I watched a Ted Talk today from Gina Martin and she had a very good rebuttal to the "Not All Men" comment. This comment too often derails the subjects concerning the way too many men treat women and often pops up on this sub.
Her response was "No, not all men, but too many". I think "too many men" is a great phrase to add to this community and to every issue being derailed by "not all men". It's also a good way to start the conversation to prevent the use of "not all men" to begin with.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_K_n-x-W7pY&ab_channel=TEDxTalks
Edit: Changed the wording to better get my point across and to use the new phrase!
Also added the link to the video
Original wording posted in commets
[–]Lady-Lummox 30 points31 points32 points (5 children) | Copy Link
That sub is so pathetic.
[–]DistrictAccurate 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
Yes. This post in particular is not even that bad, but the implications of some statements that get huge upvotes there are quick to destroy any hope one had that anybody would actually give the slightest f about men.
[–]Frosty-Gate-8094 -2 points-1 points0 points (3 children) | Copy Link
Since when asking for your rights became pathetic? Or you think only women have the right to ask for rights?
And men should resign to be second class citizens.
[–]Lady-Lummox 12 points13 points14 points (2 children) | Copy Link
I meant twoxchromosomes is pathetic, not this sub.
[–]Frosty-Gate-8094 9 points10 points11 points (1 child) | Copy Link
Oh..sorry.. My bad.I misunderstood.
[–]Lady-Lummox 9 points10 points11 points (0 children) | Copy Link
No problem :)
[–]SultanSaatana 20 points21 points22 points (0 children) | Copy Link
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-47738892
Too many women falsely accuse men of rape.
Jemma Baele claimed she was sexually assaulted by six men and raped by nine over the space of three years.
[–]TacticusThrowaway 8 points9 points10 points (0 children) | Copy Link
If your generalization can be 'derailed' by someone correctly pointing out it's sexist, you were, by definition, wrong to begin with.
All "derail" means is "not the way the discussion was supposed to go". It's not inherently wrong, especially coming from a movement which regularly derails things itself.
So in other words, replacing one emotional argument that blames all men with another, subjective emotional argument that blames all men ? Brilliant, Holmes.
People paid money for that? It's not even an original goalpost-move.
[–]ralphswanson 5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
Feminists, who claim to fight against stereotypes, silencing those who criticize the stereotypes that feminists promote. Substitute any politically correct group, such as blacks, for men in feminists tracts and get clear hate speech.
[–]mmpro55 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
Too many women complain.
Yes, we get it Becky. Society's expectations are so demanding. Men are so cruel. It's hard to push through with your daily coffees from starbucks, cushy air conditioned job, and stellar educational background. How is possible to live through all the oppression that you've not directly experienced but are sure exists because everyone says it's there?
[–]Pariah-6 2 points3 points4 points (2 children) | Copy Link
Wow, what the fuck is that sub? I’ve been on Reddit for three years now and I’ve never came across that sub. Fucking insane shit happening in there.
[–]girraween 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
It’s very man hatey. Even some women I’ve chatted to on reddit hate that place.
It’s a place where they generalise men and if you disagree you’re apart of the problem.
It’s a hate sub.
[–]Bentendo24 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
i’ve seen that insane sub come up TOO MANY times. reddit is extremely unfair to keep that subreddit up while shutting down other subreddits they don’t see as “appropriate”.
[–]bufedad 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
"Not all men" isn't about derailing, it's about pointing out bigoted statements about men.
[–]d_nijmegen 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
Too many is our new buzzword? OK skipmeisha's, well use it to our benefit
[–]TacticusThrowaway 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
People like this never expect to be held to their own standards.
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
So stupid.
[+]AreYou4RealM8 -6 points-5 points-4 points (10 children) | Copy Link
Everyone in the world agrees that too many men are assaulting women or being sexist. How is this controversial at all?
Whether its 1 percent, 5 percent, or 80 percent...its too many. I would think everyone agrees with that.
[–]TehReedster89 13 points14 points15 points (6 children) | Copy Link
The contentious point is that they are using this to justify treating men worse. They want to say things like, "Men are abusers". But people call them out on their sexism by saying, "No, not all men are abusers. Stop generalizing us all as the worst of any of us." So they shift the goalposts a little and say, "Okay fine, not all men, but too many," so that they can continue generalizing men as abusers.
That is not okay. That is not defensible.
[+]AreYou4RealM8 -7 points-6 points-5 points (5 children) | Copy Link
So you think it is indefensible to say things like 'too many women commit false rape allegations'? Or too many women dont care about male problems?
You find those statements indefensible?
This post itself says too many women disassociate from suffering by men. Is that indefensible?
[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
if it's being used in relation to generalizing and justification of mistreatment of women... Then yes
[–]Nath43673 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
As TehReedster89 points out, it is a rhetorical strategy that falls somewhere between incendiary and dishonest.
Consider this sequence:
The goal isn't to arrive at point 3. It is to be able to continue to make point 1 and have a "gotcha" comeback should anyone try to respond with point 2.
[–]mhandanna 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
it also does this:
https://becauseits2015.wordpress.com/2016/08/19/methods-for-downplaying-or-side-stepping-violence-against-men/
[–]mhandanna 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
Well if people were going into schools and telling 4 year old girls specifically in a billion dollar backed programme not to be false accusers, and blaming notions of femininity on this, yes I would have a problem.
Your also wrong...Feminist >>>DO<< find those statements you said incredibly indefensible. So you just defeated your own argument.They protest against people saying that, take legal action against people saying it, often use violence against people who say that and stop them from speaking. I mean I can post 100 clips of feminists doing this on YouTube if you want? They write extensively about it, they try to minimise and downplay false accusations as much as possible and so on.
[–]TacticusThrowaway 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A99G6O721gA
[–]Bentendo24 2 points3 points4 points (1 child) | Copy Link
this retard just said 1 percent or 5 percent is too many lol
[–]AreYou4RealM8 -1 points0 points1 point (0 children) | Copy Link
What do you think the right number of women being raped is in a year? How many rapes on a year is the amount you think is right?
[–]Mister_historious 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link