~ archived since 2018 ~

This is perfect.

Jeremy_Savilla

June 14, 2019

1002 upvotes

/r/MensRights

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Post Information

Title	This is perfect.
Author	Jeremy_Savilla
Upvotes	1002
Comments	59
Date	June 14, 2019 9:08 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/c0pbsv/this_is_perfect/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/this-is-perfect.1206241 https://theredarchive.com/post/1206241

Comments

[–]TC1827 96 points97 points98 points 7 years ago (43 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 7 years ago* (41 children) | Copy Link

[–]EricAllonde 18 points19 points20 points 7 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Furthermore, stem fields are often a boys club.

The only two STEM fields where the percentage of women is still well below 50% are engineering and software development. All the other STEM fields have more than 40% women.

Once upon a time, every professional field was a "boys club". That didn't stop women flooding into law, medicine, veterinary science, maths, business, all of the humanities, architecture and every other field - except for engineering and software development.

Gee, it's almost as if... most women just aren't interested in engineering and software development. Hundreds of millions of dollars have been spent trying to persuade women to enter these career, with no success.

At some point we should accept that women just aren't interested and stop nagging them to choose these fields.

And we should immediately stop whining that men are sexist & misogynistic just because women are displaying preferences in their career choices that feminists disapprove of.

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[–]SirYouAreIncorrect 5 points6 points7 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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[+]just5this -9 points-8 points-7 points 7 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

[–]TheJoestarDescendant 9 points10 points11 points 7 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]just5this -1 points0 points1 point 7 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

This is targeted only to the hypocritical ones that enter gender studies but then cry how not enough women go to STEM. The nuance is different on the link you gave

You’re right the link I gave is even more targeted to one individual rather than a whole group. Yes you can make the argument that it’s only for the “hypocritical” ones but every woman in the meme is looked as an idiot with the man looking as reasonable. At best it implies women are hypocrites. At worst it implies they’re too stupid and/or lazy for STEM

Also idk what you've got against memes, but I see nothing wrong with memes. Memes are just another way to convey an idea or make a point.

Yes but they’re a low effort way to poorly convey a point. It paints a broad brush on something that should be nuanced. Also rule 2 says no low effort posts and includes memes as an example.

[–]TheJoestarDescendant 2 points3 points4 points 7 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link

the link I gave is even more targeted to one individual rather than a whole group.

Uh... mosquito landing on a man's cheek can happen to any man. But actually in that link after looking at it again the problem with that one is how there would be outrage if the genders were flipped. That post itself is not problematic but the double standard is - to me anyway; tho there are indeed some ppl in this sub that are so oversensitive they are like the MRA version of SJW feminists

but every woman in the meme is looked as an idiot with the man looking as reasonable.

Yeah this is why I said this is a bit ambiguous. The meme can do a better job by probably including one woman signing up to the STEM. The three women represent the modern feminists when I first saw it tho but meh your pov is fair enough.

Yes but they’re a low effort way to poorly convey a point. It paints a broad brush on something that should be nuanced. Also rule 2 says no low effort posts and includes memes as an example

I wouldn't say memes are necessarily low effort and poorly convey a point. Sometimes memes can be high effort and accurate although simple. I suppose memes are like a quick way to convey a point to get people interested; detailed explanations can come later. But if rule 2 actually includes memes as example then a'ight... Maybe the mods forgot that rule existed, maybe the mods don't see it as a meme, maybe like me some mods see the rule as unreasonable and ignore it, idk.

[–]just5this 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Uh... mosquito landing on a man's cheek can happen to any man.

Sure but she’s talking about her husband. I think you’re splitting hairs at this point. If she said it about her friends I don’t think there would be outrage if a man said it about his (male) friends I don’t think there would be outrage.

there would be outrage if the genders were flipped. That post itself is not problematic but the double standard is

I agree that there’s a double standard and it shouldn’t exist. I was going to go into a longer explanation, but if we’re basically on the same page here it’s fine. My point wasn’t that one meme is worse than the other, just that they both could be seen as sexist.

I wouldn't say memes are necessarily low effort and poorly convey a point. Sometimes memes can be high effort and accurate although simple. I suppose memes are like a quick way to convey a point to get people interested; detailed explanations can come later.

Sure in a best case scenario, but you know people don’t always provide that extra context and can easily take away a skewed view of the meme “true message” if it even is trying to be deep. A meme can describe something simply, but there’s no way it’s enough alone. Even if you think it’s accurate the topic is too broad to be condensed like that.

But if rule 2 actually includes memes as example then a'ight... Maybe the mods forgot that rule existed, maybe the mods don't see it as a meme, maybe like me some mods see the rule as unreasonable and ignore it, idk.

Those are all explanations, but those are just bad explanations. Maybe they forgot? That’s not a reason for the sub to devolve into what it is. If they thought it was an unreasonable rule they would change it. Imo they want to have their cake and eat it too. They want the popularity a meme can give them, but what the appearance of legitimacy. I don’t know what you think about the rest of reddit, but imagine if /r/news or /r/politics allowed memes to be posted instead of article. It would be a total shit show.

[–]TheJoestarDescendant 2 points3 points4 points 7 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Seems we have reached a middle ground here except for the last part:

A meme can describe something simply, but there’s no way it’s enough alone. Even if you think it’s accurate the topic is too broad to be condensed like that.

Well the purpose of a meme is to raise attention first. This one, I believe is enough to bring attention to the issue of feminists from gender "studies" crying for more women in STEM, despite not going to STEM themselves. Tho yeah I guess this can be taken out of context; which can be prevented with slight modification.

If they thought it was an unreasonable rule they would change it. Imo they want to have their cake and eat it too. They want the popularity a meme can give them, but what the appearance of legitimacy.

I believe they should, but idk. Wouldn't jump into that conclusion tho

imagine if /r/news or /r/politics allowed memes to be posted instead of article. It would be a total shit show.

Dunno about you mate, but they are already shit show to me - maybe because I lean right. Politics especially claims to want civil discussion but calls for violence against people on the right are regular. It's so bad the sub r/ShitPoliticsSays is a thing.

Also dear other people, don't downvote people that are willing to have civil discussion please?

[–]just5this 0 points1 point2 points 7 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Dunno about you mate, but they are already shit show to me - maybe because I lean right. Politics especially claims to want civil discussion but calls for violence against people on the right are regular.

Yeah I had a feeling that you would have said something like that (they’re already bad!), but you really don’t think having memes would make it worse? I guess your opinion that they should change the rule gives me an answer I just strongly disagree. I’m fine with memes in a meme subreddit. If you want to bring positive attention from outsiders memes aren’t the way to do it. Yes memes can be edited to be “more accurate” but at that point you’re looking for a needle in a haystack. Then you have to make judgement calls for what meme is appropriate vs what is just blatant racism/sexism. Memes are “sexy” but it just breeds a circle jerk rather than real discussion like this sub used to claim to be.

Also dear other people, don't downvote people that are willing to have civil discussion please?

Appreciate that, but I’ve come to expect it. Honestly I’m surprised when my comments don’t get downvoted here or I get a fair conversation like we’ve had so far. I usually only comment when I think the post or comment is BS and no one has tried to call the person out. (Not saying you’re full of bs but the guy who got heavily downvoted didn’t really explain why the meme could be sexist). Honestly I think a lot of times this subreddit is a circle jerk and the meme culture feeds into that. Not always, but I think the bigger the sub has gotten and the lack of moderation (The first two rules aren’t always followed) is what caused it. /r/mensrants is a thing. Why not keep those things there?

I see you lean right so my instincts say you’re a Dio descendant, but the rest of this convo makes me think you have a little Joestar blood in you ;)

[–]sneakpeekbot1 point 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

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Personally I think that anyone that comments only a negation of a comment is not being constructive and a dick. If the entirety of what you have to contribute to the conversation is that you believe a comment was misread and two posters actually agree, then I think the onus is on you to at least double check to be sure that your trivial contribution is correct.

Despite that the possibility always exists of course that you can still screw it up and even though you double checked you still get it wrong. In light of this possibility I think that if you are going to make only a trivial contribution to a comment chain composed of non trivial positions then it’s probably worth injecting a modicum of humility and doubt into your trivial statement rather than preemptively doubling down on it through the use of modifiers like “exactly” or “precisely” etc

Good alternatives could have been something like, “unless I am missing something you are saying the same thing as the previous comment”

If you instead lead off with “I’m very sure you are wrong” expect to be corrected in no less certain terms.

[–]FaustoLG 2 points3 points4 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]Kyriios188 9 points10 points11 points 7 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link