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New Zealand: New sexual violence court proposed

Ted8367

December 14, 2015
24 upvotes
/r/MensRights
http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/national/292105/new-sexual-violence-court-proposed
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Post Information
Title New Zealand: New sexual violence court proposed
Author

Ted8367

Upvotes 24
Comments 20
Date December 14, 2015 3:16 AM UTC
(10 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/3wqgkn/new_zealand_new_sexual_violence_court_proposed/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/new-zealand-new-sexual-violence-court-proposed.965221
https://theredarchive.com/post/965221
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Comments

[–]unpicked-username 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

WOMEN dont want to be revictimised in court?

What about men?

[–]Buffard43 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

the last sentence.

Ms Adams said at the time she would rule out reforms that would see the burden of proof fall on the defendant.

[–]Ted8367[S] 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

She's just been on the news making it a point to say the same thing again.

[–]TheDude41 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link

This is the reform that would see the burden of proof fall on the defendant.

[+][deleted] 10 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]TheDude41 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

There would be no reason for people like this to establish a "sexual violence court" unless they were interested in increasing convictions, which effectively means the same thing as eroding presumptions of innocence in comparison to other crimes.

[+][deleted] 10 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Some basic presumptions of the court are suspect, though.

What do you think it means when they say the new court won't be as hard on victims? It means the normal right to challenge and cross examine your accuser is going to take a hit, because it's precisely that aggressive defense that "re-victimizes" them in the docket. They don't want to have to actually argue to prove their case. Victims of other crimes have to, but apparently rape victims are a special, more fragile breed of victim than the rest.

You don't have to totally toss the notion of presumed innocence in order to water down the defense's ability to truly defend their client.

Plus, this new court would only come into play if the accused actually admits to the crime, so there's a real prospect that the court won't see any cases. Who the hell would sign up for a court that doesn't allow true cross examination and where you're admitting guilt on the way in? You'd have to be daft.

[–]TheDude41 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Victims already get guarantees of anonymity, and are routinely not prosecuted when they are proven to be lying in a rape accusation.

The court system already bends backwards for women, quite inappropriately I might add, and the system is quite tenuous, with men routinely being let out for having been convicted of crimes they did not commit, which is inexcusable.

There is no legitimate reason to create a two-tiered justice system which privileges certain victims over others. The basic tenets of justice are the same. There should be no "separate but equal" allowed in the criminal justice system.

End of story.

[–]roharareddit 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Moving the prosecution of sexual assault claims out of the criminal justice system can only mean one thing: the erosion of due process.

[–]dontpet 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

So, time for kangaroo courts in NZ?

[–]roharareddit 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Yup, that's pretty much it.

[–]dontpet 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Note that I've read it doesn't seem to bad. Allowing for a more informal process should the victim wish seems good on the face of it. Reconciliation and compassion.

Will wait and see.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

The article cites that the entry point for the process is two parts, the first being that the victim wants that route, but the second is that the accused agrees to it and part of that agreement is an acceptance of guilt. This is nothing more than a standardized plea bargain system, where if you publicly admit that you're guilty up front (whether you are or not), you can possibly evade the worst penalties.

Given the low rates of successful prosecution of these crimes, what man would volunteer guilt?

[–]dontpet 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes. And given the social implications of pleading guilty to rape that doesn't sound like a wise course to Me for any defendant.

At first I thought they were setting up something that would address with regret sex and instance where there was genuine misunderstanding. I can't see this working as it is currently shaped.

[–]ZimbaZumba 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I skimmed through the report and frankly I wonder whether Democracy and civilised Criminal Justice Systems are going to be around in the near future.

We are being driven by the loudest voices and not principle.

[–]TheDude41 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Damseling, chivalry are shit.

[–]prybarn 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Maybe they should ask Spain how their special courts are going.

[–]dontpet 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

How are they going?

[–]prybarn 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

http://www.cafebabel.co.uk/society/article/spain-gender-violence-what-about-abused-men.html

http://www.avoiceformen.com/feminism/government-tyranny/spanish-gender-stalinism-part-i/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GjgBfklmYj8

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