Chivalry is dead! Quick, resuscitate it.

MRB2012 · 2014-02-18T13:24:14+00:00

The universal male decency we keep hearing about is largely a myth.

Given that our society actually exists, we can say that male decency is in fact the rule.

Sure, most men might not be bad. But it takes more than 'not being bad' to be 'actually good'.

So most men are Lawful Neutral then?

Whenever conversation is raised about patriarchy, violence and the lack of equality that still permeates our society

You're in New Zealand. You've got a lower murder rate than Britain. "Violence" is a nice joke you people tell each other, not a reality you face.

Is it in the number of men who stand by while sexist jokes are made because 'it's meant to be funny'? Is it drawn from those folks who want women to know that even though they're not saying it's their fault, they shouldn't have been drinking so much? Is it found in the proportions of dudes who talk about how it's women's own incompetency that's holding them back from sitting in positions of power or being paid equal wages for equal work? Is it in the number of men who wax lyrical about how 'ugly' women are when they express a robust opinion, or dare not to pluck and preen their bodies in a way that 'all' men find pleasing?

Some sexist jokes are funny, drinking too much is bad for you, the wage gap is the result of the choices women make, and some women are not pretty. These things are all true. Speaking the truth doesn't make you a bad person.

No, apparently all it takes to be considered a 'decent bloke' is to take an each way bet at doing nothing - nothing to perpetuate oppression, and nothing to stop it.

That seems to be a good definition to me. Living your life without hurting others makes you a decent person. It may not make you a great person, but that seems like a great standard for a decent one.

Worse, such 'decent blokes' want to be rewarded for this lack of action, an expectation that not-so-subtly reveals the very same entitlement that serves to perpetuate gender inequality. Translated, what they're really saying is, "Praise me, because I have refrained from behaving in a way both you and I know I could get away with if I wanted to. Please may I have my cookie now? Actually, just give it to me."

If we punish those who break the rules, why shouldn't we reward those who uphold them? What's wrong with acknowledging when someone has done a good deed?

So it is argued that we cannot be racist because even though we make sweeping generalisations about the mysterious ways of non-white folk, we don't burn crosses on their front lawn

If you don't hold prejudiced beliefs about nonwhites and don't go around terrorizing them, you are by definition not a racist. You aren't making a rational argument, you're bitching about the truth being inconvenient to you.

and that we cannot possibly be misogynists, because even though we think women should take more care with what they're wearing and we laugh when someone tells a sexist joke because humour makes the world go round and think feminists have gone too far, we don't personally beat up women or sexually assault them.

Again, this is true. If you don't hate women, you're not a misogynist. End of story.

This is apparently what 'being decent' looks like. It's a conditional expression of privilege that pays lip service to equality but doesn't actually go out of its way to defend it, and whose benevolent support ends the moment it asks us to actually do something. Worse, it balks at this request for demonstration, as if it is enough for our decency to remain an impotent figurehead, and an insult worse than all the discriminations put together to challenge its legitimacy. If I had a dollar for every time I heard a man tell me that if I want his support to continue, I had better start being nicer to him...well, then I wouldn't have to worry quite so much about the wage gap.

If you want me to fight your battles for you, you are obligated to make it worth my while in some way. It's that simple.

Edmund Burke once wrote, "In order for evil to flourish, all that is required is for good men to do nothing."

Yes, and?

Doing nothing, be it bad or good, is not enough to actually respect the concept of equality. Real action is required, even when it feels makes you feel awkward, even when it ruins the mood - even when it might shift the target of ridicule onto you.

Why should I fight your battles? Are you going to pay me? Give me a medal? Write an essay commending me and put it in the paper? If not, why should I fight for you?

Because, Good Men, every time do nothing in response to tired sexist jokes or victim blaming or discussions of 'provocation' in regards to gendered assault, you're actually supporting the system that continues to oppress women.

The system doesn't even exist. So not only do you want me to fight your battles for you for free, you want me to fight them against something that doesn't exist. Why should I do that?

Do you know one of the reasons it's not okay to laugh at jokes about rape victims? It's not just because it's extremely insensitive not to mention despicable - it's because treating rape and its victims like they are fodder for humour tells perpetrators that what they did wasn't really that bad.

Psychopaths, by definition, don't feel empathy for others. They don't feel guilty. Rape jokes don't make them do what they do, they simply don't see any reason why they shouldn't. They don't feel that the rules apply to them.

Unless you are vigilant every day about standing against gender discrimination and misogyny - and that means stepping up, being a proactive bystander and speaking out against ideas and behaviours that perpetuate misogyny - then I'm sorry to tell you that you are not a decent, good bloke. And when you threaten to withdraw your support because you've been made to feel bad, all you're doing is reasserting your own socially gifted dominance.

So you're confirming that you offer me absolutely no reward for fighting on your side?

And frankly, that doesn't sound very decent to me. You might not be a bad man - but unless you're doing something to challenge and change the world we live in for the better, you're not a good one either. All you are is an ordinary person, doing nothing and holding your hand out for a cookie that you do not deserve.

So you're going to promote misandry if I fight for you. Meaning that you not only want me to fight for free against an imaginary enemy, you want me to do it for the purpose of my own detriment. That's not happening. Oh, and only 20% of Americans identify as feminists. You need men like me. But you've failed to make it worth our while to help out. You shouldn't be surprised that you're losing.

2014-02-18T17:46:33+00:00

Waingawa Hey man, its only us white folks who can be racist, only us men who can be sexist, only us heterosexuals who can be homophobic. Doesn't it eventually get up your wick that all these things are pointed at normal blokes who just want to get on with their lives and generally get sick of the whiners. If the average White male has stick or insults thrown at him he will just ignore it, or show two fingers, and move on.

This comment summed it up for me.

viciousvixen26 · 2014-02-18T16:13:37+00:00

If chivalry is dead it's because stupid broads that don't know the difference between someone hitting on them and good manners beat it to death

Wawoowoo · 2014-02-18T18:35:33+00:00

Someone should write the same article, but make it about what women owe a woman because she is a woman. Alternatively, what Good Men should do to fight the alien menace.

Nomenimion · 2014-02-18T19:02:30+00:00

We aren't put on this earth to serve ungrateful women.

MrmNZ · 2014-02-18T09:19:48+00:00

"Unless you are vigilant every day about standing against gender discrimination and misogyny - and that means stepping up, being a proactive bystander and speaking out against ideas and behaviours that perpetuate misogyny - then I'm sorry to tell you that you are not a decent, good bloke. And when you threaten to withdraw your support because you've been made to feel bad, all you're doing is reasserting your own socially gifted dominance."

Whisper · 2014-02-18T22:10:54+00:00

I refuse to admit that chivalry is dead. Because I haven't finished kicking it yet.

baskandpurr · 2014-02-18T17:57:06+00:00

all it takes to be considered a 'decent bloke' is to take an each way bet at doing nothing - nothing to perpetuate oppression, and nothing to stop it.

So what does it take to be a decent woman? Next time the police arrest a man because his partner is violent, I assume Clementine Ford won't "take an each way bet at doing nothing". Clementine will do something to stop that oppression, right?

StrawRedditor · 2014-02-18T21:19:54+00:00

The gall of some of these female writers is just fucking astounding.

I mean, imagine any article by any man that would even remotely hint at even the thought of telling any woman what to do.

Title	Chivalry is dead! Quick, resuscitate it.
Author	MrmNZ
Upvotes	28
Comments	15
Date	February 18, 2014 9:18 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1y88j3/chivalry_is_dead_quick_resuscitate_it/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/chivalry-is-dead-quick-resuscitate-it.1003645 https://theredarchive.com/post/1003645

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