Fathers are needed

RichardStinks · 2021-06-02T20:11:32+00:00

A bad dad is just as bad as no dad.

We need GOOD dads. Not just more. Good dads are not toxic.

-CubixRube- · 2021-06-02T21:55:43+00:00

Masculinity isn’t toxic. Toxic masculinity exists, but not all masculinity is toxic

Aizzec · 2021-06-02T20:41:29+00:00

I can confirm the "depressed, aggressive and criminal" bit.

It is hard growing up without a dad while the oldest child is depressed, the second oldest is a piece of shit, the third oldest is depressed, the fourth oldest is also a piece of shit, the fifth child is too young, and the last one never gets to know their dad properly and is left with a wreck of a family and poor role models.

JRM34 · 2021-06-03T00:05:40+00:00

The tweet completely misunderstands the concept of toxic masculinity. It doesn't mean ALL masculinity is toxic, it's referring to the aspects that are unhealthy (e.g. shit like "Men shouldn't cry or talk about their feelings"). This only seems deep if you have no idea what you're talking about

dgadirector · 2021-06-02T22:03:41+00:00

Her argument is valid and no one is disputing it. This is not pussy pass denied.

NightLightHighLight · 2021-06-02T19:40:38+00:00

That’s why I suggest that every child in America should have TWO fathers. If children with no fathers are worse off and children with one father are normal, just imagine what children with two or even THREE fathers will be like! /s

PiratiPad · 2021-06-02T19:10:35+00:00

Daddie issues are always welcome here lol

edo-hirai · 2021-06-02T21:23:49+00:00

I thought the argument of toxic masculinity was that the culture that men grew up with was toxic and unhealthy for men. ((I.e being forced into the role of sole provider without the expectation of help, being expected to shut up about hurt emotions because those feelings make them “weak” and doing things that are considered feminine(baking, fashion, art, makeup) make their worth as men and as a person less than men doing traditionally masculine hobbies(sports, working on cars, gaming))

ohx · 2021-06-02T22:53:42+00:00

/r/lostredditors

Late_Neighborhood242 · 2021-06-02T22:19:17+00:00

Did she equate toxic masculinity to fatherhood? Like everything, there's positive and negative side or version.

guacglock_ · 2021-06-02T22:53:22+00:00

masculinity in and of itself isn’t toxic. toxic masculinity exists

Sir_Mild_Peril · 2021-06-02T23:43:52+00:00

Feminists portrayal of masculinity as bad is sexist and counterproductive.

edebby · 2021-06-03T00:15:57+00:00

Its not the lack or presence of masculinity that screw up kids. This is such a shallow and narrow point of view that ignores so many aspects in this equation that it hurts my head

natephant · 2021-06-02T22:18:13+00:00

Not a pussy pass.

Not a denial of a pussy pass.

Not even a good logically sound tweet...

This sub has really gone to trash huh...

jpritchard · 2021-06-02T20:40:32+00:00

This would be a good argument if anyone was arguing that masculinity is toxic, and not that "toxic masculinity" is toxic.

breadbeard · 2021-06-02T19:55:05+00:00

edible mushrooms are fine to eat. toxic mushrooms are toxic.

masculinity is not by definition toxic..

toxic masculinity is toxic.

pretty basic shit

awkwrdgangsta · 2021-06-02T23:11:21+00:00

It's about kids of single parents (usually single moms) not receiving adequate attention/care. Kids need two parents.

This is not necessarily about masculinity.... although these males create single moms but what do I know?

Ice0Fuchsia · 2021-06-02T23:15:57+00:00

I’d disagree. Kids who don’t grow up without a father find father figures in media. They are drawn to the most masculine men and they’re very unrealistic. The gritty lone cowboy, the action hero, the protagonist drug dealer/gangster. These men don’t show how they deal with intense emotional moments by exploring their feelings or show their humanity (which would be out of place and boring for an action intense movie) so kids try to imitate the most manly figure they can.

Unrelated it’s arguable that men are better as disciplinarians. Single fathers’s kids are statistically less likely to be involved in criminal activity compared to single mothers’ kids. Single father’s kids criminal statistic are only slightly worse than kids with both parents.

Brolafsky · 2021-06-02T23:21:23+00:00

We need healthy masculinity, not toxic masculinity.

Kids who grow up with dads who beat and or berate them, still have high odds of developing mental disorders, no matter if the dad stuck around or not.

We need fathers who have a healthy relationship with their feelings, fathers who also encourage the good within their sons, encouraging healthy emotional growth.

Being told to "Stop being a pussy", "Grow a pair", "Men don't cry" are bullshit tropes.

Men are emotional creatures, just like women, but in a different way.

We, us, men, need to advocate for each other's emotional wellbeing, in the sense where having feelings and showing emotions aren't weaknesses, but signs of strength, signs of humanity.

2021-06-02T23:26:04+00:00

Masculinity isn’t toxic. Being a fucking alpha-asshole is toxic. There is a such thing as toxic-masculinity, which you will not find in a good father.

CosmicLovepats · 2021-06-02T23:54:12+00:00

If masculinity were truly toxic

fucking water can be toxic but you won't grow up without it. People from broken up families tend to have a rougher upbringing? shocker.

Toxic is a qualifier. Saying "masculinity that is toxic is bad for you" is like saying "Fetid water laden with contaminants is bad for you". It's kind of shocking that so many people take exception to "thing taken to harmful extremes is bad".

jesssy33 · 2021-06-02T23:54:24+00:00

A bad dad does untold damage to a young persons life and the consequences are life long.I would argue that a childs prospects are better when the father is absent than when the father is teaching toxic masculinity. Kids without dads sometimes find good role models in other men in their lives and learn good morals and attitudes.
We need more healthy masculinity in society.

Highgear1 · 2021-06-03T00:17:39+00:00

Reality is that the real factor is having one parent vs. two parents, whether or not one of the parents is male.. Single mothers are worse at childcare on average than a mother and a father because that's a lot of work for one person to do. A single mother can marry another woman and the difference between that and a heterosexual situation is effectively none.

g_driv · 2021-06-03T00:22:28+00:00

It is not the absence of toxic masculinity that is making them “depressed, aggressive & criminal”. It is extremely more likely that it’s due to coming from a single parent household thus meaning that they are going to have a lower family income. It is objectively true that a household that has one income would have less resources than that same household having two incomes.

Studies show that those that are in the lower classes are more likely to be criminals or deal with mental health issues due to not having resources to obtain proper treatment.

catkrieger13 · 2021-06-03T11:26:45+00:00

I'd be a good dad! I think....

StrangledMind · 2021-06-02T20:32:41+00:00

What a dumb tweet. No sane person is saying that masculinity is toxic. Toxic masculinity is toxic, just like toxic feminism is toxic.

nokianich · 2021-06-02T21:44:51+00:00

I agree that we need more masculinity

mzweffie · 2021-06-02T22:02:30+00:00

Yes! Kids need fathers that treat their mothers right

StuntHacks · 2021-06-02T23:02:42+00:00

You guys clearly have no idea what people mean by "toxic masculinity". Masculinity in itself isn't toxic. Various aspect of the culture surrounding it are, though.

imweird13 · 2021-06-02T23:14:30+00:00

my dad left me years ago, and this tweet is so true

LanderG34 · 2021-06-02T19:15:13+00:00

👍

BackAlleyKittens · 2021-06-02T20:10:33+00:00

No one has ever said (in good faith) that masculinity, itself, is toxic. Anything becomes toxic if it goes to far.

AmbivalentAsshole · 2021-06-02T20:45:18+00:00

This is disingenuous at best.

I think there's more to say about loving homes and families than there is about masculinity/femininity. You could be a great "manly" role model but if you never hug your kids or tell them you're proud - it's gonna fuck em up a little bit.

Eaglemcfly · 2021-06-02T22:52:16+00:00

Sadly all wokes hear with this is "add a second mother"

hardboiledbeb · 2021-06-02T20:42:03+00:00

Bruh what the fuck does this even mean, what a pointless thing to say. Its not masculinity that's lacking in a fatherlessness child's life, it's a FATHER. and toxic masculinity is a separate thing from masculinity in general. This is stupid

MinorityFellow · 2021-06-02T21:20:35+00:00

The claim isn't that masculinity is toxic as a whole. The claim is that certain behaviors taken as expressions of masculinity in society can be toxic. And this is coming from someone who is generally annoyed by that phrase.

25mookie92 · 2021-06-02T20:43:37+00:00

I see what she was going for but I (who was raised by a family full of females) turned out okay. When I met my father he thought I was going to be a "twink" because he wasn't around. He thought wrong, mom did good, and I'm happy with my kids

lesmobile · 2021-06-02T22:04:19+00:00

A lot of the famous serial killers you know had dads, just really shitty dads.

Alejandro4222017 · 2021-06-02T23:07:55+00:00

My dad pushes masculinity too much on me and that makes me depressed, aggressive, and criminal so therefore her point is invalid

Turd-Sandwich · 2021-06-02T23:27:12+00:00

No one reasonable is saying that..

There's a reason the modifier 'toxic' is added. Masculinity is good, toxic masculinity is not good.

SirDerpingtonV · 2021-06-02T23:57:29+00:00

Jesus Christ you giga Karen, no one is saying masculinity is toxic. There are aspects of societal pressure that result in toxic masculinity and femininity.

Neither on their own can be considered toxic.

For example, bottling up your mental health issues is toxic masculinity. Putting things aside temporarily in order to get something done is not.

General_GTFO · 2021-06-02T23:26:27+00:00

You dumbass, toxic masculinity means that specific type of masculinity is toxic, not that all masculinity is toxic.

nhiox · 2021-06-02T22:50:21+00:00

how exactly is this relevant to the sub though?

CaringRationalist · 2021-06-02T22:58:10+00:00

Toxic masculinity =/= All masculinity is toxic.

People need to learn this. What is being referred to as toxic masculinity are traditionally masculine traits that are negative, or which society has outgrown. These include things suppressing your feelings, or being overly aggressive to seem tough, placing undue stress on yourself because you're conditioned to to equate your self worth with status. These things are toxic not just to women and the people you're around, but to men as well. I'd argue men are the primary victims of toxic masculinity.

What toxic masculinity is not is all masculine traits. You can be assertive without being aggressive, like when standing up for the right thing, or against someone being toxic. Being confident in yourself, your needs, and your feelings is a positive expression of male confidence, whereas needing to be better than others would be a toxic expression of the same quality.

Yes, good dad's are good. Good Dad's are (sometimes) masculine. Nobody is or should be trying to cancel fatherhood. Part of positive fatherhood is understanding how to teach your children to express their traits in a positive way.

Ace_Masters · 2021-06-02T23:42:26+00:00

I live out in BFE and about half the people I know would have been better off with no dad than the ignorant redneck dad they ended up with.

LavaSquid · 2021-06-02T23:50:21+00:00

Not all masculinity is toxic, but when it is, it's fucking horrible and a good mother can raise quality children on her own.

The_Real_Raw_Gary · 2021-06-03T00:01:15+00:00

Not all dads are bad not all are good.

The quality of a father is the important factor here. It’s not as simple as is the father present or not.

PM_ME_UR_RECIPES_MMM · 2021-06-03T00:14:19+00:00

My dad was toxic as hell and now I’m depressed

InterstellarReddit · 2021-06-03T00:20:49+00:00

Post this to female dating strategy and watch their minds explode

arjeidi · 2021-06-03T00:24:43+00:00

u/Lost_Walker835: you think a bad abusive father is better than no father?

JMurphy15811 · 2021-06-03T00:28:10+00:00

Nobody is saying that masculinity is toxic it's just when you take it too far it becomes toxic

Doc_Daily_Dose_420 · 2021-06-03T00:29:45+00:00

Guys.. not all masculinity is toxic masculinity. The toxic part is shit like "men shouldn't cry" or "X makes you gay". It's literally societal norms for men that are meant to keep our heads down.

P_Foot · 2021-06-03T00:33:35+00:00

Masculinity on its own is not toxic

But that doesn’t mean toxic masculinity doesn’t exist

Recognize the difference.

Frannyjo23 · 2021-06-03T01:06:31+00:00

Yo kids! Get you dads! Time to get more criminal up in here! Let’s do it for Satan! The best father the world has ever known!

Big_Balla69 · 2021-06-03T01:37:02+00:00

Why can’t this tweet also recognize that not all fathers are equal. We need not more masculinity. We just need positive masculinity.

hansSA · 2021-06-04T01:52:47+00:00

This meme is asinine and pathetically reductionist.

wanaseemedoitagain69 · 2021-06-02T19:55:30+00:00

She probably dates men who are just like her father

taa_dow · 2021-06-02T21:23:20+00:00

Yeah but then who are the gays going to prey upon for fresh meat? The movement would dry up wheres all that marketing money gonna go then?

GHettoKaiba · 2021-06-02T21:50:05+00:00

That makes no sense at all

Sasutokura · 2021-06-02T21:51:32+00:00

Something I’d like to see is if children of lesbian parents are affected by not having a dad or not. Or if children of gay parents are affected by not having a mother.

beachbbqlover · 2021-06-02T22:00:45+00:00

Then stop making it such a pain in the ass and so dangerous to be a dad?!?

Freidhiem · 2021-06-02T23:11:07+00:00

Turns out this probably has more to do with living in a single low income household than a lack of dad.

Title	Fathers are needed
Author	Lost_Walker835
Upvotes	3793
Comments	241
Date	June 2, 2021 7:07 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PussyPassDenied
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/pussypassdenied/comments/nqtl8c/fathers_are_needed/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PussyPassDenied/fathers-are-needed.827022 https://theredarchive.com/post/827022

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