Abortion and Child Support

LifterofThings · 2013-09-20T11:46:20+00:00

I'd like to be able to deal with them (and there have been advances in male birth control which are on the right track), but there isn't really a pragmatic way to do it.

I'm fundamentally against forcing a woman to carry a child for 9 months and give birth against her will, full stop.

I don't like that women can have babies and demand that the fathers pay for them, against the man's will... but ending child support I expect would be detrimental to kids, in order to punish the woman having a baby against a man's will.

Male birth control. Support that shit.

angatar_ · 2013-09-20T05:20:55+00:00

I think pregnancy is just something that will always be unequal between the sexes. Because it is the women's body, I believe ultimately the decision should be up to her. I'm not sure how you can avoid the fact that it's her body, so the best way to address this is to improve contraception for men and women and promote their proper use.

If you cannot put yourself in that situation, you'll never be in that situation, right?

fhqwhgads_ · 2013-09-20T09:22:41+00:00

With respect, I think there's an option missing from your list: choose whether or not to have sexual intercourse.

SudoTheAdmin · 2013-09-20T15:12:35+00:00

As long as men who aren't the father are forced to pay child support it's a waste of time to make an argument that men who are the father shouldn't pay.

Azure_phantom · 2013-09-20T19:06:19+00:00

As an anecdote, I once dated a guy who bemoaned the fact that women can abort a pregnancy against the man's wishes. I asked him what a solution would be - he had no good answer. Why? Because the reality is, the woman carries the child. They have to face the health risks, disadvantages, etc of carrying a child to term. You can't force someone to undergo a medical procedure because you want it (thankfully). So there isn't a way to solve the first issue (abort against the man's wishes) - at least until there's an easy way to create children outside a womb. Then it'd be a simple matter of transferring cells from the uterus to another system and bam, guy gets the kid and mother gets to pay child support.

As for keeping the child against the man's will, that's the reality we're in. Let's assume, for a moment, that Republicans get their way and abortions are outlawed. The situation would be no different except for there would be more men responsible for paying child support since the women who would've gotten abortions are now forced to keep their children.

Since child support payments are for the health and stability of the child, I can't say that guys should get a get-out-of-jail-free card because they didn't want a kid. If you don't want a kid, then you need to not have sex or always use protection and you need to discuss what would happen if the woman got pregnant before any sex is had. But that rules out a lot of one night stands, which seems to be the model most redpillers are after.

I wouldn't be willing to support a financial abortion option as a medical abortion is not equivalent to a financial abortion. Getting a medical abortion prevents a child being born, true, but it also prevents a medical condition (pregnancy). If a woman doesn't want to undergo a medical condition, and there's a way to prevent it, then she can choose to do so. If she chooses against a medical abortion, then there's a kid on the way. And regardless of what a guy may feel about the woman he impregnated (there were two people present for the sex), he has a responsibility to take care of the child he helped to create. If men could get pregnant, then they could choose a medical abortion. But since they can't, they are, unfortunately, victim to whatever the woman chooses to do with the pregnancy. This isn't fair and can't be made fair since, biologically, it's an unfair system.

nwob · 2013-09-20T20:33:38+00:00

This is an exceptionally tricky question, but as /u/angatar_ says, the fact is that pregnancy will always place an unequal burden on the woman.

In case 1, we're essentially talking about weighing up the man's right to bring up his child compared to the woman's right to autonomy over her own body and protection from the various financial, medical and emotional strains that pregnancy (wanted or unwanted) places upon a person.

In case 2, we're talking about the woman's freedom from the medical and/or emotional trauma of abortion or adoption and her right to bring up her child versus the man's right to financial autonomy.

I think the fact is that there is no easy answer in any of these cases, and to pretend otherwise betrays a severe lack of compassion, empathy or understanding, on either side. It essentially comes down to an unquantifiable value judgement on the part of the individual.

[deleted] · 2013-09-21T03:39:34+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	Abortion and Child Support
Author	permajetlag
Upvotes	3
Comments	23
Date	September 20, 2013 4:58 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1mrdsm/abortion_and_child_support/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/abortion-and-child-support.286769 https://theredarchive.com/post/286769

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