Why are a lot of RPillers against the MRM ?

Aerobus · 2015-05-23T23:27:46+00:00

I support them and their views but I don't think they'll ever gain traction.

mordanus · 2015-05-23T23:30:25+00:00

Easy.

I was a reddit-active MRA for for over a year. Read and posted daily over at /mensrights and /femradebates.

I and most red-pillers have absolutely no problem with the MRM fighting for legal stuff. Issues like paternity fraud, harsher prison sentences for men, divorce rape and so on.

It's great that they do it.

The problem is that the MRM thinks that we can change society to respect and value men. Beta men, too.

This is not going to happen.

You will not be respected as a man unless you conform to traditional gender roles and work hard to be the best you can be. That will never change.

So that's my problem with the MRM. They give false hope that you might be respected for just being you instead of encouraging you to change.

They do a good job of raising awareness to how men are disposable and stuff. That's great and you can feel the change when you browse the internet. The "women have it worse"-myth is fading.

But you shouldn't hope that this awareness leads to you actually being treated equally and to be respected in the future.

That's why you go red pill, accept the way that it is and do your best to succeed in this environment and reality.

It's also not true that red pillers only think of themselves. You can see that we are helping men we don't even know over at /asktrp.

You can bet that many of us do the same in reallife. We help our friends.

Kill_Your_Ego · 2015-05-24T00:40:05+00:00

I worked hard for the MRM for almost a year. I spread the shared parenting initiative far and wide. And you know what the stats were?

It isn't women who hate men... That was a shock to me.. Honestly. After so much time in my bubble. A majority of women voted to give men equal rights to children, as they saw it.

It was men.... Men voted it down. Not women...

Honestly this has given me much pause. A majority, even though it was slim, of women voted for an MRA issue. And men killed it.

Things got a lot more complicated for me back then. How can I turn men away from their pathetic pedestooling and white knighting of even the lowest abusive drug addict whore?

Over time I came to accept that both feminism and men's rights suffer from the same flaw. A lack of teleology. Teleology, as founded by Plato stemming from his cave allegory, and written about by Aristotle, taught us that we have a purpose and we are good because we fulfill our purpose. Then the enlightenment came.

Descartes told us to discard teleology because our senses are divine. Gifts from God. Mill taught us that the good is not from teleology but from utility. And he turned us all into atomized cogs. Efficiency became our God.

The MRM fails to see that we do have a teleological purpose. A man protects and leads his home. He loves and protects his woman, who is physically weaker then him but innately stronger at the foundation. The MRM fails to see how to put the yin and yang back together and instead seeks a better feminism. If only we do more of X (for men) and less of Y (for women) then we can finally balance the equation! We can finally finish the long march to ethical perfection.

They are both wrong. We must accept our purpose. We live in nihilistic despair otherwise. Even when we accept it many will still live in despair. But at least we'll have a chance.

TheGreasyPole · 2015-05-23T23:19:15+00:00

I think last RP men would count themselves as "fellow travellers" with MRAs. We share some views ... But generally have different goals.

I agree with ABS that they are the equivalent of male feminists, and am wary on that basis as well. I want a middle line. Neither feminists or MRAs will give me that.

zikkitzo · 2015-05-24T01:20:27+00:00

The biggest victory of feminism is convincing the world that men work together in some form of patriarchy. Men are by nature always competing with each other. It's hard to explain. The world in inherently unfair, especially to men. We are expected to fight wars, work hard dangerous jobs, and die young(er). Just because one more injustice pops up doesn't mean I'm going to rally against women as part of a group. I'll use my understanding and intelligence to avoid the pitfalls like divorce rape, or child entrapment, or false rape charges. Adapting to feminist strategy will force change by itself.

[deleted] · 2015-05-24T13:17:24+00:00

They want to make men "feel" okay with being feminine and weak

I don't

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2015-05-23T23:15:30+00:00

The MRM are whiny beta liberal/lefty men who are the psychoepistemological equivalent of feminists. TRP is all about "enjoying the decline", not activism.

ifeelfuckingterrible · 2015-05-24T00:57:45+00:00

Because a lot of them don't believe in promoting "equality", even in the legal sense. And some of MRAs just kind of try to mimic feminists sometimes, which is understandably off-putting to anyone that already hates feminists.

[deleted] · 2015-05-25T00:08:08+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	Why are a lot of RPillers against the MRM ?
Author	HappilySingleWoman
Upvotes	4
Comments	101
Date	May 23, 2015 11:08 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/371c75/why_are_a_lot_of_rpillers_against_the_mrm/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/why-are-a-lot-of-rpillers-against-the-mrm.282002 https://theredarchive.com/post/282002

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