Pay Gap?

Marc_kk · 2018-02-07T13:58:57+00:00

Look into the Asian wage gap between Asian men/women and white men/women. This invalidates the claim that privilege leads to better pay using their own flawed logic. You can apply this to the male and female wage gap in a similar way.

perplexedm · 2018-02-07T14:48:31+00:00

Talk like them, walk like yourselves or you will get into trouble.

Female Uber Drivers Get Paid Less Than Men, Says Study

https://web.stanford.edu/~diamondr/UberPayGap.pdf

https://www.recode.net/2018/2/6/16979370/female-uber-drivers-get-paid-less

When and where: The times and places female Uber drivers work seem to be less profitable. That could be fewer overnight shifts, shifts with shorter wait times or surge-price shifts than men.

Driver experience: Drivers who've been with Uber longer get paid more, on account of knowing which routes and times tend to pay more. In general, men work for Uber longer than women so they are more experienced. The attrition rate after six months is 77 percent for women and 65 percent for men.

Speed: Male Uber drivers conduct more trips per hour than women, meaning they're actually driving faster, according to the data. More trips mean more money. About 50 percent of the earnings gap is explained away by differences in driving speed.

BenchoteMankoManko · 2018-02-07T14:45:19+00:00

Look at the pay gap between male and female models and pornstars per shoot :^)

Mr_MRAnarchist · 2018-02-07T13:45:50+00:00

You should tell your teachers to leave their politics out of the classroom.

Historybuffman · 2018-02-07T15:01:03+00:00

Here you are, I just made this post on r/feminism.

I am normally against helping students do their work too much... but this is an important topic.

The wage gap, the one constantly talked about, has a flawed methodology. It is usually based on the US Bureau of Labor findings. Here is the latest:

https://www.bls.gov/opub/ted/2016/mobile/womens-earnings-83-percent-of-mens-but-vary-by-occupation.htm

Let's look at the info used to find it and you decide if it is right:

"In 2014, women who worked full time in wage and salary jobs had median usual weekly earnings of $719, which was 83 percent of men's median weekly earnings ($871)."

Now, if we look at it at face value, 17% is a significant difference. However, we are not accounting any factors that could be causing this, and it only talks about full time employees.

Also from the US Bureau of Labor:

https://www.bls.gov/opub/ted/2015/mobile/time-spent-working-by-full-and-part-time-status-gender-and-location-in-2014.htm

Also in 2014: "... [A]mong full-time workers (those usually working 35 hours or more per week), men worked longer than women—8.4 hours compared with 7.8 hours."

So we can see that men tend to work more hours. If they work them, they are likely to be paid for those hours. Let's find out how much more men statistically work:

8.4 - 7.8 = .6 / 7.8 = .077

7.7% more! Now, let's dig a bit deeper. Let's assume a 5 day work week.

7.8 x 5 = 39 8.4 x 5 = 42

Over 40 hours usually gets overtime, which is time-and-a-half. 1.5. One third of the statistical (edit: difference in hours worked) are normal time, two thirds overtime.

7.7 x 2/3 = 5.13333333 (lets say 5.1) 5.1 x 1.5 = 7.65

So, 7.7 + 7.65 = 15.35%

In case many do not get overtime, we will say the value is somewhere between 7.7% and 15.35%.

So, in 2014, the "wage gap" of full time employees in the US is:

17 - 15.35 = 1.65% 17 - 7.7 = 9.3%

Somewhere between 1.65% and 9.3%. But, it is still worth bringing up, right?

Well, we still haven't accounted for job choice! Men tend to go for well paying jobs, women tend to go for lower paying jobs.

http://www.aei.org/publication/the-gender-wage-gap-myth/

This trend is changing over time, and so we will see this gap begin to narrow. However, this is an individual choice. Women are not prevented from pursuing a job that they like because they are women, with few exceptions.

We still have not gotten into other factors such as seniority (which gender has been in their field longer), education, nor have we actually figured out the differences of career's effects.

So, long story short, what pay gap?

lookafist · 2018-02-07T17:51:38+00:00

Claudia Goldin is a Harvard economist who has studied the pay gap extensively. Her conclusion is that it essentially does not exist (she found a small difference that might be due to discrimination).

http://freakonomics.com/podcast/the-true-story-of-the-gender-pay-gap-a-new-freakonomics-radio-podcast/

I can't think of a better source than a female economist at Harvard.

mikbusa · 2018-02-07T13:44:38+00:00

http://freakonomics.com/podcast/what-can-uber-teach-us-about-the-gender-pay-gap/

SiTeorbzey · 2018-02-07T16:21:48+00:00

Use the Cathy Newman and Peterson part where they go through multivaried analysis about the pay gap as he is very good at what he does

saltshaker42 · 2018-02-07T16:46:45+00:00

Good luck with that. I think it's a brilliant thing to do, but I know you're essentially committing social suicide, and your grades might suffer too.

Be sure to document EVERYTHING so you can at least attempt to disburse whatever wrong they try to do to you.

armaadi · 2018-02-07T16:48:19+00:00

Women aged 22-30 make more than men in the same age range:

http://fortune.com/2016/04/12/women-are-out-earning-men/

Women who never leave work to pursue motherhood make around 8% more than men:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/10/01/the-gender-pay-gap-is-the-result-of-being-a-parent-not-discrimination/#af0aaaeac7fd

The "pay gap" is overwhelmingly due to a woman's desire to become a mother, and has very, very, very little to do with discrimination. Feminism telling women they will be valued less than a man has a scientifically proven negative impact on performance and outlook on women (and men).

http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2012/06/14/stem_gender_gap_research_on_telling_girls_they_re_bad_at_math_.html

There's also the social service gap, where women receive more tax dollars than men and the tax gap, where as a group, only men pay taxes.

http://judgybitch.com/2016/08/16/reblog-research-find-that-as-a-group-only-men-pay-tax/

ThreeTokes · 2018-02-07T17:53:17+00:00

Describe it as an EARNINGS GAP instead of a PAY GAP. Done.

spcarlin · 2018-02-07T20:33:28+00:00

Is it a paper or a presentation. I just had a look at the comments, Someone said video/audio record your interaction with the teacher. You could use your phone and claim you have notes on it to cover any suspicion on why you have it in view.

Someone mentioned Jordan Peterson. One thing JBP says is to learn the opposing argument, because when the teacher resorts to them to discredit your project you will be in a position to tell her why she is wrong.

Some pay gap reports are wrong because: They misleading because they are funded by feminist lobbyists, the sample size is too small, they don't consider enough factors (example: women in medicine get paid less than men, but the report doesn't specify that men are more likely to be doctors and not nurses - which takes more time and financial investment to become - not to mention longer work hours), and so on.

Good luck, let us know how it goes

bumperpickle · 2018-02-07T15:36:05+00:00

One thing to consider as well is trend of wages in 5-10-20 years. (Within North American ) The ratio of women to men going to universities are staggering. Depends on the university its 4 w to 1 m. The trend for lower end jobs held by male will likely stay the same, which means (anecdotally) that overtime women will hold more high end white collar jobs than men.

ServingSailor · 2018-02-07T17:55:43+00:00

Look at the pay gap brtween young part timr female workers and male workers.

Look at the death gap.

BlackHole94 · 2018-02-07T20:46:17+00:00

Here are 2 academic videos that the wage gap is a myth:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1oqyrflOQFc

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=QcDrE5YvqTs

Dragonly6000 · 2018-02-07T18:21:02+00:00

Good luck. Let us know how you did.

workthrow22 · 2018-02-07T18:52:16+00:00

godspeed brethren

das_superbus · 2018-02-07T21:01:43+00:00

If you value your grade then I suggest you tow the line.

Rethgil · 2018-02-07T21:28:22+00:00

"Contrary to popular belief, it is not because employers pay women less than men for doing the same jobs".

https://www.economist.com/blogs/economist-explains/2017/10/economist-explains-12?fsrc=scn/fb/te/bl/ed/whydowomenstillearnalotlessthanmentheeconomistexplains

Your question is flawed.

If the correct question is asked, the answer is self evident.

"Why is there a gender pay gap?" is leading and incorrect.

"Why is there a gender EARNINGS gap?" is the correct question.

And the answer is in the question. Women are NOT paid less comparably. They EARN less. They work less. They get turned down for some jobs BECAUSE they are less work focused on average.

It must be said that the mass media, as well as feminism, is to blame for the deliberate confusion between 'earnings' and wages.
Feminists WANT the false lies spread, to create men as an enemy, because to hold and keep a grip on power you need fear, anger, and an imaginary enemy to blame instead of looking at your own actions.

The mass media is biased because they use fear to sell advertising space and make money, and because far more extreme feminists control the media narrative now.

Finally, it must also be said that the reason this lie has spread so far and for long is because the kind of people who fell for it are basically stupid and lazy.

They couldnt be bothered to check basic facts which have always been there, disproving it, and didnt know enough to realise the obvious flaw in the notion anyway.

TRichard3814 · 2018-02-08T00:29:02+00:00

Specific unbiased validated source are hard

You can however look at high paying jobs and sectors and the gender distributions within them. You can use this to justify the wage gap. There are also studies regarding how men work more hours on average.

Additionally look at the recent release by Uber regarding female vs male drivers

tomweya · 2018-02-11T02:40:37+00:00

I'd start by pointing out that the Wage Gap is a median comparison that doesn't even account for basic factors like occupation.

The I'd move to the fact that Men/Women have different priorities and preferences.

For example Men to tend to work the nightshift more than women:

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/pdf/flex.pdf (See Table 4)

https://academic.oup.com/jnci/article/95/11/825/2520258

Notice how Men work more Night Shift hours in every category, then look at Evening shifts and notice an even greater difference with men working more hours than women.

These night shifts pay more. Why? Because they wear down the workers greatly.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/01/06/rotating-shift-work-health_n_6417644.html

http://theconversation.com/night-shifts-may-be-more-disruptive-to-women-than-men-brain-study-suggests-57999

http://time.com/3657434/night-work-early-death/

This lines up with some facts about men at work and in general:

80% of suicides. http://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/pdf/suicide_factsheet-a.pdf
92% of workplace fatalities. http://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/cfch0013.pdf
Men work more hours: http://www.bls.gov/cps/cpsaat22.htm

For example men demanded equal default shared parenting - a notion where both parents get equal custody and responsibility by default unless one is proven to be unfit - ending the warfare-esque family court system. Feminist organization NOW fought against this.

http://archive.is/DSVrA

Of course also is the issue of paternity which plays a role in child support. Fathers all over the western world have been seeking default paternity testing with great opposition from feminists.

Feminist wants to force men to raise children that do not belong to them:

http://www.spectator.co.uk/2010/10/whos-the-daddy/

"DNA tests are an anti-feminist appliance of science, a change in the balance of power between the sexes that we’ve hardly come to terms with."

She argues that men should not be allowed to parent only their own children but rather be forced to parent according to the woman's wishes.

This happened again just recently in the UK:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0f3V7tRpSRs

How can you expect equal work when men do not have equal parental rights? Do you expect men to take parental leave and spend time with a child that may or may not be theirs?

Keep in mind the INCREDIBLY small percentage we're dealing with here regarding the wage gap ~4-5% not only is this well within the margin of error for wage calculations like these but a small shift like these within the population can easily affect the overall representation of the wage gap.

It's just not cut and dry, and to say "SEXISM!" long before accounting for even basic differences in male and female behavior.

A good testament to this is China where 40% of the STEM workforce is female. This is due to economics - in china women have to work hard jobs in order to provide for their family. The more egalitarian the society the more pronounced the gender differences tend to become.

https://itif.org/publications/2016/03/03/women-represent-40-stem-workforce-china-only-24-us

Though if equal STEM representation is what you're looking for - perhaps we should take a page out of China's egalitarian book?

Title	Pay Gap?
Author	K1ngH0d0r
Upvotes	36
Comments	40
Date	February 7, 2018 1:37 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/7vw4jm/pay_gap/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/pay-gap.1179631 https://theredarchive.com/post/1179631

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