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[–][deleted] 13 points14 points15 points 14 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
It's a dangerous world for women. We obviously need more "movements" and "consciousness raising" to protect women fr-
Oh wait, nevermind. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/figures/m613a1f1.gif
[+][deleted] 14 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
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[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You wouldn't be saying that if it were women dying.
[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
So what you're saying is that men dying is less important than women making a few dollars more.
:deadpan
[–][deleted] 10 points11 points12 points 14 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link
Women under 30 make more than men under 30. And every year that age goes up. The majority of the difference is because men do the most dangerous work, and hence die way more often. I don't disagree about lower income being an indicator of a lower life expectancy, but it doesn't mean that these offices are anything less than government sponsered discrimination.
Edit: source
[+][deleted] 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 10 points11 points12 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
No matter which way you try to spin it, being protected from danger is a sign of privilege.
[–]DoktorTeufel 6 points7 points8 points 14 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Physically difficult and/or dangerous jobs tend to pay more nowadays than many fresh-out-of-college jobs. Example: In southwestern Virginia, coal miners can make up to $100,000 a year. That "Deadliest Catch" television show demonstrates the same principle.
Moreover, women "extract" men's salaries far more often than the opposite is true. Women are the biggest spenders of household incomes, at least in the United States, which is why a great deal of television commercials are targeted at them.
You perform easier, safer jobs while also dipping your fingers into those larger wages men are making. Overall, I'd say that's the non-shitty end of the stick.
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Its not just television, its all advertising. Print, internet, tv, radio. Women make up 70% of discretionary [retail] spending in the US. All marketing is meant for them.
[–]borderlinebadger 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
but guy don't you know Men oppress womyn by making them spend their money.
[–]zaferk 10 points11 points12 points 14 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Oh look, another feminist, fresh out of womyn's studies class.
[+][deleted] 14 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Really?
So where did you get your "income inequality" line?
It sure wasn't from science.
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Isn't it interesting how Time Magazine reported that the "Wage Gap" in some areas favored women (by as much as 10%), and in other areas favored men (only 5%), yet the feminists keep saying "Women only earn 75 cents for every dollar men earn."?
And yet, to this day, after a 10 year long quest, I have never been able to find a single scrap from any credible source backing that 75/100 number up.
[–][deleted] 15 points16 points17 points 14 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link
You can tell women are oppressed because they kill themselves so much.
Oh wait...
http://www.mass.gov/eohhs/images/dph/communications/hom/chapter12/figure12-02.jpg
[–]boromeer3 9 points10 points11 points 14 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link
A female classmate of mine attempted suicide once and got an outpouring of sympathy and support.
A male cousin of mine did the same thing. I only heard from my family about it once.
[–][deleted] 14 points15 points16 points 14 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link
You know what you get when you're a guy who tries to commit suicide: guilt, anger, hate, resentment, and ostracized from your peers. When you're a man, if you survive, people consider you a coward. There is no sympathy for men. I know this. This is not speculation. I've lived it, still do.
[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 14 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
You're absolutely right! Why, just a few minutes ago this comment was left in this very thread:
"men have to go and be so selfish as to take their own life prematurely (not the only thing they do prematurely, eh girls? *wink /thetalkcackle). Can you imagine the pain and suffering they carelessly leave behind? Especially from a life that is so rewarding and a family that is so appreciative and loving that these men would be certain to the success of their progeny that they need not waste time with them any longer?
Hell, I wouldn't put it past "these men" using suicide just to arbitrarily skew the numbers, real men don't abandon their family to fate."
[–]bikemaul 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
From the comment and that account's other comments I think it was sarcasm.
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Really? My mistake. I don't have time to research everyone's post history, and I've read so many similarly crazy comments from feminists that it seemed like a totally plausible comment to me.
[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 14 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
It was satire. Everyone but you got it. Look at the upvotes of said comment.
[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points-3 points 14 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
4 = everyone? I question your intelligence my friend.
[+][deleted] -6 points-5 points-4 points 14 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
It is a figure of speech. Are you autistic savant or something else? (You don't get satire, you don't get figure of speech).
[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 14 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link
Just someone who can count. According to you that makes me some kind of genius I guess. (I do get figure of speech - I was just dismissing your attempt to insult me and turning it around on you. Apparently it bothered you for me to do that, so you had to type another insult to compensate.)
[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points-3 points 14 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
No, it doesn't. Autistics can count very well, but they can't use language properly. You are only proving my point.
When people speak, it is hard for most of autistics to understand what really is being said. People use metaphors, people speak sarcastically, people speak sardonically, they point the irony in certain situations ...etc. Apparently you are still stuck at the number part, don't get the point, meaning you are having similar problems. There is nothing I can do, but just know that next time someone says "my pants are on fire", his pants are not really on fire. Also when I said "you don't get the point", I don't mean the hypothetical mathematical concept of point.
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 14 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Except this is the Internet, and no one is actually "speaking", they're typing. Tone and inflection are absent.
Please refer to Poe's Law for further education on the matter.
[–]knowless 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
go fuck yourself.
edit: (sorry, been drinking):whether the initial post was factitious or not is irrelevant, poe's law
[–]Il128 2 points3 points4 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I have no idea why this comment would be down voted. I've read feminist postings and blogs that come right out and say, "Men kill themselves to oppress women."
[–]Cozen 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Women attempt suicide 4x more often then men. Women just tend to choose ways that are easier to foil (pills, carbon monoxide) where as men choose hanging and shooting more often, which have much lower survival rates.
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Women are more likely to use suicide as a cry for help, men typically intend to kill themselves. Why Women Are Less Likely Than Men To Commit Suicide.
[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Women only attempt suicide 2x more than men, not 4x more. And if you add up attempts + completed suicides:
Completed: 3:1 +
4:3
Men are still involved in suicide behavior more than women.
[–]shadowofthe 2 points3 points4 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
what is this from, can I read the full article?
[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Several different CDC reports here.
I'll find the direct link to the government study that created this graph.
[–]Hamakua 9 points10 points11 points 14 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
"Letting" women live longer is just benevolent sexism. You are missing the big picture of how men burden women with the whole living into old age hardship and men's selfishness of dying early.
Then there is the suicide rates, it's not bad enough that men naturally die earlier than women despite the majority of gender specific medical funding being female focused... men have to go and be so selfish as to take their own life prematurely (not the only thing they do prematurely, eh girls? *wink /thetalkcackle). Can you imagine the pain and suffering they carelessly leave behind? Especially from a life that is so rewarding and a family that is so appreciative and loving that these men would be certain to the success of their progeny that they need not waste time with them any longer?
Hell, I wouldn't put it past "these men" using suicide just to arbitrarily skew the numbers, real men don't abandon their family to fate.
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
Ah, yes. Women are the real victims here, not the men who died.
It never ceases amaze me the ability women have to play the victim, somehow, in almost every situation, even while in the same breath they utter misandrist comments about premature ejaculation.
[–]xzxzzx 8 points9 points10 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You do know that was satire, right?
[–]ENTP 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
"/thetalkcackle" gave it away as pretty blatant satire, friend. Basically this person is imitating and exaggerating something that a misandrist might say.
[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points-1 points 14 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
The "wink /thetalkcalcke" only serves to indicate that the previous statement ("not the only thing they do prematurely, eh girls?") is a sexual innuendo referring to premature ejaculation.
INB4 "well everyone else got it"
[–]ENTP 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Do you know what The Talk is? It is the show that thought it was hilarious that a man had his penis cut off by a woman named Katherine Kieu. Sharon Osborne, one of the hosts, called it "fabulous" that this man had his penis chopped off.
The fact that he wrote /thetalkcackle, means that he was satirizing from the perspective of a misandrist like one of the hosts from The Talk.
Everyone else got it. ;)
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
I don't know what "The Talk" is, nor does every person in the world, thus invalidating the premise that it was "pretty blatant", as evidenced by the fact that at least 1 person (and an unknown number of reads who haven't commented) didn't catch the reference. Sorry. At any rate this has lost my interest. I came here to talk about Men's Rights, not argue over references to TV shows.
[–]ENTP 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Not arguing with you. Just filling you in on the joke.
Here's the video. It was pretty appalling. Basically, the fact that this man was mutilated was considered as a hilarious joke by the assholes on the show.
PS: The "Mindless C***s" intro to the video is fucked up. I don't support that kind of misogynistic language, but it's the only vid I could find that doesn't have a 5 minute intro.
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 14 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Yeah that's pretty disgusting. I remember all the jokes about Lorena Bobbitt when I was growing up. Apparently male genital mutilation is either considered a non-issue, fact of life, or comedy gold.
[–]ENTP 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link
I think in our society, it is viewed as all 3. I was mutilated as a child, but people keep telling me that it was my parents' decision to make.
I wonder if they would say the same thing to a female victim of genital mutilation?
e:spell
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
No, because doing it to a baby girl is "child abuse".
[–]Hamakua 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
have an upvote, but if you notice the entry isn't altered in any way, click on the last period (it is a link) of the entry.
[–]ButtonFury 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Wow, I should live to be 130!
Yup we sure do have an edge in the health area, don't we guys!?
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Next time a feminist says something annoying, let's remind her as a white female she needs to "check her privilege" since they love saying that line so much!
+1
[–]borderlinebadger -1 points0 points1 point 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Gender is just a social construct oh except that is biological but only that.
[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Are you implying that shorter male life expectancy isn't a concern because everyone dies at some point?
I could take that very some logic and say this:
On a long enough timeline, the income rate for everyone drops to zero.
So I guess income disparity isn't a concern after all!
[+][deleted] -8 points-7 points-6 points 14 years ago (28 children) | Copy Link
What is your point here? Female life expectancies have always been higher, and The differences bbetween both genders and races seem to have fallen.
[–][deleted] 16 points17 points18 points 14 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Point is there are 4 Office's for women's health, and over 70 different government health programs for women.....but not one for men. Not one. So yea, thats my point.
I don't know what your government, I assume you are American.
What do those programs actually do?
[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yea, sure. And yes, American. Here is one article that goes into detail about the different programs.
[–]Cozen 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
How many of those are specifically related to giving birth?
To be honest, the maternity and infant programs have almost always been separate from the new offices of women's health. The FDA, CDC, NIH, USDA and Medicare programs are all fairly new, and have almost nothing to do with maternity. The HHS runs both the maternity programs along with their office of womens health. So to answer your question, about 8 of the programs are maternity and infant care.
[–]loose-dendrite 6 points7 points8 points 14 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link
I'm not the OP, but maybe he's upset that women need less resources for their health than men yet receive more than men. Simple equity would still favor women yet women anyway get more than is equitable. This is an example of female privilege.
[+][deleted] 14 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 14 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
That must explain why there's more funding for breast cancer than prostate cancer.
[+][deleted] 14 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
I don't think anyone would disagree with federal programs for maternity and infants, in fact head start, HHS Maternity programs, WIC and mother/ child well-being programs at very popular. But the Federal programs go far beyond just those items, and run dozens of programs on women's health where there is no comparable men's programs. I think MRAs would be happy with an Office of Men's health or expand the Offices for women to include men, and rename them. This is a simple issue of equal protection under the law.
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Congratulations on myopically pointing out 1 small piece of the puzzle and missing the point of my previous comment.
SIGH Wow let me spell it out for you:
The fact that women live 6 years longer than men is testament to the fact that, obviously, they don't need as much resources for their health-care then men do. Yet women, as pointed out by Qanan, receive the lion's share of research funding.
SMFH.
The relative danger of the two cancers probably explains that well enough.
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Cancer is a serious and dangerous illness, period.
I didn't say it wasn't, but not all cancers are formed equal.
[–]loose-dendrite -1 points0 points1 point 14 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Women would still live longer than men even if they died in childbirth at the natural rate (from what I surmise from wikipedia).
Safe childbirth is a low-hanging fruit and if it were a matter of safe childbirth or better healthcare for men, I'd choose safe childbirth since it has so damn much utility. We don't have to make that decision though so equity demands women have less non-birthing healthcare.
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
You're right. With the world's overpopulation crisis, safer childbirth has real utility.
[–]loose-dendrite 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Overpopulation is only a problem for poor places. Possibly causally, they're also the places where women have the least power.
So yeah, safe childbirth has lots of utility. So do birth control and abortion.
Overpopulation is a problem for the entire world, not just poor people.
While there is a clear and logical connection between birth control, education, and abortion in stabilizing and possibly reversing population growth, there is no logical connection between safer childbirth and stabilizing population growth. Indeed, it logically follows that increasing numbers of mothers and infants surviving childbirth contributes to population growth, whilst mothers aborting their pregnancies and using birth control does not.
This isn't to say I'm not in favor of safer childbirth - I'm just saying we should keep our arguments straight.
[–]loose-dendrite 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I think I understand your point. I think we're framing our arguments very differently without being incompatible.
I'm not making a connection between safe childbirth and population growth. I'm dismissing the significance of any connection because overpopulation can be solved by reducing the conception rate.
I don't think it's correct to say that safe childbirth has negative or even neutral utility today. Its removal wouldn't significantly affect overpopulation. Its only effect would be to slow it down slightly, making it short-term utility.
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 14 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
"Female life expectancies have always been higher"
Why is it, do you think, that white women live longer than black women in America?
I'll wait and see what you come up with.
[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 14 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
No need to wait. People who are economically disadvantaged tend to have less access to health care, I imagine this is the cause for part of the gap. Also, aren't black women at a higher risk of diabetes and diseases like that?
[–]ButtonFury 4 points5 points6 points 14 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Not sure why you were downvoted, but yes, poverty plays a role when calculating life expectancy.
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
So we agree that social privilege has a direct affect on life expectancy.
Women Africans don't live as long as whites, they say it's "social injustice and discrimination".
When men don't live as long as women (they used to...) it's called "biology", occluding the real reasons behind it (social injustice).
Thank you.
[–]ButtonFury 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I'm not arguing against you, just that Strumpetincinerator made a valid point.
Yes he did. And I used that point to support my argument.
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