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Where questionable feminist pay gap statistics come from

smeltaway

January 22, 2020
22 upvotes
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
https://www.vox.com/2019/2/20/18232762/gender-diversity-tech-bad-research-recruiting-new-york-times
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Post Information
Title Where questionable feminist pay gap statistics come from
Author

smeltaway

Upvotes 22
Comments 17
Date January 22, 2020 1:55 AM UTC
(6 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/es4zz9/where_questionable_feminist_pay_gap_statistics/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/where-questionable-feminist-pay-gap-statistics.1064133
https://theredarchive.com/post/1064133
Red Pill terms in post
feminist
Top posts by smeltaway

At 22 Alexander Johnson was suspended from the Tenn football team after being falsely accused of rape. He was a 1st round talent but was never drafted. At 26, he was acquitted and joined the Denver Broncos. He played his way into the starting lineup, proved his worth and now is a starting MLB/ILB.

2867 upvotes
October 18, 2020
/r/MensRights

Shaming and condemning men who are strong and powerful as representations of "toxic masculinity" while promoting the exact same traits for women is not equality.

2232 upvotes
September 26, 2020
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In the UK, the rate of women identifying as feminist fell from 46% in 2017 to 27% in 2020

699 upvotes
March 26, 2021
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The World Economic Forum's Gender Gap Index is specifically constructed so that it can never show a female advantage

568 upvotes
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The idea that we can simply be "free from gender norms" is probably not accurate. Science shows humans develop and enforce norms naturally, subconsciously and illogically from an an early age.

256 upvotes
October 23, 2020
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If the Johnny Depp case has shown us anything, its that men need to stick together and support each other...we're certainly not going to get it from anywhere else.

226 upvotes
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Feminism Magazine's Feminism 101 defines toxic masculinity as: "physically strong, unsentimental, and assertive". Here's the science to prove all of those are good for you. (Seriously, even unsentimental is a net positive).

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Comments

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 20 points21 points22 points 6 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

On two different occasions, Speak With a Geek presented the same 5,000 candidates to the same group of employers. The first time around, details like names, experience and background were provided. Five percent selected for interviews were women.

You can guess what happened next, right? When identifying details were suppressed, that figure jumped to 54 percent.

They got 11x more interviews after removing work experience?

And they refuse to release the actual data and methodology?

Yeah. Sounds like typical feminist science. They're so far removed from actual science they can't even do a good job faking a study.

[–]PsychoPhilosopher 6 points7 points8 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Makes sense if the employers looked at the poorly faked experience and background and were immediately turned off.

No Control Group: Not Science.

[–]Aaod 2 points3 points4 points 6 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Yeah. Sounds like typical feminist science. They're so far removed from actual science they can't even do a good job faking a study.

I want to see a university put a math and statistics department next to a gender studies department just because I want to see the resulting fireworks.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 2 points3 points4 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Math is a white patriarchal constructs.

All those ancient Greeks and Renaissance Europeans.

They reject it for femath. Which is more feelings based.

And by more I mean exclusively.

[–]Aaod 1 point2 points3 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The sad thing is I could actually see this being argued at universities now a days.

[–]Strikester101 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, that's too vague to infer whether discrimination is in play.

[–]plitox_is_a_bitch 18 points19 points20 points 6 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I find the whole "why women leave employment" topic rather disingenuous.

It seems to imply:

1) Work is actually fun and good (it's fucking not)

2) There's no good reason to leave work - no one would ever leave work by choice.

[–]smeltaway[S] 7 points8 points9 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Hah yeah. By this logic no one would ever retire

[–]plitox_is_a_bitch 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It's feminist circular logic:

They state they've never been afforded the opportunity to work in full-time, professional employment, yet somehow they're still qualified to speak about what it's like to work in full-time, professional employment.

I imagine this where a lot of the friction comes from.

[–]Oncefa2left-wing male advocate 5 points6 points7 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If anything, maybe women are empowered, through traditional and modern gender roles, to be able to leave work by their own choice and for their own benefit.

These studies should look at when women leave work and whether or not marriage has anything to do with it.

[–]plitox_is_a_bitch 2 points3 points4 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

At one of my jobs they called these women "checkout chicks" - nothing to do with supermarkets or retail.

No, it's because as soon as they got married, they'd check out of work.

If anything, maybe women are empowered, through traditional and modern gender roles, to be able to leave work by their own choice and for their own benefit.

There's no penalty for any choice they make: for the most part unlike men, women aren't obligated to a specific gender role, and are neither wholly condemned or praised for any choice.

These studies should look at when women leave work and whether or not marriage has anything to do with it.

And marriage, of course, is itself a personal choice the woman makes, nothing to do with work or her employer.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Work is actually fun and good (it's fucking not)

That really depends on what you do for work though.

There's no good reason to leave work - no one would ever leave work by choice.

There are good reasons to leave work and people do leave work by choice.

[–]Dunkolunko 10 points11 points12 points 6 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Vox is questioning stats that support the feminist narrative? Well I won't say I'm all that impressed... but I am pleasantly surprised.

[–]Oncefa2left-wing male advocate 9 points10 points11 points 6 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

Probably about as close as they can get while still being published.

There are studies showing that hiring recruiters prefer female candidates, sometimes by a fairly large margin (like by a factor of two), and that blind recruiting greatly benefits men because it removes anti-male biases from the hiring process. But those studies weren't mentioned.

The kind of research those companies were claiming to do has actually been done, and in a proper, scientific manner:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-30/bilnd-recruitment-trial-to-improve-gender-equality-failing-study/8664888?pfmredir=sm

Instead they talked about that orchestra study over and over again like the 40 years that took place after it was implemented didn't have any effect. After all, women might simply be 5% more likely to go into music today, four decades later. There's no proof that their hiring procedures actually led to this change.

[–]magus678 6 points7 points8 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Instead they talked about that orchestra study over and over again like the 40 years that took place after it was implemented didn't have any effect.

The orchestra study itself was bunk

https://reason.com/2019/10/22/orchestra-study-blind-auditions-gelman/

[–]SculptorAndMaterial 6 points7 points8 points 6 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

The pay gap talking point I always felt was forced to get more women into the workforce (to demand/work more hours) for more labour, like how cigarets were advertised as empowering and sticking it to male society in the early days. Of course cigarettes kill you slowly and one could argue work will too.

Personally I don't work much, just to get by and save a little, and I have personally taken much time off because I like free time. This is a result of a relatively low paying job and less money for me. And I'm fine with that. People should value their health more than their money, because health (at some point) can't be bought. This is also why I don't smoke: earlier death, shittier last years.

[–]Strikester101 -1 points0 points1 point 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Can someone summarize the findings of the study?

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