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Announcement: Sodypop & kloo2yoo now mod /r/feminism:we've agreed on a minimal intervention policy

kloo2yoo · 2011-04-28T20:04:16+00:00

More to come. I encourage subscribers to come with facts, and ready to duke it out....

kloo2yoo

April 28, 2011

4 upvotes

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Post Information

Title	Announcement: Sodypop & kloo2yoo now mod /r/feminism:we've agreed on a minimal intervention policy
Author	kloo2yoo
Upvotes	4
Comments	68
Date	April 28, 2011 8:04 PM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/gzkq0/announcement_sodypop_kloo2yoo_now_mod/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/announcement-sodypop-kloo2yoo-now-mod.1040454 https://theredarchive.com/post/1040454

Comments

[–]atkinsonlaw 6 points7 points8 points 15 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] -2 points-1 points0 points 15 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]AnnArchist 4 points5 points6 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] 2 points3 points4 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 4 points5 points6 points 15 years ago (53 children) | Copy Link

You might want to notice that a majority of people don't want you there. It's not because you disagree, but because you're absolutely against the topic of the subreddit. You've said over and over again that you blatantly hate feminism and everyone involved.

In fact:

kloo2yoo believes that there is an international, feminist, antimale conspiracy, and encourages peaceful, but direct, action against it.

Honestly, what do you want with /r/feminism? Is this just going to turn into another /r/equality situation where you'll try to take over completely?

I've seen that you've claimed you'd like to have a subreddit to talk about feminism without censorship, but don't people already do that here? I've seen plenty of threads about the downsides to feminism and you've claimed before that you never ban anyone or delete their comments, so why not just keep doing it here where you'll be with more like-minded people and don't have to worry about censorship?

Also, I'd like to note that you've already made comments that have added nothing to the discussions there, were close-minded and showed that you had already made up your mind about the topic.

[–]Bobsutan -2 points-1 points0 points 15 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]XFDRaven -2 points-1 points0 points 15 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]XFDRaven -2 points-1 points0 points 15 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

In fact, what does that have to do with anything?

Defacto guilt for men. That's totally awesome!

Haha, a Jonestown reference!

Well, this explains sufficiently enough that you're so socially challenged you've never heard of spiked punch with drugs prior to (and post) Jonestown.

It's kind of like when people compare feminists to Nazis and relate it to the extermination of millions of Jews!

Plenty can be expressed between Nazi's treatment of jews and Feminism's scapegoating of men. Note, there is plenty of things the Nazi's did prior to killing lots of jews and that doesn't marginalize those things.

Keep trying though! Just keep screaming louder until you can't hear anyone else that Feminism is a wholly pure good thing that is raging against the patriarchy. Alternatively, if you need some good circlejerking go home to /2XC. They love that groupthink shit.

Oh, alternatively you can just keep chanting the "One in Four!" bullshit. You know, something to hold on to your victim complex that you're oppressed at the massive phallus of men. I'm sure your successor to SaVE & VAWA will be even more "equal" to your benefit.

[–]kloo2yoo[S] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (47 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 5 points6 points7 points 15 years ago (46 children) | Copy Link

I didn't say 'everyone involved.'

Who's involved with feminism? Feminists. Who do you hate? Feminists.

No, I don't claim that. For example, I banned cliffor just recently.

Actually, yes you have. You said that in a thread on 2XC a while ago titled something like "So, Feminism's a Dirty Word On Reddit?". You've also said it a couple of other times during my time on Reddit. I also remember someone pointing out that they were banned from /r/mensrights just for being a mod in /r/feminisms and there was a huge, dramatic thing about it and then you said, because of that, /r/mensrights doesn't ban anymore because you don't believe in censorship, etc.

the topic was there inviting a reply. I made a reply. Someone else made their reply.

That could be said about any topic. I could go into /r/mensrights and start talking about cats and claim that the topic was inviting a reply and I replied.

The topic was about why the male feminists in that subreddit agree with feminism, not what you thought about feminism. There's no good reason to have posted that. The only reasons I can see for you doing that is a) you feel this constant need to remind everyone that you hate feminism (which is obviously a huge problem when moderating a feminist subreddit), or b) that you were just there to cause a problem (which is also obviously a problem).

[–]kloo2yoo[S] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago* (36 children) | Copy Link

I also remember someone pointing out that they were banned from /r/mensrights just for being a mod in /r/feminisms and there was a huge, dramatic thing about it and then you said, because of that, /r/mensrights doesn't ban anymore because you don't believe in censorship, etc.

the mod policies for /mensrights are linked in the sidebar. there were some bans before that.

That could be said about any topic. I could go into /r/mensrights and start talking about cats and claim that the topic was inviting a reply and I replied.

if you want to talk about cats, talk about cats. expect to be downmodded and ridiculed, though. ( I expected to be downmodded for my reply.)

The topic was about why the male feminists in that subreddit agree with feminism, not what you thought about feminism.

There's controversy about whether male feminists even exist. According to some, the best a man can hope to be is a 'pro-feminist male'

So you don't like the fact that I'm a mod in /feminism. noted. Anything else?

[–]CellarDorre 4 points5 points6 points 15 years ago (35 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] 3 points4 points5 points 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 2 points3 points4 points 15 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]ForMensRights -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]disposable_human -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] -3 points-2 points-1 points 15 years ago (30 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 2 points3 points4 points 15 years ago (29 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (28 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 2 points3 points4 points 15 years ago (27 children) | Copy Link

My original comment that you were replying to:

So, if I went into /r/mensrights and started talking about how they're all misogynists and saying that all men are pigs and a bunch of other horrible, untrue things, they'd just be totally cool with it? And it wouldn't matter that I was harassing the subscribers and their beliefs?

Your response:

no, you'd be downvoted to hell. then upvoted by other feminists who also want to change the character of /mensrights. you'll also be argued with, told to read the faq, and likely cussed at. but I won't ban you for it.

However, the /r/mensrights moderation policy says:

[if] the user continues to berate and insult, and the other mod is not available in a reasonable amount of time, the involved mod will implement a banning and then discuss it with the other mod.

All of that aside, if you hate feminism so much and think it should be eradicated, why do you want to be in charge of a feminist subreddit? Also, why do you think anyone should trust you?

[–]AyeMatey 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (25 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre0 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]AyeMatey3 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Would you want a misandrist to take over as a mod for /r/mensrights?

You equate "anti feminist" with misogynist. I think you are incorrect.

I think you're too quick to judge, too quick to take offense, too impatient to think and consider.

I don't think Kloo is that way.

Feminism was not always corrupt. I think kloo would agree with that. He is against the current guise, which allows children to be taken from fathers without just cause or due process, or men to be expelled from schools without due process, sentencing inequality, and other abuses of the rights of men, all in the name of the rights of women. It need not be so.

As far as I am aware, kloo has never been against rights for women, or anyone, as long as those rights do not unjustly infringe on the rights of the male of the human species. Where there is a conflict, careful balancing is what we should strive for. The rights of the accused must be balanced by the rights of an alleged victim. The rights of a father must be equally sacrosanct as the rights of a mother. And so on.

I think he is reasonable choice as mod; you obviously do not and maybe my words will do nothing to sway your opinion.

If you think he is unfit, perhaps you should take that up with the other mods of /r/feminism. Surely you must realize that he himself is unlikely to volunteer to abandon his post as new mod on /r/fem based on your opinion.

Unless, like I said, you just want to argue.

[–]CellarDorre0 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

You equate "anti feminist" with misogynist. I think you are incorrect.

Okay, sorry, would you like to have only two moderators for the subreddit, and have one of them be an anti-men's rights advocate?

Feminism was not always corrupt. I think kloo would agree with that. He is against the current guise, which allows children to be taken from fathers without just cause or due process, or men to be expelled from schools without due process[...] And so on.

The problem is that those things aren't caused or perpetuated by feminism! Stop blaming all those problems on one thing! It's insane to do that. This is why I don't want kloo2yoo to be a mod. He says himself that his goal is to stop feminism, but he has a distorted idea of what feminism is because he's basing it on what a small handful of extremists say.

I could do the same thing with MRAs and say that they're all angry misogynists who hate men and want women to be home-makers and think women are stupid, but that's not true. Sure, there's a loud handful of MRAs who say that, but anyone capable of critical thinking knows that you can't judge a whole, huge group of people on the actions of a few, especially when a majority of that group are constantly saying that they don't associate themselves with that angry, small group.

I think he is reasonable choice as mod

How could you possibly think he's a reasonable choice though?

[–]AyeMatey3 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

The problem is that those things aren't caused or perpetuated by feminism!

I lost my children because of VAWA and distorted "Family law" statutes which were made law of the land directly based on heavy lobbying by radical feminists. Men are being expelled from college campuses based on accusations alone, without due process, under policies that have been pushed by radical feminists. Yes, these problems were caused by people waving the feminist flag. It may not be what you agree with. It may not be what you think feminism is, or should be. But it is real, it happened, it was done under the banner of feminism, and it is affecting millions of men in the US today.

These are facts. I am not blaming YOU or ALL FEMINISTS for these injustices. But feminism is the cause.

I think it has gone too far, and for that reason I think a balanced mod like kloo is what the world needs.

I could do the same thing with MRAs and say that they're all angry misogynists who hate men and want women

Oh! Really? is that what I did? Did I say that all feminists are angry men haters?

Once again, I see that you like to invent fake arguments.

How could you possibly think he's a reasonable choice though?

I've explained that several times now. At this point, I don't expect you to agree, but asking me to repeat myself is also not a useful tack in a discussion.

[–]CellarDorre0 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]AyeMatey1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]AyeMatey3 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]AyeMatey2 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre-2 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]disposable_human1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]disposable_human-1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]disposable_human-1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]disposable_human-1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Idiot that doesn't understand words, stop lecturing me as if you have knowledge or perspective that I don't. Your claims aren't supported by your evidence, and shouting doesn't translate over text. You can be dismissive and ambivalent towards truth as you'd like. I'm still going to rub your nose in the shit you pass off.

It pains me to even return to the argument we're having. All I want to do is shame you for your pomposity:

If you're too dumb to see that these are simple sentences that clearly convey a message that he regularly parades around, then I'm finished here. Enjoy your ignorance.

'If you're too stupid to agree with my explicitly slanted and objective based interpretation of this guy's words...'

This is after you break the quote up and present it out of order. That is to say, you do backflips trying to present it in a way that agrees with your conclusions.

Okay, let's get back into it, person who isn't worth anyone's time. Here's the actual quote. (I'd love to see the context of the quote, but I'm betting that would soften your point even more)

Feminists fight for equality for women. They just happen to hate men as well. That can either be a burning 'all men are rapists!' resentment, or simply a nonchalant reduction of men to collateral damage in their quest for power and shiny things"

You began by saying he said "all" feminists "hate" men. That's what I'm holding you to. Never once did the word "all" appear in this, not that you'll acknowledge that as being significant.

Feminists are generalized as fighting for equality for women. I don't think anyone's disagreeing yet. He didn't even say "all", even though your definition of feminism assumes "all". That's where you go wrong. A significant portion of feminists fight for privilege in addition to equality. So much so, the movement can be described as fighting for privilege. Just as much as you can say they just happen to hate men as well. Not all feminists are like that. Just enough to describe the group as what the aggregate result is.

I certainly hope you're finished. I've had enough of your smug, self assured ignorance. Just like I'm sick of you claiming victimization while having the whole world bow in deference to you. Just by virtue of caring and arguing as you have, you're pathetic. Apparently all the advantages in the world aren't enough for you; you have to find some way to rationalize your "I'm gonna fight back against the patriarchy" mentality.

Fucking disgusting. Die.

[–]disposable_human-1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]numb3rb0y 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 5 points6 points7 points 15 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 3 points4 points5 points 15 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]kloo2yoo[S] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]CellarDorre 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I don't try to make people feel inferior. I argue. i use facts. if someone insists on attacking me personally, I may eventually respond viscously.

Even completely unprovoked you say things intentionally to annoy people that adds nothing to the conversation. Besides, you don't just use facts, you link to thinks that are irrelevant and use red herrings. In addition to that, you often lay blame for things where it isn't due, probably because it's easier to blame feminism for everything instead of actually blaming the people who are promoting the issues you and other MRAs are trying to fight against.

When i post arguments, it's often not the person with whom I'm directly arguing who will be convinced. Later, more reasonable people will read these interactions and make their own opinion.

That didn't answer my question at all. This is another thing you do, you dodge the topic at hand. What I actually asked was:

so why would you do the same thing to feminist subreddits when you know it's just going to annoy people and that it doesn't benefit anyone?

It's not about posting an argument, it's about why you'd post things that don't benefit anyone and that only annoy people. Just saying things like "I found out long ago that feminism isn't for equality" in a feminist thread is doing anyone any good. It's not though provoking, it's not backed up by anything, it's just there to cause a problem and piss people off.

You've said yourself that you don't like people going into /r/mensrights and trying to talk about how feminism's right or downing Men's Rights, but you're doing the same thing to feminist subreddits by doing things like that.

[–]kloo2yoo[S] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Even completely unprovoked you say things intentionally to annoy people that adds nothing to the conversation.

I suppose i've done that.

.Besides, you don't just use facts, you link to thinks that are irrelevant and use red herrings.

maybe. i post a lot. Not every comment off mine is a masterpiece. Is every one of yours?

In addition to that, you often lay blame for things where it isn't due, probably because it's easier to blame feminism for everything instead of actually blaming the people who are promoting the issues you and other MRAs are trying to fight against.

If that's a problem for you, disown patriarchy theory.

so why would you do the same thing to feminist subreddits when you know it's just going to annoy people and that it doesn't benefit anyone?

Actually, i avoid the most explicitly feminist subreddits: I'm not in feminisms, I don't post to women, and 2xc hasn't kicked me out. I took major issue with /genderegalitarian and saw their mod policies ease a bit.

So do you want to talk about feminism, or waste more

time telling me you don't like me.

"I found out long ago that feminism isn't for equality" in a feminist thread is doing anyone any good.

As I said: Later, more reasonable people will read these interactions and make their own opinion.

It's not though provoking,

in your opinion

it's not backed up by anything,

ok here:

http://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/dtzk7/i_see_a_lot_of_you_have_some_misconceptions_about/c12wcd8

it's just there to cause a problem and piss people off.

no, it's there to show that feminism isn't universally approved. okay, do you dislike it. Maybe one or more of the other people who read it didn't dislike it.

[–]CellarDorre2 points 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

i post a lot. Not every comment off mine is a masterpiece. Is every one of yours?

There's a difference between having a post be a masterpiece and having it at least try to be accurate.

So do you want to talk about feminism, or waste more time telling me you don't like me.

I've never said I don't like you. In fact, I don't actually know you. What I don't like is the attitude you seem to have and the fact that you're anti-feminist, despite all the good that feminism has accomplished. Why not just be anti-misandrist or anti-extremism? Those are a lot more harmful than just feminism.

I have a lot of problems with some of the things some self-proclaimed MRAs say and do when they talk about how women are less intelligent and how men need to "grow a pair" and take things back and about how women are succubi, etc. but I don't say I'm anti-men's rights because I know that it's not MRAs causing the problem, it's people who are MRAs AND misogynists/chauvinists/etc. They're not saying horrible things about women because they're MRAs, they're saying it because they're misogynists who also happen to be MRAs.

no, it's there to show that feminism isn't universally approved.

I think it's very clear in society that feminism isn't universally approved.

[–]kloo2yoo1 point 15 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[+][deleted] 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

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[–]kloo2yoo[S] 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

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[–]kloo2yoo[S] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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