Circumcision may once have had hygienic benefits, causing it to become ingrained in a number of religions and cultures. Whatever those benefits might have been, modern sanitation makes them nil.
The procedure, however, remains ensconced in many cultures, with an annual incidence of approximately 20 million. MR has its hand fulls with myriad issues, without also taking on much of the world's culture and religion; Islam alone has 1.3 billion adherents.
More readily achievable, especially in the West, would be a required medical registry of botched circumcisions. Efforts to achieve a circumcision ban have failed everywhere for decades; however, as a public health measure, a registry of botches would be far easier to achieve. The registry could then be used to convince parents to reject circumcision - "Is it worth the risk of neutering your son for ambiguous or nonexistent medical benefits? Look at this registry of botches!"
It is puzzling, however, that intactivists continue the losing strategy of trying to defeat religion to obtain outright bans.
It is also puzzling that activism obsesses over the Jewish component, which seems to represent about 1% of the total incidence. Hating the Jews will have no effect upon the 99% of remaining incidence; Africans, Muslim, and North American Christians really won't care much what Judaism does or does not do.
Worse, the anti-Semitic obsession is self-defeating for intactivists; the San Francisco anti-circ resolution was making slow headway until "Foreskin Man" and other blatant anti-Semitism spurred mainstream politicians to back away from the resolution.
Unfortunately, much of what intactivists post here wastes effort hating on the Jews rather than planning better strategies using or encouraging medical arguments and research. The strategy of religious hatred is self-defeating for intactivists and also taints MR with bigotry.
Intactivists might have an argument to hate on Islam, the source of roughly 45% of the worldwide incidence of circumcision; even then, it would be quite unwise. Both here and elsewhere, many Muslims interested in MR simply walk away once they encounter intactivists' hate.
I note hate speech is criminal in many jurisdictions, including much of Europe:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hate_speech#Hate_speech_laws_by_country
There are enough solid medical arguments against circumcision - most strongly, the unnecessary risk of horrendous error - without taking on religion(s) and without degenerating to anti-Semitic bigotry.
[–]imnotanmra1 17 points18 points19 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[+]Mens-Advocate[S] -9 points-8 points-7 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]imnotanmra1 12 points13 points14 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Wisemanner 10 points11 points12 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]MGMStopTheChop 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]mgm-survivor 14 points15 points16 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+]GunOfSod1 points [recovered] (17 children) | Copy Link
I guess the argument with Jewish religious practises could also be addressed by them choosing not to mutilate their sons penises.
[–]Mens-Advocate[S] -3 points-2 points-1 points (16 children) | Copy Link
[–]mgm-survivor 6 points7 points8 points (14 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
He's trying to help you out but you're too much of a moron for it to sink in.
[–]mgm-survivor 0 points1 point2 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link
Thos might be too much of an emotionally charged issue for you or you're some sort of MRM troll.
Try to look at it from my perspective. Or from the perspective of someone with a background in law. Or from someone in the media. You don't come across well in this.
[–]mgm-survivor 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]MGMStopTheChop -1 points0 points1 point (7 children) | Copy Link
[+]mgm-survivor1 points [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link
Mentalism is discrimination. If you think that would do anything, you are wrong.
[–]MGMStopTheChop 0 points1 point2 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]mgm-survivor 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]MGMStopTheChop 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+]mgm-survivor1 points [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link
I can tell you all about the owner of Intaction’s Keratin treatment though. I assure you I’m real.
[–]MGMStopTheChop 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]mgm-survivor 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]GunOfSod7 points [recovered] | Copy Link
[–]HotDealsInTexas 9 points10 points11 points (0 children) | Copy Link
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[+]RobertCatherine1 points [recovered] (8 children) | Copy Link
Gay people are anti-Semites because they object to being murdered. The whole "murder is bad" thing is just a front for their abject hatred of the Jews.
This post is so special.
[–]Mens-Advocate[S] 1 point2 points3 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[+]RobertCatherine1 points [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link
The religious prescription to murder teh gays is right there in the Pentateuch.
Clearly Israel must be anti-Semitic.
So So special.
[–]Mens-Advocate[S] -1 points0 points1 point (5 children) | Copy Link
[+]RobertCatherine1 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
Yes, exactly. This whole "making it illegal to mutilat children's genitals is anti-Semitic" argument is equally as ridiculous as "Israel making it illegal to murder homosexuals in anti-Semitic."
False premise. "All children should be protected from genital mutilation." contains no mention of religion, much less some ornate heirarchy focusing on some and excepting others
The obsession with religion (and gender, for that matter) seems to be a characteristic of people who want to mutilate children's genitals.
I've seen people mention children dying of neonatal HSV infection, which is a bizarre enough medical complication to demand the explanation that during ritualistic genital mutilation adult-child oral-genital contact is commonplace. Whether an adult sucking on a child's genitals is perverted, while probably an unsurprisingly common perception, is immaterial.
These are apparently so commonplace that I have never seen them and have no idea what you're even trying to reference.
Hey, /u/mensmod, you wanna weigh in on whether this user's calls in favor of attacking people based on their religion or race is Kosher? I realize they're wrapping their bigotry in counter-advocacy, so I suppose there's enough flimsy plausible deniability to avert an outright ban, but a warning to tone down their rhetoric is probably appropriate, yes?
[–]mensmod 1 point2 points3 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[+]RobertCatherine1 points [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link
I don't what other shitty things they've been doing, but I'm not sure I'd agree with a ban if it was just more of the above. OTOH, they've now switched to PMs to continue to rave about hating the Jews, so... Yeah, dude probably would've ended up banned after a warning anyway.
[–]mensmod 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]mgm-survivor 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points (23 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (22 children) | Copy Link
You're delusional if you think you will ever change religious people.
[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points (21 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (20 children) | Copy Link
Any practicing Jew or Muslim will not oppose it. We are not going to be open to listening to malcontents. Their views will be disregarded with prejudice.
You do not get to impose your secularism on us. That will not happen. You have to reconcile yourself to that now.
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (8 children) | Copy Link
Religion only matters when you act on it. Its not just a superficial belief. We were given a command to circumcise so we do.
[–]mgm-survivor 1 point2 points3 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link
Is English not your first language?
[–]mgm-survivor 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]mgm-survivor 1 point2 points3 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
Bro, you don't sound ok.
[–]mgm-survivor1 point [recovered] | Copy Link
[–]Doobie_23255550 points [recovered] | Copy Link
[–]mgm-survivor1 point [recovered] | Copy Link
[–]KDulius 1 point2 points3 points (8 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (7 children) | Copy Link
This is pinging my bullshit-meter.
No Rabbi would speak out against an actual commandment.
[–]KDulius 2 points3 points4 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link
Since you are not Jewish you don't know what the acceptable bounds of disagreement are. Just as I am not qualified in having an opinion on a Catholic topic you lack the background for one on this topic.
That website you posted is not from a legitimate Jewish source. No actual Rabbi finds this topic to be up for debate.
[–]KDulius 1 point2 points3 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[+]Doobie_23255551 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
Only a mixture of wool and linen is prohibited. You're out of your league here, you don't know what you're talking about.
And its questionable to me if this is identity politics. Nobody would support a politician that wants to attack their religion.
[–]KDulius2 points [recovered] | Copy Link
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[–]mgm-survivor1 point [recovered] | Copy Link
[–]Artemis663 0 points1 point2 points (6 children) | Copy Link
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[–]Artemis663 -2 points-1 points0 points (2 children) | Copy Link
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[–]Artemis663 -3 points-2 points-1 points (0 children) | Copy Link