Neomasculinity Vs Extreme Feminism - Compare and Contrast

AceFlashheart · 2016-05-10T22:56:40+00:00

There's nothing really 'neo' about 'neomasculinity'. It's what masculinity used to be before women began to define what that meant.

andrewisgood · 2016-05-10T19:26:32+00:00

I think some definitions are needed first. I mean, I've never heard of the concept of "Extreme Feminism". Even the name "Extreme Feminism" sounds like it's just what a MRA thinks feminism is, considering there are many strands of feminism, liberal, radical, marxist, etc.

So, is Extreme Feminism like, a bunch of women who dress like their from the 90s and go around skateboarding? Is it like, ECW, where like, a bunch of feminists are starting fights at protests and hitting each other with random blunt instruments?

AnnoyingSeaAnt · 2016-05-10T20:10:46+00:00

It's mostly a part of the fight between Regressive Leftism and Alt-right, the new Far-left and Far-right.

Blame Polarization.

AutoModerator · 2016-05-10T18:27:12+00:00

Attention!

You can post off topic/jokes/puns as a comment to this Automoderator message.
For "CMV" and "Question for X" Threads: Parent comments that aren't from the target group will be removed, along with their child replies.
If you want to agree with OP instead of challenging their view or if the question is not targeted at you, post it as an answer to this comment.
OP you can choose your own flair, just press Flair under your post!

Thanks for your cooperation and enjoy the discussion!

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

[deleted] · 2016-05-11T06:52:57+00:00

Not sure what is meant by "neomasculinity." As far as I can tell, it's just Roosh V's personal brand of masculinity that he's trying to commoditize for profit. I'm not a huge fan of Roosh because of this aspect of his philosophy, and also because he keeps trying to reconcile PUA with traditional women (read: male hamstering).

So I looked over his "neomasculinity" traits. Let's go over them:

game, self-improvement, weightlifting/fitness, individual responsibility, testosterone, entrepreneurship, hard work ethic, SMV, hedonistic moderation, natural health, hygiene, lifestyle optimization

All of these are good traits for men to have, and are conducive to long-term happiness. Feminism, on the other hand, preaches things like fat acceptance, sluttiness, being a bitch, ignoring natural biological drives to have children, AF/BB, and other things that are bad traits for women to have (i.e. unconducive to long-term happiness).

Traditional sex roles, patriarchy, nuclear family, male virtue, feminine beauty ideals

This stuff will depend on your point of view. While I generally agree men make better leaders and women are better off under male headship, I would definitely oppose legally codifying these types of things (I lean pretty libertarian). Feminists are opposed to all these things, but they're just flat out wrong.

Equal legal rights, anti-socialism

I'm 100% on board with these. (Roosh may not be though; "equal legal rights" probably conflicts with the aforementioned "patriarchy"). Feminists are definitely not - "yes means yes" for example (in fact, the whole hysteria over rape in particular - the 1 violent crime that affects more women than men - and the corresponding attempt to curtail men's due process rights) is blatantly unequal legal treatment. As for socialism, modern feminists call for government intervention in everything they don't like, so I would call them socialists. (Also, they whine about social (non-)issues like "slut shaming" and "media representations", so they are very group-oriented/anti-individualistic).

Deeper life meaning and/or spirituality

Can't comment much on this one - I'm generally pretty atheist. Most feminists seem to be pretty atheist too, so this might be a point I agree more with feminists than Roosh. (Though Roosh doesn't strike me as terribly religious either).

Technological skepticism

OK Roosh is just being ridiculous here. Technology is great and makes our lives easier. I get that Facebook addiction is a thing (I don't have one), and female smartphone zombies are annoying to be around. But disregarding technology because of those slight downsides is just stupid.

Male-only spaces

YES. Roosh hits the nail on the head here. Feminists have tried to destroy these, and have hurt men big-time in the process. They've even made it illegal in the workplace (a violation of 1st amendment rights to free assembly), and are working on frats, etc. Men communicate differently from women, and male bonding/camaraderie is very valuable to men. If there's 1 thing I hate most about feminism, it's their attempts to shut down all male spaces. They know exactly what they're doing. And it's fucked up.

Understanding the true nature of women, red pill truths

This one's a little ambiguous. Women are a pretty diverse group (as are men) - you can't really ascribe 1 characteristic to all of them. TRP and Roosh are both guilty of this. Feminists are guilty of doing this to men (and women as well). People like to think in generalities, but this can be detrimental when dealing with exceptions to the rules. That said, our culture does tend to pedestalize women excessively, so I guess I'd lean towards supporting him here. Too vague to really say much though.

According to Roosh's definition, I agree with more than half of his points, so I am a neomasculinist. However, by the "equal legal rights" definition feminists always revert to after challenges to their screeds about "slut-shaming", "nice guys", and "manspreading", I am also a feminist. But I clearly am not a feminist. So I wouldn't call myself a neomasculinist either. Ultimately, they're both just labels. But I certainly have more in common with Roosh than with the feminazis (as does most of TRP).

Shazoa · 2016-05-11T12:37:51+00:00

You'll struggle to define either as they are decentralised movements with no concrete set of values. Self identification doesn't even help particularly because two very opposed people might find themselves under the same umbrella term. It gets even more complex when some people who fit the ideology don't identify with the label most people would attribute to them.

Then my main point - I believe the most vocal side of either movement is likely to represent the extreme fringes. You end up with a shit-flinging contest where both sides are in essence just attacking a parody instead of the average.

Meanwhile, those 'people-in-between' are largely ignorant of the whole affair. Personally, I do think that masculinity and femininity are are unimportant terms and it's better for people to just do what's comfortable for them. I'm not a very 'traditionally' masculine person but that hasn't hindered me at all from finding long term partners/flings. Inversely, I have definitely been rejected for being too feminine. Everyone has their preferences.

PeopleInThatBackRoom · 2016-05-12T16:59:13+00:00

Wow. I really didn't expect all these responses—I'm new to Reddit, so I pretty much didn't have any expectations for the response-rate —but I'm so grateful for all the people who took the time to express their views. Thank you; really.

(P.S: Sorry I haven't added more of a opinion and/or relevance to the discussion. This was more of a.....question, I'd say?)

WorldsEndGirlfriend · 2016-05-10T21:49:11+00:00

Feminism in the most recent wave is about breaking down gender roles and not enforcing them. It is the notion that people don't have to be encouraged to act in a certain way (a boy shouldn't be criticized for showing emotions, girl doesn't have to wear dresses and be passive, etc etc)

TRP encourages the conservative values of gender roles. That men should absolutely act in this masculine way and that women should act in this feminine way.

Entropy-7 · 2016-05-10T20:25:19+00:00

Neomasculinity is…

Game
Traditional sex roles
Self-improvement
Understanding the true nature of women
Patriarchy
Weightlifting/fitness
Individual responsibility
Equal legal rights, free speech, due process
Testosterone
Entrepreneurship
Hard work ethic
Red pill truths
Sexual marketplace value
Male-only spaces
Hedonistic moderation
Nuclear family
Binary sex model
Natural health and hygiene (baking soda, apple cider vinegar, etc)
Male virtue
Anti-socialism
Technological skepticism
Feminine beauty ideals
Deeper life meaning and/or spirituality
Lifestyle optimization

To be neomasculine would be to believe or advocate for more than half of the above list.

Title	Neomasculinity Vs Extreme Feminism - Compare and Contrast
Author	PeopleInThatBackRoom
Upvotes	2
Comments	52
Date	May 10, 2016 6:27 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/4iqmze/neomasculinity_vs_extreme_feminism_compare_and/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/neomasculinity-vs-extreme-feminism-compare-and.274733 https://theredarchive.com/post/274733

Comments