Pulling attention and commitment vs stonewalling like a bitch.

man_in_the_world · 2022-01-31T22:50:02+00:00

It usually ends with me saying “I don’t want to talk to you about this right now.” I say this in a calm, stoic voice but it’s clear to us both I am very pissed off. Sometimes, when I’m playing with my children without her, she will try to involve herself in the game, resulting in me separating myself from the game.

Did I just find a more elaborate way to stonewall like a bitch?

Yes, you did.

Your frame on the withdrawal of time and attention is still all wrong. You're viewing this as applying a punishment for her, which is operating from a perspective centered in her frame. The intent of withdrawing time and attention is not punishment for her; the point is maximizing value for you. You are a competent, capable, desirable man whose time, effort, and attention brings value... foremost to yourself, but also to others (such as your kids, friends, colleagues, other women) who both desire and appreciate it, and who also may provide value in return. If your wife (or anyone else) is being unpleasant or not providing value to you in return for your investment of your valuable time and attention, you naturally shift your time and attention to other activities and people creating more value and return... Not specifically to punish her, but to maximize the return to you or your missions.

Do you see how this latter view is centered in your frame, instead of in hers?

This perspective also informs how you should deal with her attempts to re-engage you. If I'm doing the dishes and she wants to engage in even inane conversation... sure, no problem, because it doesn't interfere with my value-production. If I'm playing games with the kids and she wants to join in, sure, but she can't change the game. But if I'm doing something that requires too much concentration to engage in casual conversation, then I'll put her off until I am finished with such tasks.

If she wants more of my time and attention, she can get it by the same way anybody else does... by offering more pleasant, stimulating, and important interactions that bring more value to me or my missions.

Tyred_Biggums · 2022-02-01T01:17:11+00:00

This would eventually turn into her asking me what my problem is followed by massive amounts of gaslighting on her part and DEERing on my part until I eventually get worn out and give up.

Why the fuck do you care? You're trying to push button "A" to get a result "B" from her. Time and attention is natural because you WANT to be around her. If you don't... then you don't.

I am very pissed off.

This is your big problem. You're getting your emotions manipulated by her. So who is the one driving the narrative AKA frame of your life? It's not you...

Praexology · 2022-02-01T03:55:17+00:00

The purpose of pulling time and attention is to ensure your personal environment, mentally and physically, is enjoyable and peaceful. If she wants back in, don't torture her by playing hot and cold with readmittance unless you simply want to torture her. But that is more for yourself then for her at that point.

I felt she needed to see that I’m pissed off.

Why did she need to see it? This is a covert contract.

If she sees that I'm mad, then she'll try to fix it because she'll be scared I may divorce her.

Quit trying to put on a show for her - that means both acting excessively P.O.'d, or acting calm simply to be seen as acting calm. If you do, you are simply entertainment theatre for her.

The issue comes when she tries to actively seek me out to initiate conversation just for the sake of talking. It usually ends with me saying “I don’t want to talk to you about this right now.” I say this in a calm, stoic voice but it’s clear to us both I am very pissed off.

Acting. Just theatre.

If you don't want to spend time with her because she hurt your feelings, simply tell her you don't want to. Then don't. No need to give her a reason. If she asks politely, and you both want to, and discern that she is asking because she genuinely wants to know then tell her.

Sometimes, when I’m playing with my children without her, she will try to involve herself in the game, resulting in me separating myself from the game.

Why? You are living in her antiframe like a child with oppositional defiance disorder. I bet she could say something like "I would be SO mad if you gave me a foot rub and made me dinner." And just to spite her, you'd do it. Idiot.

This method does result in her correcting her bullshit

Maybe, but it is unattractive and has a shelf life as a strategy. Right now she may feel the dread of losing you, but if you keep doing it soon she will be happy to leave you: a pathetic sad little boy.

BobbyPeru · 2022-01-31T21:17:27+00:00

Wtf bro… you are misunderstanding pretty much every term you used. I don’t even know where to start.

Removing time and attention doesn’t mean you evade talking to her about things. If you don’t like something, have a fucking conversation.

RedGrass411 · 2022-01-31T21:24:40+00:00

Go Rambo go.

high-end-butt-hurt · 2022-01-31T21:40:44+00:00

Dread is something you do, it’s something you create. You become attractive, cool, charismatic, valuable in HER EYES, that SHE DREADS losing you.

How long have you been reading/lurking? You still seem angry. I found it helpful to go one tool at a time, so STFU, Frame, etc.

redwall92 · 2022-01-31T20:57:09+00:00

The issue comes when she tries to actively seek me out to initiate conversation just for the sake of talking. It usually ends with me saying “I don’t want to talk to you about this right now.”

Not following ... do you ever entertain the concept of "conversation just for the sake of talking"?

K1ngOfClubs · 2022-02-03T04:25:30+00:00

Thanks, everyone, for the advice and proverbial ass-kicking. I definitely have a lot of work to do.

mabden · 2022-01-31T21:31:05+00:00

|when I’m playing with my children without her, she will try to involve herself in the game, resulting in me separating myself from the game.

I don't see where this is a problem. She wants to participate with her husband and child. This is not "her bullshit." Why "separate" yourself from this opportunity to have some fun. To belabor the point, is there some rule that only one parent can engage with the child at a time?

red-sfpplus · 2022-01-31T21:00:35+00:00

GTFO and STFU on your lifts.

Next teapot

Visual_Pack_2206 · 2022-02-01T13:04:17+00:00

I’ve dealt with this same issue of needing validation and then being passive aggressive to punish bad behavior.

What’s helping me massively so far is to be disconnected from the outcome. Just be me in my world. No doing A passively in hopes that it’ll get me B. Just do what I want, being disconnected from outcomes, while acknowledging that her actions are like the weather—it comes and goes less based on what I do, and more so based on however she’s feeling.

For example, if I want to touch my wife, I do it out of desire. If she’s offended, I gauge if I want to push through her offense, or just chill. It’s about what I want. If I’m not interested in pushing through resistance at that time, I can do whatever I want. No hard feelings. However, if I am interested in making love to her/fucking her (depending on the mood), I’ll focus on my desire and do it acknowledging the “rain and thunder” of her logical mind (instead of getting mad at the clouds) and focusing on arousing her base desires as woman.

Desire inspires desire. Bitching inspires bitching.

It’s a process for sure and I’m no grand master (yet), but for me praying/meditating when I’m out of that frame and then reassuming it so I’m either in “mission” mode to achieve my life goals or “desire” mode where I’m pursuing my wants fills the gap that bitching/validation seeking would occupy otherwise.

Title	Pulling attention and commitment vs stonewalling like a bitch.
Author	K1ngOfClubs
Upvotes	6
Comments	19
Date	January 31, 2022 8:54 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/askMRP
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/shbwh2/pulling_attention_and_commitment_vs_stonewalling/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/askMRP/pulling-attention-and-commitment-vs-stonewalling.1098639 https://theredarchive.com/post/1098639

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