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mrminibagel
[–]soalone34 35 points36 points37 points 10 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
It just isn't right that men have to sign up to the draft to drive and vote while women can do both those things for free. Either abolish it for both sexes or include both sexes, this is blatant sexism.
[–]FilmCurb 9 points10 points11 points 10 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
I love telling people that woman have the automatic right to vote and seeing their shocked faces thinking I am dumb but then explaining the legality of it and how we must sign up for the draft first.
[–]Macismyname 10 points11 points12 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Every time I bring it up that argument bounces right off of them and they tell me about systemic oppression of women.
It's so hard to get them to admit sexism can and does exist against both genders.
[–]soalone34 6 points7 points8 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
The fact that people rarely even connect the dots for this one proves feminism is failing to address male issues equally to female issues.
[+]ThePigmanAgain -8 points-7 points-6 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Where is the evidence that you have to sign up for the draft in order to vote? Do you need a driver's licence or ID card to vote? In Aus we just turn up and give our name.
[–]Zosimasie 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Nationalized male citizens between certain ages can lose citizenship if they don't sign up for SS. So, there's that, as well.
[–]FilmCurb 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Someone in the thread said they did but what I mean is failing to sign up for the draft is technically a felony and with a felony you can't vote.
[+]ThePigmanAgain -8 points-7 points-6 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
failing to sign up for the draft is technically a felony and with a felony you can't vote.
No, being convicted of a felony means you can't vote. Hardly anyone gets prosecuted, though, hence millions of Amerikan men are voting despite not signing up. Besides, you said "we must sign up for the draft first," and that is not the case. You can vote today, be convicted tomorrow for not signing up. But like i said, prosecutions are extremely rare.
[–]chaku89 15 points16 points17 points 10 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
This rule is just absurd ;D You want to drive? so you sure are hell want to be in our Military :D Wonder why no feminists rages over the sexism in that. Guess its not beneficial for them :D
[–]jtaylor73003 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Don't confuse the Selective Service with the Military. Even if you don't qualify for the Military, the Selective Service could put to work in any private sector that is short on man power as long as the President deems it vital to the war effort. I remember when I went to renew my license and showed my active duty military I.D. to prove I was signed up for Selective Service. It didn't count. I had to go to the internet and print out a copy of me actually being registered for Selective Service.
[–]Mitschu 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Heh, back in the day I hit a rough spot and had to register for unemployment. Gave the lady at the desk all my information, got a letter a few days later telling me that my application for benefits qualification was denied. (Never mind actually getting the insurance, I wasn't qualified to even ask for it.)
Called up to sort it out, they told me that the big issue was that they couldn't find any record that I was registered with Selective Service. After working with them for a few minutes, we realized that the reason why I wasn't showing up at all in any of their records is because she had somehow completely misread my Social Security number and plugged it in wrong. Like, I'm pretty sure there aren't any numbers out there that begin with three zeros but she didn't bat an eye wrong.
Now, according to their records, I didn't exist in any government database and had given them a blatantly false SS number (my handwriting has since improved, lesson learned)... but the real crisis that got me rejected from collecting unemployment insurance was that I was a 20-something year old male apparently not registered with Selective Service.
[–]jtaylor73003 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
That is because if you are a male and didn't sign up for the selective service then you can't receive any federal funds or training.
[–]Mitschu 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yep.
I just found it amusing that I slipped off the grid and was for all purposes temporarily an illegal agent with falsified records operating in the US... and the primary concern they raised was that if there was ever another draft, they wouldn't know where to begin with tracking me down.
I used my temporary invisibility to sell all our state secrets to my Russian motherland... and then registered for Selective Service under my false identity so they would stop worrying about how I might be a preemptive draft dodger. I may cross the line a little with international terrorism, but even I know better than to avoid mandatory registration for potential federally compulsory service. In mother Russia, you serve America! Ha ha ha!
/sigh
In all seriousness, they really needed to straighten out their priorities if the only questionable thing they saw was that I, SS #000------, was not registered for the other SS. Like... no other concerns or questions for me? No NSA men in black suits waiting for me when I get home to ask how I got in this country and acquired an obviously fake SS number? No debriefing and torture? Just make sure that whoever I am, I sign up for the Selective Service before it's too late?
[–]LilyBentley 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
What the actual fuck?
"You won't fly 2000 miles and take a bullet for a war you don't believe in and maybe summarily execute total strangers? You don't deserve basic health care or food you goddamn Soviet cocksucker!"
Found my aggravation for the night.
[–]FilmCurb 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I never had to give any proof of being signed up for the draft.
[–]Cannon0006 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I remember when i turned 18 I couldnt become a Conscientious Objector for the US Draft because my Drivers License was akin to consenting to the draft
[–]RedPresident 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Forget driving and voting, how are you supposed to get a job or an education without an ID card? What state is this from?!
[–]mrminibagel[S] 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
North Carolina, but that doesn't matter.
All states do this same thing.
[–]RedPresident 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Huh, I don't remember having that on there in California back in the 90's... then again that was like 20 years ago.
[–]unklestinky 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You probabaly filled it out without even realizing it. If I recall correctly (in Ohio 1992) I registered when I went to fill out my FAFSA. It was apart of a packet I got in the mail from the college for financial aid. It's kind of weird to think about, but this was the first time I recount thinking that a law was sexist against men. It was what started my slow awakening to men's issues.
[–]Missing_Links 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That's the trick: you're supposed to not get a job or sign up if you don't agree to be drafted when the head of your country demands it.
Although not signing up for the draft is almost never prosecuted, you are automatically signed up when you get or renew a state ID card of any kind when male and 18+. You cannot be anything but a disenfranchised citizen or an expat if you do not "agree" to military service if called upon. It's an offer you cannot refuse.
[–]jtaylor73003 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Many states. I know for fact Oklahoma is one.
[–]folie_a_deuxxx 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
Not to be dumb, but I'm trying to find the source saying that refusing to sign with selective service precludes you from voting. Could someone provide a good citation?
[–]mrminibagel[S] 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
https://www.sss.gov/Registration/Why-Register/Benefits-and-Penalties
"Failing to register or comply with the Military Selective Service Act is a felony punishable by a fine of up to $250,000 or a prison term of up to five years, or a combination of both."
Felons can't vote.
[–]ThePigmanAgain -3 points-2 points-1 points 10 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
No, nobody can give a good citation for that as it is not true. In the case of this pic, if you need an ID card or driver's license to vote, then it is a roundabout way of forcing you to sign up before you can vote. But i don't know if that's the case or not, as other forms of ID may be acceptable. When it comes to the letter of the law, no, men do not have to sign up for the draft to vote, but a lot of MRAs continue to insist otherwise, thereby making us all look like idiots. Refusing to sign up does, however, keep you from certain student loans and all government jobs, which is outrageous enough.
[–]mrminibagel[S] 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
It does prevent you from voting. Look in the link I posted.
It's a felony to refuse to sign up.
[–]ThePigmanAgain -2 points-1 points0 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
You are not a felon until convicted. Hardly anyone gets convicted. You may as well claim that being a car thief prevents you from voting -- noooo, being a convicted car thief keeps you from voting.
[–]mrminibagel[S] 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Actually, plenty of people get convicted. It's probably the easiest to convict crime because it's so easy to prove.
[–]ThePigmanAgain -2 points-1 points0 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Actually, plenty of people get convicted.
Like who? Everyone i've heard of, and they are only a handful, deliberately got themselves charged to make a point.
[–]sizzletron 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
America: one terrible idea after another.
[–]Millenia0 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Wait, you guys get signed up for the military when/if you want a license to drive?
[–]mrminibagel[S] 6 points7 points8 points 10 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
basically, but not exactly. We don't "sign up" but we have to say that we consent to be drafted. So we basically are made into reserves. However, we can be forced to whenever it's convenient for Washington.
[–]ThePigmanAgain 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Well, that's pretty disgusting, even by Amerikan standards.
[–]tallwheel 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Evidence of a clear link presented.
[–]PhilWylie 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Remember that time all the feminists organized a march down to the post office and demanded to sign up for selective service?
Yeah neither do I.
[–]highspeed_lowdrag2 -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Just say you are an illegal immigrant
[–]jtaylor73003 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Wrong. Under the Selective Service Act even illegal immigrants must sign up, where by if they were in this country as a 25 year old and failed to sign up before 26 they can be denied citizenship.
[–]highspeed_lowdrag2 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Wow...
[+]NewYorkJewbag -9 points-8 points-7 points 10 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
The reason for this rule is because it was invented at a time when sex roles were primitively defined and the idea of a woman being ALLOWED into the military (much less conscripted into it) was a questionable one.
I think most women today, feminist or not, would agree that making selective service compulsory for all 18 year olds would be perfectly fair.
This is a straw man. It has nothing to do with "oppresshun" of men.
[–]mrminibagel[S] 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yes it does.
Regardless of why the act was originally made, the fact is that men are being forced to fight for a cause they may/may not believe in. I get the feeling that if young women were going to be killed, many of the less "necessary wars," i.e. Vietnam, Iraq, etc. would've never occurred.
The law continues to exist not due to hatred of women, but due to men's lives not being valuable.
[–]The03k 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
woman being ALLOWED into the military (much less conscripted into it) was a questionable one.
That sounds like something feminist would hate, yeah? How dare they not think of women the same as they do men! They can get the right to vote but we can't? They can be in the military but we can't? Let's fight for it! Let's get our right to vote but please for the love of God let's not fight to be forced to sign up for selective service!
Which, yes, is a response to "I think most women today, feminist or not, would agree that making selective service compulsory for all 18 year olds would be perfectly fair".
Point is, feminists have never (As far as I know) tried to stop men from being forced to sign up, or tried to get women to sign up. If some feminists have, then it's obviously not working and I'd imagine because of the lack of support for it by other feminists.
Oh and here's this video.
[–]tallwheel 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You'd be surprised. Ask any feminist about this issue and they will shift the discussion to doing away with selective service for both sexes. They will never suggest that women should also be subject to selective service, even as a temporary measure before it can be abolished.
[–]NewYorkJewbag -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
"Any" "always" "never" - you don't get out much, do ya young feller?
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[–]soalone34 35 points36 points37 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]FilmCurb 9 points10 points11 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]Macismyname 10 points11 points12 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]soalone34 6 points7 points8 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+]ThePigmanAgain -8 points-7 points-6 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Zosimasie 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
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[+]ThePigmanAgain -8 points-7 points-6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]chaku89 15 points16 points17 points (6 children) | Copy Link
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[–]Mitschu 4 points5 points6 points (3 children) | Copy Link
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[+]NewYorkJewbag -9 points-8 points-7 points (4 children) | Copy Link
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