~ archived since 2018 ~

Wow. Just Wow. :OP/ED: Feminism: we've come a long way ... but we're not even close to there yet

[deleted]

March 9, 2010

22 upvotes

/r/MensRights

http://castlegarsource.com/node/4939

Download the post

Want to save the post for offline use on your device? Choose one of the download options below:

PDF TXT EPUB

Post Information

Title	Wow. Just Wow. :OP/ED: Feminism: we've come a long way ... but we're not even close to there yet
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	22
Comments	48
Date	March 9, 2010 6:03 PM UTC (16 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/bb8dy/wow_just_wow_oped_feminism_weve_come_a_long_way/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/wow-just-wow-oped-feminism-weve-come-a-long-way.1050439 https://theredarchive.com/post/1050439

Comments

[–]rememberence 19 points20 points21 points 16 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[–]XFDRaven 9 points10 points11 points 16 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 16 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Gareth321 5 points6 points7 points 16 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]cryptogirl 9 points10 points11 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]XFDRaven 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]cryptogirl 5 points6 points7 points 16 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]XFDRaven -5 points-4 points-3 points 16 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 16 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

It may seem nicer although at least when these women talk about "Men are evil and wicked" they are being more honest with themselves and with us.

She talks about equality and yet she still perpetuates bullshit statistics about DV and fails to consider male circumcision as genital mutilation. Basically she knows nothing about men's rights, she is just parroting the usual delusional shit about gender roles while at the same time reinforcing some of the most barbed and pointed forms of anti-male feminist propaganda.

Worst of all she aproaches the subject of men's rights within a frame of "Feminism is not about female supremacy – it's about equality." I've said it many times now but feminism has been borderling on a hate movement against men for half a century now. If a feminist starts talking about men's rights and wishes to be taken seriously this has to be acknowledged, just turning up and declaring that feminism is all about equality is not indicative of any serious attempt to bridge the gap between these two group, and remedy the situation.

Fundamentally though like most feminists she knows she is on a sinking ship, she knows there are no excuses left to be made for women like her and she knows that given a few years she will be perceived as a dinosaur and dismissed as a petty sexist twit. This is why feminists are desperately trying to retain some credibility by associating themselves with a movement that is fueld by more then just their own propaganda.

[+][deleted] 16 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 16 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]MrInvisible 4 points5 points6 points 16 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't think your point really stands. It isn't intellectually honest to take the most offensive people who self identify with a label and use it to characterize everyone else who also uses that label. Religion illustrates this perfectly. For example, does calling yourself a Christian mean you support the murder of abortion doctors and laws that enshrine your religion in the apparatus of the state? If you don't support those things are you no longer a Christian, just because a few whackjobs do?

I agree with you that if someone says they are a christian I will give them the benefit of the doubt, I will not presume them to be card carrying george bush supporting war mongerers.

Having said that I also think that there is something inherently wrong with the abrahamic religions, also I do think it says something negative about a person who buy's into an abrahamic ideology.

In the end this whole argument is a bunch of meaningless hand-waving about a label, not about ideas.

I'd say it's about the ideology and the movement behind the label which I perceive as being inherently sexist and un- egalitarian.

I don't care if they call themselves Thetans as long as they support equality.

And I do not believe they do, despite their claims.

[–]ignatiusloyola 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 16 years ago* (25 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[+][deleted] 16 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[+][deleted] 16 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]MrInvisible 1 point2 points3 points 16 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]MrInvisible 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Patriarchy outside of the strict definition of male rule is pretty silly.

Who do boys socialize with? Other boys. Who ostracizes them if they don't follow the very limited social norms set by the group? The other boys. Linking that to sexual politics seems like a bit of a stretch. Until the teen years there is very little contact between the groups, and I have yet to meet a woman who is put off by a man who turns away from the male life script. At least, not enough to try and get him socially isolated.

A good example of why it's not all about impressing women is gay men. They have to be careful about who they reveal their status to, and not because they're afraid of losing female attention. Some men get really homophobic because they feel threatened when a guy behaves differently. So what do men do? They try to reinforce the acceptable range of behaviors. Social isolation is a powerful tool.

[–]cfisi79 1 point2 points3 points 16 years ago (18 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 16 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]cfisi79 1 point2 points3 points 16 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 16 years ago* (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]cfisi79 3 points4 points5 points 16 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Texas. Strict life-scripters here, and the pressure on women to follow it, is pretty heavy. No kids, you're unnatural, and selfish. Kids/work, you're a negligent mother. Kids/home, you're either lazy/not contributing financially, or not modern ("stuck in the '50s"). The only way to not have someone disapprove of your lifestyle is if you have the kids/work-from-home combo.

I didn't know if men get the pressure to marry/procreate. Also didn't know if the "make more money" pressure was there, prior, and I just never had the opportunity to witness it. I've seen a little of the "male doesn't make enough money" pressure, and I've only seen it once wife/kids are already established. So, I was just wondering.

You're absolutely right about fathers staying home still being rather taboo, though. I think it'll have to take a lot more men pushing for it, to make it mainstream, though. With more career minded women, I think there's a good potential to make that happen. There's always going to be criticism when people buck traditional gender roles, but it would be worth it to expand choices.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 16 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]cfisi79 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]MrInvisible 3 points4 points5 points 16 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 16 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]rmbarnes 2 points3 points4 points 16 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]cfisi79 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]rmbarnes -1 points0 points1 point 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 16 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 16 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]justpickaname 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]Il128[🍰] 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]justpickaname 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ignatiusloyola 2 points3 points4 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 16 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]MrInvisible 2 points3 points4 points 16 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]cryptogirl 3 points4 points5 points 16 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]MrInvisible 2 points3 points4 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]rmbarnes -1 points0 points1 point 16 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link