point, being alpha, as that seems the most important one to me:

What are the characteristics of the alpha male? It's not necessarily being a douchebag - it's about being a fucking MAN. Most of those assholes who get girls get them not because women want to be treated poorly, but because they have testosterone. They are men. However, it's perfectly possible to be alpha and also be nice (a.k.a. the good guy). In my opinion, these are the characteristics:

Leader of men - you are the leader of the group. The women will follow.
Protector of loved ones - you're good to your friends. That's value right there, showing you're not some bastard who'll use everyone and everything to get where he wants and then discard them.
Sexually active - even if you're not at the moment, as Mystery said - fake it till you make it. Act as if you've got another dozen women waiting in line, just for you. That's the Abundance Mentality.
Won't take anyone's crap - whether it's a woman or a man, you're not gonna take it. If someone will treat you like crap, don't take it. This is the vast majority of being self-confident and alpha, imo.

Actually, I'll also address your other two points:

Where to meet potential partners? EVERYWHERE. You seem like the ultimate AFC. Average Frustrated Chump. You need to get out there, though, do whatever you want - running, swimming, I don't car. You don't have to be home alone save for when getting high or drunk. Hell, organize a house party!

As for the friendship - give it some time to rest. The memory is still fresh in her mind. Give her space. Think about it - how would you act if a girl you weren't attracted to sexually, but was a good friend, would suddenly declare her undying love to you, and after you reject her she keeps on wanting to hang out with you? Probably something along the lines of "OH SHI-, I'M OUT OF HERE, GET AWAY FROM ME! NOT INTERESTED!" That being said, just offer her to hang out together once for whatever reason, and act as if nothing's happened. Also, try not to be her emotional tampon (they guy who's always there to be the shoulder to cry on, etc.)

calicontact · 2011-05-27T12:53:14+00:00

There is great stuff in these comments so I won't rehash. Read and learn as much as you can here but most importantly go out and meet people.

Title	An apology and some questions.
Author	CharismaWithaK
Upvotes	2
Comments	11
Date	May 27, 2011 1:42 AM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/hl5dq/an_apology_and_some_questions/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/an-apology-and-some-questions.1318720 https://theredarchive.com/post/1318720

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