A great post I found today. Most comments come from the heart of men who feel something is not right and their thoughts need to acknowledged. I love the thread because usually when such things are commented elsewhere, men are mocked and called the usual 'misOgyNIsts, InCEL, etc'.

Sperm40mmSprintChamp · 2022-02-21T16:07:07+00:00

Top used responses seem to be: 1) It's just not worth it as a man/too annoying or difficult and 2) it's impossible to meet the standards of women

Both seem way too accurate.

Euclidly · 2022-02-21T15:30:05+00:00

I’m happy to see that over the past year or so a ton of guys are waking up to this. Still sad that they lock the thread when 99.9% of the comments are innocent.

2wicky · 2022-02-22T04:15:41+00:00

Men are a practical bunch. You might be able to silence them, but on an individual level, most guys are at some point going to ask themselves: is the amount of effort I am putting in this endeavour giving me the results I want? If the answer is no, they'll either try something else or not bother at all.
Anyone who thinks they can police this from happening is delusional.

5ilenceIsAssent · 2022-02-21T17:25:28+00:00

There's not really progress there. Zero criticism of women was allowed. ZERO. Anything that blames men, or at least DOESN"T blame women was just A-Ok.

throwawayincelacc · 2022-02-21T16:31:11+00:00

Man even the "motivating" comments are depressing on that thread. I know they didn't mean anything bad about it, but stuff like

Ive never used a dating app in my life and never will. Those apps = thousands of guys all vying for one woman. In real life = one guy vying for one woman. The odds are way better, and if you're remotely clean, well dressed, well spoken and/or funny, you have a decent chance at her at least conversing a bit.

And, well he's not wrong. And the goal was to try and bring up the guy he was talking to and motivate him. But it's just so ingrained that men need to be clean, well dressed, well spoken and/or funny. Women are just expected to exist and still have men vying for them. That's the double standard. That's why it's depressing. Because men have to have all those things and be confident in themselves for all those things. And you still never know if they'll shoot you down anyway for some other reason (which is still fair, men nor women should be forced into a relationship).

More snippets:

I feel the same, I don't want to bother other people. You always hear of two kinds of stories: Either it's "I met x in a grocery shop, it was love on first sight" or it's "Why can't people leave me alone, I just want to go shopping". This isn't worth the bad reputation you could potentially get (like being called a creep).

Feminists have convinced the world that men are creeps and even looking at women can count as sexual assault in some feminist minds. It's a huge risk to approach women in public like that.

I mean, I just don't have anything to offer. Just over a decade ago if you had a decent wage and could afford to support a family you were on pretty firm footing in the dating world. The overall dating pool was also much smaller without social media, so how attractive you were was often judged relative to people within your community. Nowadays things have changed a lot. Women are earning more, and tend to be attracted to men of a higher economic status than they are (obligatory, not all women) and I'm hardly a competitive salaryman. Furthermore social media has created beauty standards that are fairly skewed toward stalwart genetic thresholds, height, hair density, beard coverage, jawline, etc. Things you can't really adjust with clothes makeup or exercise. I'm unfortunately a balding pale blonde fella with sparse stubble. I work out and try to dress well, but I learned pretty quickly that doesn't help cover up flaws above the neck. I know that it'd really help my chances to improve my personality but again, mental health issues just make it such a challenge, and when you're ugly and not very well off having a bold, fun and interesting personality is really your last hope and I'm never gonna have the acting skills to be that guy.

If I'm being honest, I just haven't been blessed in any respect. If you're ugly, it helps to be smart and hard working, if you're neither of these things you have to at least be creative and funny. I just don't have anything about me that I can market. I like bird watching, stargazing, and writing, these are not sexy hobbies.

God writing this was a bad idea, now I'm depressed.

Another one reinforcing that men are held to higher genetic standards. Social media and dating apps basically give women the ability to shop online for the best possible male. All at no cost. Again, this is reiterated by another comment:

It’s simple for me really and as another redditor from a different thread worded it. I just hate the way people make me feel, I hate feeing like I’m being compared to others all the time, I hate feeling like I’m in some kind of audition line, I hate feeling like I’m giving others a part of me or opening up to them so they can “inspect” if I’m good enough at the risk of being thrown out and treated like some kind of unwashed animal when I’m found wanting.

If you've ever been on a dating app you know the feeling. I tried them for a few months and had a few dates. The number of matches into just complete ghosting was unreal. One date that stuck out to me was at the end, she told me I didn't make the next round. Seriously? I wouldn't have gone if you told me upfront that you were going out with 5 guys. And she wasn't even attractive, physically or personality wise, for me to put effort into competing for her. You're just a product on display and in virtually all these sites / apps, the men are expected to put the effort. It's always about your "opening" and even apps like Bumble which tried to reverse this did nothing to solve it since they would just send . or hi and expect you to open like on any other app.

Anyway I feel for all those men on that thread.

In my life not a single girl has ever been interested in me. I'd think that I have at least a slight chance if at least one girl was but nope, not a single one. I always see comments about people lying and saying that physical attraction doesn't matter but I KNOW that those motherfuckers wouldn't date someone if they were too ugly, because they KNOW that there is no point if no physical attraction is there.

When you go on dry streaks it's particularly brutal. Again, the confidence aspect is huge and being a "lesser male" or "creep" as women would put it makes it far more difficult to build that. Most men aren't that stupid. We know we're no movie star. We know we're no first pick. And still we have to build the confidence to get shot down 99.99% of the time and that's the depressing part.

ExMuzzy · 2022-02-21T18:41:10+00:00

As a married guy I don't see myself wanting to get into a relationship again if it goes wrong. I am happy with my wife. I was unemployed and broke when she approached me but I don't think this is common. Generally:

You are expected to do the "romantic" legwork during the dating stage and when you're in an official relationship.
You are not allowed to openly state your preferences.
Relationships are expensive for men and it seems to be normal for women to be in control of finances in a relationship.
You are fucked financially in a divorce. Even worse is that custody is usually awarded in favour of mothers.
Average looking women have 100's of men in their dm's
You risk your relationship by opening up emotionally.

I can pretty much get emotional support from my family and friends, the only thing lacking is sex. Is sex worth all of these drawbacks? For me, no.

Also comments in that post just miss the mark completely:

Too many people in this thread just ooze bitterness and red-pill adjacent nonsense. But if you guys want to take yourselves out of the dating game don't let me stop you. I just worry that too many have an unhealthy view on women.

It's not an unhealthy view to have when the odds are stacked against you. Men are opting not to play the game but this guy thinks it's misogyny. I guess some women are offended at the idea that they are not worth pursuing. Some are trying to make men feel as though they're missing out lol.

PQKN051502 · 2022-02-21T16:18:48+00:00

I am happy that the reactions to this post are mostly positive. Reddit is changing. I can feel that.

It is locked but usually the mods would remove the whole post. I am glad that the world are having more empathy with men's feelings.

We are making process.

No_Seaworthiness9625 · 2022-02-21T18:03:42+00:00

The mod of that garbage sub, is a cancerous cunt

PQKN051502 · 2022-02-21T16:16:41+00:00

All humans need to learn how to deal with loneliness. It would help us A LOT.

I usually had a training session of spending time alone with myself, learning to how to be comfortable being with myself and getting to know myself more.

We need to know that loneliness is something nature had "installed" into our brain to make us herd animals. We need to know how to stay above it.

I don't date. If love comes, it comes. I don't even try to find it anymore. All my past boyfriends got to know me very randomly, we started as friends then became lovers.

Dating apps give me the off vibes because they give me sex friends vibes instead of serious relationships vibes.

RedcloudGeorge · 2022-02-21T19:12:00+00:00

It's good to know there are other "men who feel something is not right" and that they have a place to talk about it. I thought I was the only one until I found subs like this.

TheSilverShade · 2022-02-22T18:51:43+00:00

That thread proves that way more men are going their own way.

This is why the mod locked it. Can't encourage other men to do it.

SanctuaryMoon · 2022-02-21T20:04:12+00:00

Eh not gonna lie that just seemed like the boys version of FDS. Same hopeless bitterness.

That said, I do believe there's a big problem that's sabotaging dating for young men (as well as other things) and it's not women's standards. It's money. Young people as a whole now have much less money than their parents did at the same age. Young working men have been slowly robbed of decent wages over the course of 50 years, and it's not because of women. That money has gone straight to the richest people/corporations. Everything about having a family (dating, buying a home, having kids) has become unaffordable for so many and it's getting worse. Men are at their best (mentally, emotionally, physically) when their hard work is rewarded with good pay and that has been taken away by decades of trickle-down economics.

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