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[Mod] State Of The Subreddit May 2013

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May 4, 2013
39 upvotes

Well Red Pillers, it's May. In half a year we've managed almost 5,000 subscribers, and we're growing faster each day!

Since we're growing at such a fast rate, it's always a good idea to refresh everybody on our rules, and to address some new issues that have come to our attention.

I would like to take this moment to address the stance the moderators have on a few topics- and the direction we intend on steering this subreddit for the foreseeable future.

Spousal Rape

A commonly repeated trope is that we support rape because one of our moderators said "I don't believe in spousal rape." I will only address this once.

Any forcible exertion of will over somebody else's will is clearly wrong. Bodily autonomy should always be respected, and this applies in all scenarios, including marriage. Any debate on TheRedPill regarding the specifics of spousal rape is an argument of semantics and religion, and not one dismissing basic human rights. Nobody here advocates denying anybody else's autonomy, not even our moderators.

As rape is being defined as wrong because it denies the basic human right of agency, we must also consider the following:

Any force that requires a man, against his will, to make payments or to labor to afford making payments towards a another party must also be considered exertion of one's will over another's autonomy. This denial of agency denies a man's right to bodily autonomy.

Therefore we will refer to alimony as divorce-rape, circumcision as baby-rape, and conscription as life-rape.

If we accept that not all exertion of will over somebody else's autonomy is wrong, or that one can consent to waive certain rights to autonomy in certain conditions to certain people (even if the agreement includes a lapse of time), then we must revisit these definitions.

This will be the last time I address this: If we revisit the definitions, it is an exercise in hypothetical theory and not in itself an endorsement for rape.

Any attempts to conflate the two will be immediately removed and banned. It is a disservice and insult to victims who have actually suffered the terrible tragedy of rape.

Trolls

With the influx of new users, we have to deal with the unfortunate reality that there will be more trolls. Because of this, we're going to have to be a little more strict in our adherence to the policies.

Posts that utilize any kind of concern or shaming language are immediately suspect. We will take a look at each post on a base-by-case basis. Typical phrases that we will be looking out for include:

  • "I feel so bad, sad, etc."

  • "You're bitter."

  • "Misogynist"

  • "You all..."

Please note, we encourage open debate and discussion of our theories, but please bring facts, and not ad hominem attacks or concern for our well being.

A new trend that we have been seeing recently are the passive aggressive trolls that disguise themselves with plausible deniability. They attempt to cloud their true purpose by representing themselves as honestly inquisitive or perhaps genuinely mislead, and here to learn. We identify them by their concern language, ad hominem attacks, or insults to our moderators.

It is very possible to be here and ask questions, or disagree without setting off any red flags. However, common attributes of a troll post include:

  • Leading with a presumptive conclusion. "The fact that you're bitter is getting in the way of.."

  • Asking complex questions (fallacious questions) to which any answer is an endorsement to a presupposition that has not been determined or agreed upon. "Can anybody tell me why you guys hate women so much?"

  • Ad hominem "just because you are bitter.."

  • Condescension "This just seems like a bunch of chest beating to me.."

  • Unfalsifiable rhetoric - phrases, insults, accusations that cannot be falsified and serve no purpose but to manipulate the emotional state of the opponent or onlookers. "This is just a circle jerk"

  • Concern "I feel like this sub is focusing too much on.." (If you are genuinely concerned, contact a moderator, or submit more content of the quality you would prefer to see.)

  • Accusations of echo chamber/circle jerk. This is a combination of just about all of the above, but I want to highlight that the term "circlejerk" itself is meaningless and unfalsifiable rhetoric used to gain an upper hand in an argument without any of the legwork required to disprove the opponent's points.

  • Insulting the moderators - If you disagree with a moderator, that's just fine. You can do so publicly or in PM. We're not gods, we don't know everything, and we spend a lot of time learning every day. However, if you show disrespect to the moderators by using ad hominem attacks or thinly disguise an insult as a "genuine" disagreement, you will be banned.

If you feel you were unjustly caught we have no issue looking at appeals on a case by case basis, just know that your post history and account age will be looked at.

Our moderators do a lot of work to keep our sub clean and functioning on a daily basis, including banning trolls, flaring posts, and attempting to discuss solid red pill theory. Please do not make our jobs harder.


Post Information
Title [Mod] State Of The Subreddit May 2013
Author redpillschool
Upvotes 39
Comments 23
Date 04 May 2013 06:51 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit TheRedPill
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/4222
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/1dovmp/mod_state_of_the_subreddit_may_2013/
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Red Pill terms found in post:
plausible deniabilitythe red pill
Comments

[–]TehGinjaNinja36 points37 points  (9 children) | Copy

Therefore we will refer to alimony as divorce-rape, circumcision as baby-rape, and conscription as life-rape.

I'd advise against engaging in this kind of new-speak. Yes, one definition of rape could apply the these circumstances:

an act of plunder, violent seizure, or abuse; despoliation; violation: the rape of the countryside.

The common usage of the word is:

the unlawful compelling of a person through physical force or duress to have sexual intercourse.

Managing language to frame issues is important, but you can't do it arbitrarily. Advancing a semantic frame that most people will reject simply damages your credibility. Besides, there are already good semantic frames for these issues:

  • alimony = divorce theft
  • circumcision = genital mutilation
  • conscription = enslavement

[–]TRP Vanguardtheubercuber16 points17 points  (6 children) | Copy

While I agree with your sentiment, I think RPS's point is that 'sexual rape' itself has had its true meaning diluted. When mutually drunken sex, month-old sex that suddenly is regretted, or even long term seduction techniques on your partner are called rape, rape no longer has any meaning. (Also these accusations lend credence to RPS's 'feminists are mysogynists' hypothesis).

For example, I have been called a rapist several times because I spent two weeks gaming a girl before we had sex last month. FWIW, we have continued seeing each other romantically so I'm pretty sure she's consenting.

This diluted form of 'rape' does detract from the actual heinous crime of rape, and yet the perpetrators refuse to accept the harm they are causing to men and women that are attacked. I think this hyperbole is an interesting and potentially successful way to illustrate that to the general population.

edit: I think the reason this idea specifically will work is because it conflates a male problem with a female one. Women already laugh at male genital mutilation (see: daytime TV everytime a woman castrates someone).

[–]TehGinjaNinja8 points9 points  (3 children) | Copy

I agree that meaning of "rape" has been diluted in some circles by feminist efforts to expand the definition of rape. Indeed the very concept of "rape culture" implies that women in the western world experience "rape" just by living here. However, that very effort to expand the definition of rape has cost feminists much of their credibility and is one of the reasons that only a minority of women self-identify as feminists.

My concern is that it will like wise cost us credibility with the general population to use this sort of hyperbole ourselves. Using the normative, undiluted definition rape acts as a form of mirroring. It allows us to maintain and develop rapport with a broader audience.

Using the normative definition of rape also allows us to pivot to insisting on the use of that definition in deference to the sensitivities of rape victims. This casts us in a dominant social role as the defenders of our society's norms and as the protectors of crime victims.

Using hyperbole similar to that of feminists invites being perceived as ideological extremists in the same way many feminists now are.

[–]TRP Vanguardtheubercuber2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

diluted in some circles

I disagree. I think the dilution has completely permeated society.

For instance, the big incident a couple months ago in that Ohio high school involved a drunk guy fingering a drunk girl. A rape conviction followed from the courts. Not sexual assault. Know how many drunk girls have grabbed my crotch? And yet I am not a rape victim.

How about that father last month who proudly punished his 4-year-old for 'raping' that girl he kissed, and all the positive support he received for that?

I agree, we should not stoop to the level of the extremists. But I think the overuse of 'rape' to induce villainization of men and victimization of women is far more widespread than you give credit.

[–]TehGinjaNinja6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy

From what I've read the rape conviction in Ohio followed from the testimony of three witnesses, all friends of the defendants, who testified to that the girl in question was non-responsive.

As for "that father last month who proudly punished his 4-year-old for 'raping' that girl he kissed" consider the source. This guy is a 300lb mangina-neckbeard. Just read this to get an idea of how far gone he is.

I think the overuse of 'rape' to induce villainization of men and victimization of women is far more widespread than you give credit

I would agree that it's widespread. I just don't believe that it's a cultural norm yet. Though it can seem that way given how aggressively feminists push it.

[–]1Ill_mumble_that1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

The dilution has completely permeated society.

That's a fact. Not just your opinion.

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points | Copy

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[–]TRP Vanguardtheubercuber4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

According to the SRS-type crowd around here, using game is akin to deeply twisted psychological manipulation and emotional abuse. Therefore, any sexual or emotional relationship that comes from this is necessarily abusive. And any sex that results is necessarily rape.

The girl I am referring to here is 18. Despite clamoring for 16-year-old male murderers and rapists to get tried as adults, feminists treat 18 year old women as children that cannot be responsible for their decisions.

/r/theblupill had a whole thread about how I 'took advantage' of her and 'led her on' because of course this woman had no control over who she wanted to sleep with.

My FR on this girl

Blue Pill response

[–]TRP VanguardWhisper4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

Interesting way to put it.

In fact, instead of calling all these things rape, it is the concept you brought up, enslavement, that allows us to compare and contrast.

Because what is rape but temporary sex enslavement?

Rape is enslavement for sex. Paternity fraud and involuntary male parenthood are enslavement for money. Conscription is enslavement for death.

[–]1favours_of_the_moon14 points15 points  (2 children) | Copy

Hahaha, this whole "bitterness" ad hominem attack is a reference to Nietzsche's concept of "ressentiment." The FemiNazis used this as their favorite weapon in the 90s.

Basically, what it says is that, you've "failed at life" and now are taking it out on the holy sacred women who are the natural "winners." Because you can't stand to see such good wholeseome people successful. They deserve it and you don't, but you are insane and just CAN'T BEAR TO SEE IT.

That is to say, this was their favorite weapon, until I pointed out that THIS IS WHAT THE ENTIRE FEMINAZI PROGRAM IS BASED UPON. Ressentiment.

Tell me if this sounds familiar: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ressentiment "The sense of weakness or inferiority and perhaps jealousy in the face of the "cause" generates a rejecting/justifying value system, or morality, which attacks or denies the perceived source of one's frustration. The ego creates an enemy in order to insulate itself from culpability."

Yes, THE HAMSTER has a name!

[–]zionController4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy

Wow. Great find. No one gets this kind of attack more than I do.

People also get in debates with eachother over whether I'm a 14 year old virgin or a late 30's divorced guy. I wonder what thats called

[–]DingFuckinDong5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy

People also get in debates with eachother over whether I'm a 14 year old virgin or a late 30's divorced guy. I wonder what thats called

unimportant

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (3 children) | Copy

Big brother is watching you.

[–]Gobbledig00k4 points5 points  (2 children) | Copy

War is Peace

Freedom is Slavery

Ignorance is Strength

[–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Red Pill is closeted bitterness.

Propitiation is the path to earning women's respect.

George W. Bush conducted U.S. foreign policy in a prudent manner.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Resistance is Futile.

Take your Pill and fulfill your Role.

Even if you could go Back, would you?

[–]wrez4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy

In the Three Great Monotheistic religions alignment with Traditionalism, and from a historical perspective, there was obligation and duty flowing in two directions in a relationship. All three of them are very similar in the regard that spousal rape was not compatible with the religion, but sex was also an obligation/duty flowing in both directions in a relationship that is required of both partners to each other. In certain cases even, minimum frequency is specifically mandated!

In Judaism

http://www.jewfaq.org/sex.htm

http://www.jsafe.org/pdfs/pdf_032206_2.pdf

In Islam

http://www.muslimaccess.com/articles/Women/rape_in_islam.asp

http://en.islamtoday.net/artshow-403-3384.htm

In Christianity

http://www.marriagemissions.com/sex-when-a-wife-doesnt-want-to-make-love/

http://twotlj.org/G-2-9-E.html

Now, although many people these days are agnostic, atheist, or may believe in another religion, and may not believe in above and I do not fault them for that.

However, I don't believe it is equitable to our cause to bring up the term spousal rape without likewise mentioning the intentional withholding of sex as abuse of one's partner.

[–]TRP VanguardHumanSockPuppet1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

A good state of the subreddit address.

Is there a link somewhere in the sidebar where these mod posts can be accessed? As statements of general philosophy, they can be good material to the newly-awakened.

[–]Modredpillschool[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Most of my addresses are light on content. I'll sidebar this one though.

[–]Bobsutan1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Excellent well thought out post. Plus a great primer on how to avoid a logical fallacy.

[–][deleted] 1 points1 points | Copy

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[–][deleted] 1 points1 points | Copy

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[–]throwaway-o0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

This is what I did for /r/againstallarchons

http://rudd-o.com/aaafaq

comprehensive and as succinct as I could.



You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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