The Penis Mom

2011-12-27T02:03:01+00:00

As a strong mens' rights supporter, and as someone who would not have had a dad to help me out with such a project, I'm proud of this woman. Had I read the email as a student, I would have been offended and saddened, reminded of the geographical distance between myself and my father. I would also have been offended at the insinuation that my mother, or perhaps my sister who had helped me with similar projects for years, was unworthy of assisting me in building a trebuchet. If we want dads involved in kids' education, excluding other family members is not the way to do it. Sorry, /MR, not every man had/has the privilege of having a male parent for his entire childhood, and the assumption that "every kid has a dad" does more to damage mens' rights ("Why are you so sensitive? Didn't your father raise you right?") than it helps.

aetheralloy · 2011-12-26T17:57:54+00:00

How it works:

When you want strength not to matter - Women can do everything men can! Gender is a social construct! It is sexist to assume men can do a better job lifting heavy things!
When you want strength to matter - Men abuse their superior strength! They are hard-wired to rape! Women need special protection because men are physically stronger!

khudgins · 2011-12-26T21:15:41+00:00

Personally, I thought it was a well written and thoughtful article: woman wants equal rights/respect/thoughts involved with a traditionally male role, and is warning other women that if they want to be included in those traditionally male things, they have to be willing to take the bad with the good.

If we had more dialogue like this across the gender fight, we might actually make some progress.

ChaosLFG · 2011-12-27T22:00:48+00:00

I don't understand the outrage.

Asking for counsel from a man means she was unsure about her point and wanted to make a stir.

Sure, she sought counsel to make sure she wasn't over the top. Is that wrong? Are we never supposed to ask for help, or to ask others to check ourselves when we realize that we're dealing with an issue with which we have a personal stake?

When you want strength not to matter - Women can do everything men can! Gender is a social construct! It is sexist to assume men can do a better job lifting heavy things!

When you want strength to matter - Men abuse their superior strength! They are hard-wired to rape! Women need special protection because men are physically stronger!

She never mentioned any of those points. She didn't even mention rape at all, or special protections, or abuse of power.

In fact, she made the case that it was important for women to accept responsibility if they want to be included.

You can't just assume her point is misandrous because she's against misogyny. That's exactly the problem with feminism and men's rights--we're too stuck arguing with each other to get anywhere.

"It's okay to ask for dads, as long as you don't uninclude moms."

If you don't get invited to a party, do you go?

hamEggCheese · 2011-12-26T18:48:27+00:00

This was posted in /r/XX and in the comments there were some reasonable thoughts on why it was a "fathers only" need.

Maybe it was the school's attempt to get more fathers involved in their child's activities. When I was in grade school, there were always many more moms than dads helping out, and I think the dads probably expected that there wouldn't ever be that many other men around. My elementary homerooms all had "room moms" (moms that would help out with holiday parties and other extra curricular things) that changed each semester, and there never were any "room dads". It seems reasonable to have a call on fathers specifically so that they can all socialize and not feel a little out of place. They might even feel more needed for something physical, like in this case, and make a greater effort to actually show up.

But the fact stands that whoever organized this could have been more tactful. There could have been a way to encourage fathers to come while not alienating the mothers.

neurorex · 2011-12-26T22:13:04+00:00

This is not an issue. If they were blatantly turning down moms to participate, it would be a different matter. No where did it indicate that anyone with a vagina was not allowed to participate.

This is just splitting hair, and the presentation is a little suspicious. If she was so headstrong in her belief, then there was no need to involve her editor husband or her 13 year old son to seek approval. But, because neither of them minded, it sounded like she started to preach.

If we want dads to be more involved in their children's education, they still can't be called out directly because it would start a gender war? Do we even know what we want at this point?

Luriker · 2011-12-26T18:58:40+00:00

"Well we're sending a horrible message to girls if only dads show up!"

"I was a single mom for awhile and I hate if anyone expects that there's a man in every home to contribute!"

"Someone didn't include women, which is an abomination, but my sending the word penis to children? Not a big deal"

"The principal wasn't one for heavy lifting? She's destroying our entire gender!"

This is one of the many reasons why I can't take feminism seriously

Il128 · 2011-12-27T11:30:18+00:00

Being a father of four... I know this woman or I should say, I know and have known many women like her.
She's not edgy and she's not a feminist (unless it suits her at the moment.). What this woman is, is an asshole. If she were a man someone would just tell her to shut up and to stop coming around if she is going to keep turning everything in to "I'm here and this is what's wrong" events. But she isn't a man so, she is coddled and tolerated and a few of the other woman look up to this "bitter" person because they wish they too were assholes because they are secretly bitter too.

This woman isn't worried about anyone but herself and the amount of attention she can draw.

Cat-Hax · 2011-12-26T18:00:39+00:00

You know, mom with a penis you could help make dinner and put the kids to bed too.

Whisper · 2011-12-27T01:46:57+00:00

This strikes me as a case of demanding credit for having the potential to do something, instead of demanding the opportunity to do something.

I spend a lot of time lifting heavy barbells, and I spend a lot of time talking (on r/fitness and elsewhere) with women who do the same. Not mention the time I spend encouraging women who don't to, well, give it a try.

And in my experience, there are women who can lift heavy things. And there are women who complain about not getting credit for being strong. But there are no women who are in both those groups.

Female lifters don't have a problem with people sometimes assuming they're weak because they are a woman. Because they know that most women are weak, and they know that they, in particular, are not. They don't need to persuade anyone they are strong, because they can just lift a heavy thing instead, and that will remove all doubt. And they don't need to persuade anyone that all women are strong, because that just isn't true. Which doesn't bother them, because they're the exception, they worked hard to be the exception, and they earned that condition of being the exception.

Women who complain about women not getting credit for the accomplishments of women, are all-too-often complaining about them not getting credit for the accomplishments of other women. Because, you know, they, theoretically could have put in all that work, too.

It always feels to me a bit like they are trying to cheat the women who actually can do it, who actually did put that work in, of their exclusive rights to the credit.

osufan765 · 2011-12-26T20:33:51+00:00

They wanted the men not because of heavy lifting, but because of the basic understanding of physics and mechanics that are needed in order to build something like a catapult.

sfacets · 2011-12-27T00:06:42+00:00

and sometimes people reach this interesting conclusion that I am a little too edgy

Ya think?

Title	The Penis Mom
Author	trot-trot
Upvotes	21
Comments	40
Date	December 26, 2011 5:31 PM UTC (14 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/nra5e/the_penis_mom/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/the-penis-mom.1030060 https://theredarchive.com/post/1030060

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