Why I can't take you seriously.

Didn't thought it would be this long. I think it's worth the read though.

Hello everyone, I came to this sub looking to better understand what Men's Rights was about. I thought it was the men version of feminism, people who focus on issues specific to males.

So I went through the top posts to see what are the most popular opinions here and looked at the comments too. Here are my impressions:

First page: For the first posts, it was all things I could agree with. Sexism toward men, male rape, gender role and how it affects men, double standars, the issue of false rape accusations, in short, issues that affect men or mostly men.

Then, as I scrolled down, different topics came up. More and more, it was posts dissing feminists and the double standard ones were turning into women blaming for men issues. Theses post were a minority but when looking at the comments, I couldn't see a post where there were less than ten mentions of feminism and there was a lot of female blaming.

Second page: It's were I started to think that this sub was on the wrong track. Still some good posts. But a lot of post were simply bashing feminism without any link to men issues. Not only that but more post were irrational; one would use the same logic to prove men were victims that they dismiss in another post and in the comments. Feminist would be blamed in an issue they had nothing to do about. For the comments, still the same than previously.

As I scrolled through the pages, it got worse. Majority of claims weren't supported by reliable sources or were based on faulty logic. Also, the post concerning feminism were now in majority. The sub should almost be named /r/I_am_a_victim_more_than_you at that point. I stopped and decided to post to explain my view.

First regarding feminism. The goal of feminism is to attain equality with men by focusing on women issues such as salarial inequality, less representation in high position in companies or abortion. It is not to castrate men and establish a feminocracy. I see you coming on this one: "But (name) clearly hates men and she is a feminist". That's not a feminist that's an idiot. Just like MRAs who claim that women who lie about rape should be gang raped and executed. Would you simply call them "extremist MRAs"? no, you would probably agree that such people are complete idiots incapable of reasoning.

Now I find it absurd that feminists are blamed for "ignoring" male problems. Well, I have news for you, that's because that's not what feminism is about. If they would focus on men issues, they would be MRAs. If they would focus on issues affecting both genders, they would be gender egalitarians. But they are feminists and just like you, they focus on gender specific issues.

Now a claim that I see often is something like "feminists are the reason for the problem of false rape claim" or some other issues. Why? Why blame a group of people for something they are not responsible. You may say that those issues came along with the empowerment of women and in some cases I would agree with you. But do we want to go back to when women weren't believed when they were raped or do we want to point out to the media and the justice system who will crucify accused people on the public place before seeing any proof?

If feminism seems to oppose men and to be the cause of men's problems, maybe it is because 100 years ago women couldn't vote, that in the 50s and the 60s they could be beaten or raped by their husband and no one would give a shit. There's a reason why women started getting child support more easily and why we tended to overprotect them. Does the system needs to be adapted to modern times? Probaly. Does that means that feminists want to eradicate men? No.

Actually, I think men issues comes from one thing: gender role. That's not just a feminism thing. That's the root of all the "men can't get raped, they like it", "men are expected to provide for their family alone" and the goddamn worst of all, "Man up". That's why when someone says "rapist" it's always the image of a man that comes to mind. That's why single fathers get weird looks and can't raise their child without being labeled a pedophile. That's why the kid who likes pink and who sings britney spears get beaten by the others in school. That's why we are failures if we can't give a woman five orgasms in a row. Or if we don't know shit avout mechanics. Or if we don't like sports. Or beer. Or drunkenly talking about tits. Or fight someone in a bar. Or rare steak.

And this is a social mentality we have to change, not an agenda pushed by "feminazis". If I had to guess, dammit I'd say it's mainly men's fault if we are expected to fit the definition of a man that much. Just look at how reddit glorify Ron Swanson or Overly Manly Man. The people who will tell you to "man up" if you cry during a movies, are probably your male friends.

Now here's the thing, gender roles are also a problematic that feminists work on. Hypersexualisation of women, girls practicing sports, restriction in some professional fields, etc. also have gender roles as a root. You guys fight each other when you have the same god damned problem! [This picture]( sums it up pretty well.

There is no point in blaming feminists. Get to the real problem. I've seen posts of people standing their ground and explaining why something is unnacceptable and why it is sexism. That is awesome. Shit like this? That's big bullshit, /u/misingnoglic puts it well in the comments.

Instead of fighting feminists, educate people on MR issues. Until you do this, I can't take your movement seriously.

I intended to simply rant about some logicall fallacy and anti-feminism, turned out longer than I thought.

TL;DR: You won't get anywhere fighting feminism. Try focusing on the real problems and working altogether to fix common issues. But seriously, I can't summarize all this shit in two lines so read the damned thing.

Also, you might want to visit /r/genderegalitarian. I'm surprised it isn't included in the related subreddits and it has some good quality posts. Here are some post I got there that sums up my post quite well.

http://i.imgur.com/rdCGx.gif

http://i.imgur.com/RxO2N.png

EDIT: I would like to clarify, I didn't mean to blame the MRM for the conflict with feminists, only to state that it is deplorable.