Wife's reliving dad battles

jacktenofhearts · 2016-04-05T13:15:43+00:00

Your wife "jumping in" is bad parenting. It's fucking parenting 101 to not undermine the other parent. That should be a hard boundary. If she has a problem with any discipline you're giving, she should STFU and wwait for a private moment to talk to you.

For all your fuckers who are terrified of divorce fucking up your kids, think about this. Placating your wife, and surrendering common sense boundaries like "don't directly contradict and undermine me in front of the kids" will fuck your kids up more than divorce ever could. I'm not advocating going nuclear every time this happens, but your attitude should be more than, sigh, there goes her hamster again, she never thinks our daughter does anything wrong. Seriously, does your wife actually give a shit about your opinion when it comes to parenting? No? Maybe that's a bigger problem than your sex life, so think about that.

Back to OP. So, you 'had enough,' and... Sat down with your wife and presumably said, "I don't like when you contradict me, clearly I respond with discipline in a way you don't like, what can I do to stop this reaction from you?"

Yeah, but, no. I get this is some good "active listener" bullshit you probably learned in a workplace management seminar, but this screams of a husband essentially afraid of his wife's defensiveness. It's useful to get some inkling that your discipline 'reminds her of her father,' inasmuch as it tells you she doesn't have the emotional maturity to develop mental models beyond those she learned in her formative experiences.

Because saying "I guess I react badly because this is what Daddy used to do and I didn't like that" is bullshit if you don't follow that up with thoughts like -

Is my husband behaving identically to my father, or just similarly?
What exactly was negative about what my father used to do? Is it possible that my husband is actually not expressing himself in that same negative way, despite his behavior seemingly cosmetically similar?
is this negative expression objectively bad, or something I find distasteful? Is it only distasteful because i have a low opinion of my father for unrelated reasons?
Given being married to a man that has similarities to my father is the most fucking clichéd thing in the book, what does that say about my decisions and my thinking? And given we have three daughters and they'll be just as likely to base their own mental models about men on my husband, how can I make sure to support him and given them a stable foundation for their future relationships?

But no, your wife is going to spend any time thinking about any of that. Which is why conversations like you just had are pointless. She doesn't give a shit about your opinion on parenting if it's different from hers, and she doesn't even care to deconstruct why that is. She literally expects you to operate in her frame, and expects you to stop being annoying and shut up whenever you raise the question on why'd you want to do that.

The correct answer is not to read books on how to argue with your wife who is fucking up your kids with bad parenting, by challenging you out of some misguided association with her father. If you're going to go down the road of overt communication - some recommend that it's always too much Verba relative to your Acta - then you need to challenge the whole premise. What your wife does is deeply damaging. It needs to stop. It will stop, one way or the other, because you probably won't have much interest in co-parenting with someone who does this.

And your wife will be defensive and aggravated, but that's not your problem. Your problem is you're living in a household with a wife that Shit Tests you, and a daughter that Shit Tests you, and a wife who Shit Tests you when you don't let your daughter Shit Test you. That is literally what is happening. I am not saying this to get your boxer briefs in a knot and get you all worked up. II'm mostly just projecting my own feelings of parenting that I witness. SAHM feels like she can trivially undermine her husband because she's the one that "actually raises the kids," but doesn't set any fucking boundaries or discipline because she's too fucking exhausted chasing after three kids in between her games of Angry Birds and scrolling through Facebook. This structural situation is probably the crux if your problem, and has little to do with her meany mean head father.

I'm saying all this because I want to give you the context you may need when everyone else on MRP and their dog tells you to stop "operating in your wife's frame." And you are, but this involves things like kids and discipline, so the whole "initiate sex and renew your passport and take a six month vacation to Thailand if she tturns you down" maybe isn't the applicable playbook here.

You may need to figure out a way to be more physically present around your kids. If you work long hours and have a long commute, you may be spending too much time as the Stern Disciplinarian. Which actually erodes your authority over time anyway, since you come across as the clueless school principal to all the kids know is clueless enough to be fooled with a few minutes of good behavior. Set up some fun Daddy Time with your kids and make the most of it. You won't need to worry about your wife's bullshit because she won't be there.

Likewise, if your oldest daughter is doing some Mean Girls bullying shit already, then you may want to get her involved in some/more activities around the house. Your daughter may just be craving more interaction with kids in her peer group, or maybe she has a bigger issue than that. You don't want to calibrate your parenting based on other kids, but you don't want to tunnel-vision that your kids' shit never stinks, like your wife is more than happy to.

Realize everything in these last couple paragraphs have nothing to do with your wife. If she refuses to communicate like an adult when it comes to parenting methods, then it's not your job to pick out whatever fragments of insight she may have thrown out. If you have an academic background it's tempting to bury your head in some knowledge on an area you're struggling to get answers to, but you're not Sherlock Holmes, trying to deduce your wife's bullshit. You have a family to lead, so lead it, and if your wife can't fucking communicate about parenting then that's her problem. It's goddamn elementary.

Sepean · 2016-04-05T12:02:07+00:00

I'd suggest watching Nanny 911 episodes with her. It has a lot of no bullshit, very effective advice on parenting, and very often it deals with the inter-parental problems too.

stonepimpletilists · 2016-04-05T12:44:43+00:00

When you disagree with your boss, you don't bring it up in front of everyone at the meeting, you go with it, then afterwards, take him aside and express concerns... In private. It was the #1 rule when dealing with anyone I've ever worked for, because you're showing lack of confidence with the 'leadership' and creating rifts in unit cohesion.

You don't need readings, you just need to enforce acceptable behaviour. for example:

[insert proxy war in front of child]

7, go to your room. wife, this crap doesn't happen in front of the kids while we are disciplining them, period. If you have a problem, if I have a problem, we back each other up, and then talk about it. in private. understood?

And fucking mean it. That's it, no discussion, no argument. There are times for consensus, this is not one of them IMO. You've shown an example to her 20 seconds before, so it's shown.

If she tests you on this (and she will), ghost her from the conversation. Tell 7 that if she thinks getting mom to OK something after the fact is on... it's not on. repetition here, send her to her room, then have a talk with the wife, broken record. The way you try to enforce consistency in your 7 year old, your wife is no different. Oldest teenager in the house.

Full disclosure, I have no kids, but I have had them as subordinates.

CinnaMagister · 2016-04-05T13:17:14+00:00

"No-Drama Discipline" by Siegel and Bryson was okay. This isn't their point at all, but my takeaway was that I become a better parent by becoming a better person. My failures as a parent are because I'm not aware enough of what is going on, not mindful, because I'm focused on my own thoughts and what I'm doing. At this point, the kids become an interruption and I snap and discipline them without and consistency.

tl;dr I'm trying to become more mindful at home to give the kids my attention.

il-est-ressuscite · 2016-04-05T13:19:40+00:00

It sounds like your wife does not grasp the imperative of presenting a united front to your children. It is critical that you develop this as soon as possible, especially before they become teenagers. Consistency is key, absolutely key. I also highly endorse the Gordon book.

Maybe you could try having a conversation about this united front at a time, not in the midst of a conflict, when you can really discuss the long term ramifications of the dynamic going on in your family that you described in your post.

If your wife is at all reasonable then maybe you both can compromise (a bit) and agree on how you will respond to common discipline problems. Talk about how you will BOTH respond if A, B, or C happens. Write it down and type it up if you have to. Consistency.

It may not have anything to do with her dad at all. My wife was at home with 4 (count 'em! 4) and she always had to guard against the tendency to cave in order to avoid conflict.

Good luck with this project.

ParadoxThatDrivesUs · 2016-04-05T15:37:58+00:00

This shit is going to get a LOT worse when 7 becomes 17. If she picks up a drug habit and mom insists on denial and enabling, it's gonna ruin your family. I've seen it.

Kosmoknots · 2016-04-06T06:52:59+00:00

Screamfree Parenting is good and it fits in with MRP.

But yeah, you need to read more so that you don't turn to her for advice but instead lead by example. Show her how discipline and child raising is done and give her tips.

JuniperSunshine · 2016-04-05T18:56:02+00:00

Are you yelling and being "scary" when you discipline? This triggers your wife and serves no purpose. Don't wait until you get angry. Direct your daughter to do something (something to do, like, " go sit on the couch", not just "stop that"). If she disobeys, calmly give a punishment. The punishment itself isn't the point, the point is to be consistent. You can have kids jump up to obey you without laying a hand on them and without fear. Just deal with the disobedience the second it starts so you can stay calm.

Source: I home school five kids. I couldn't do that if they were insufferable.

40mullet · 2016-04-05T12:51:18+00:00

"Parent Effectiveness Training: The Proven Program for Raising Responsible Children", Thomas Gordon

Thank god I found this book 12 years ago, Haven´t Disciplined my sons a single time. No need. This Nanny 911 is awful. Fear is not respect.

Title	Wife's reliving dad battles
Author	MRPCowboy
Upvotes	3
Comments	38
Date	April 5, 2016 11:31 AM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/askMRP
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/4dfzt5/wifes_reliving_dad_battles/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/askMRP/wifes-reliving-dad-battles.207533 https://theredarchive.com/post/207533

Comments