real talk. how do men perceive transgender men

PM_me_ur_swimsuit · 2018-03-05T03:26:48+00:00

They're humans like the rest of us. They're just as good, bad, weird, ugly, beautiful, and fucked up like the rest of us. Am I supposed to think something else?

das_superbus · 2018-03-05T07:19:33+00:00

I've met a couple FtM transgender people. They over act what they perceive to be a masculine persona, to the point where it's actually pretty annoying... In my opinion, butch lesbians fit in with men 10x better than transmen.

TibsKirk · 2018-03-05T03:30:04+00:00

I'm honestly not sure why the label of "men" is so important. How can somebody on the one hand claim that gender binaries are wrong yet at the same time demand to be recognized according to that binary, because they are really a "man"? Otherwise I don't have a problem treating anyone with respect. I just don't really understand all the contradictions, but I don't walk in their boots.

Another part of me asks, "Why would any woman in 2018 want to be recognized and treated as a man, along with dealing with the man-bashing in academia and media?" But then I remember that maybe it's not a choice and they can't help but feel born that way.

And yet another part of me cannot deny science and biology based on how it makes someone else feel. I'm sorry if it hurts your feelings, but some things are scientific facts.

Still at the end of the day I want to treat them as human beings, coworkers, and fellow travelers in life. Every human being deserves respect and equality.

boringcarpets · 2018-03-05T07:58:14+00:00

I'll be honest, I've met trans men and though I have an element of "live and let live", the ones I've met aren't men; it's not that they don't pass physically, it's that they don't pass socially or actually - it's clear that these people haven't been socialised as boys or young men and have little in common. Granted, that experience probably doesn't apply to all trans men.

Themeparkmaker · 2018-03-05T07:55:00+00:00

I dont care about them. Sp long as they treat me like a human being, ill do my part and be nice to them also.

I may not believe the idea that transitioning to the other sex is the solution to the ailment, but being a dick to someone accomplishes nothing. If she wants to be called a he, ill keep it in mind. Do i personally think of him as a guy, nah but im just tryna be courteous. Its when people get in my face if i slip up or are overtly sensitive about something that bothers me. I really do not give a shit if you transition or whatever just be cool with me and im copl with them.

2018-03-05T16:57:23+00:00

I don't care. Transmen cismen gay men straight men. Frankly I couldnt give two shits. That's none of my business. The only thing that matters to me is whether someone is pleasant and/or provides what I see as a worthwhile service to society.

Beyond that, it ain't any of my business.

2018-03-05T14:36:53+00:00

I'm not sure I'd notice... women are free to dress and act like stereotypical men with no repercussions. The social stigma that gets attached to biological men doing the opposite is significantly worse.

robinalamode98 · 2018-03-05T18:01:20+00:00

As a trans guy I get massive shit from both sides sometimes. Some feminists don't want me because I embody 'Toxic Masculinity TM' and stuff, and some men's rights activists don't want me because I don't understand 'The Real Struggle TM'. Obviously not everybody does that, seems to be a minority. Anyway, interesting thread!

9-3-1 · 2018-03-05T18:03:48+00:00

I know several transgender men. Just like any other guys I know, really. Just like with transgender women, there is a tendency, at least initially, to exaggerate some of the qualities of their gender that they desired, but never felt free to express.

That tends to settle down a few years after living their gender full-time.

Other than that, there's so little difference between "them" and "us" that it's pretty stupid to make a division.

alphafox823 · 2018-03-05T04:46:06+00:00

They can be men if they want, but they shouldn't try to change what the male experience is like.

I don't ever think they will live authentically as men because they don't really try to be men, they just sorta play-act as men.

geniice · 2018-03-05T04:22:32+00:00

but not about transmen and how they fit in to the real world with actual men.

Well there were all those articles about Mack Beggs.

2018-03-05T07:55:02+00:00

Transgender man. Is that when a girl becomes a guy?

2018-03-05T11:05:55+00:00

I'll gladly think of someone as a man if they are at least somewhat convincingly like what I think of a man as, and I think they're being genuine about it.

ExpendableOne · 2018-03-05T15:14:16+00:00

The subject doesn't really get brought up a lot because it is just not that common. I don't think I have ever met a woman who believed she was a man or that she would be happier being perceived as a man, but I have met men who thought they would be happier being perceived as women. Gender identity disorders are, generally, pretty one sided. The overwhelming majority of cases, which are all relatively recent, are MtF. And, in my opinion, that is a direct reflection/result of how society treats men(obligations, harshness, second class) vs how they treat women(privilege, entitlement, protection, first class).

Even the way people see MtF and FtM in general is very telling. Most men don't really care about FtM, it doesn't really affect them. They certainly don't see those women as trying to "steal the spotlight", "infiltrate the male circles" or "cash in on being a man" the way a lot of women might feel about MtF. Men just don't really have that "private exclusive club" or "gender solidarity" mentality(which is very sexist) that a lot of women have and because that's just not men would see it(if anything, their first reaction would be "why would you ever want to be a man").

I think a big social difference that is driving this disparity between MtF and FtM too is that society is actually far more inclusive and accepting of women. If you are a woman and you like things that are traditionally associated with men, people will still love to in-spite or for it(and men will still want to have sex/relationships with you). If you are a man and you like things that are traditionally feminine, you will have a really hard life. Not just because other boys will tease/haze you for it(which most men grow real quick to get used to) but because women will shut you down hard(in every sense of the word). There is far less incentive or trauma for women to develop this sense of "I would be happier, more accepted, as a man" because there are no real restrictions on them(other than purely physical ones) the way there are on men.

moonlightofficial · 2018-03-05T16:05:59+00:00

It's literally a mental disorder. Not trying to be a dick or anything but it still is a mental disorder.

blueoak9 · 2018-03-05T16:43:44+00:00

"how do real men feel about transgender men?"

You are making a false distinction. The question is false.

SKNK_Monk · 2018-03-05T16:42:58+00:00

I know three. Two are honestly just dudes except a bit small. The third one is an awful stereotype and uses it as an excuse to be a shitty person.

Metraxis · 2018-03-05T19:44:04+00:00

It doesn't come up much because it's really not a big deal. We don't care. While I am sure that at least one MHRA holds views that mirror the TERFs there is no power bloc within the MHRM community that holds those beliefs and any notable level of recognition or influence. The idea of the MtF as a gender traitor or the FtM as some kind of Matriarchal spy are ridiculous on their faces.

(If you think I am being hyperbolic, Google "womyn born womyn" to have your faith in the species challenged.)

elsarosen · 2018-03-05T22:11:09+00:00

how do real men feel about transgender men?

Imo transgender men are real men.

sakura_sakura · 2018-03-05T04:09:50+00:00

It's very simple, transgender men are not men. I'm not going to play along with anyone's self-deception that is so brutally wrong, it's wrong.

Lethn · 2018-03-05T04:16:46+00:00

I think yes that it does qualify as gender discrimination, even by the rules of feminists. Feminists frequently go after people over gender pronouns in relation only to trans-women and they go utterly ballistic if people flip them off on the subject.

Do you see the aggressive lobbying and discussion about the issue in regard to trans-men though? No and it's because it doesn't fit their narrative, in their view 'maleness' itself or as they like to call it 'toxic masculinity' is always a problem and they clearly do have a long term goal of eradicating male behaviour they disapprove of.

So, why on earth would anyone want to be a trans-man? I can't remember if it was Milo or not so I won't misquote him but I remember talk generally about how all of these feminists and people were suddenly coming out as trans-women because that gets you at the top of their stupid oppression hierarchy. In that situation why the hell would anyone want to be a man? It doesn't fit into any of their politics so they just do what they do and seem to pretend that trans-men don't exist or just dodge the subject.

FellowGecko · 2018-03-05T05:11:27+00:00

I’m a college aged guy who attends a school with a lot of trans people. Pretty chill with them, I mean its weird to do things like talk about women (nobody’s perfect, I don’t want to delve into why it’s awkward for me to talk to women-turned-men about women but it is). It’s also weird to do anything physical like boxing or playing sports, but I love having my trans friends.

Ps when I say weird it’s just like a quiet voice I my head that isn’t there when I do that stuff with cis men.

2018-03-05T10:45:40+00:00

It's mental illness, just like trans-women.

elsarosen · 2018-03-06T00:17:34+00:00

I don't care if someone is trans. But they need to acknowledge the fact that they don't fundamentally understand the discrimination and marginalizing men go through since birth. Discrimination and marginalizing of trans people is a different animal entirely.

Mythandros · 2018-03-06T18:49:04+00:00

I don't perceive them as men. But I do consider them people who should be afforded all the rights and respect that a fellow human should get, regardless of gender.

2018-03-11T22:15:26+00:00

They're women. Specifically women suffering from unfortunate mental illness.

I won't pander to them but neither will I go out of my way to be an asshole.

2018-03-05T06:36:35+00:00

I dont think being trans is a real thing but i am 100 percent okay with someone being trans

Title	real talk. how do men perceive transgender men
Author	elsarosen
Upvotes	16
Comments	71
Date	March 5, 2018 3:22 AM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/823087/real_talk_how_do_men_perceive_transgender_men/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/real-talk-how-do-men-perceive-transgender-men.904985 https://theredarchive.com/post/904985

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