How do you reconcile liberal politics with Men's Rights?

mikesteane · 2011-08-02T21:15:29+00:00

One should be careful using the word in an international forum. In Britain, it is associated with the centre party, in the US with the Left and in Australia with the Right.

Kill_The_Rich · 2011-08-03T02:08:12+00:00

I have no need to "reconcile" being a liberal with being an MRA. The left isn't "owned" by radical feminists, just like the right isn't "owned" by religious zealots. A lot of people on the left may identify as "feminists"...but I believe that has more to do with them operating under the flawed assumption that "feminism = equality".

In terms of Democrats/Republicans, both are assholes, and neither are "left"; they're both just right-wing authoritarians...the only difference is degree.

http://politicalcompass.org/charts/statesbysenator.php?sl=al,ak,az,ar,ca,co,ct,de,fl,ga,hi,id,il,in,ia,ks,ky,la,me,md,ma,mi,mn,ms,mo,mt,ne,nv,nh,nj,nm,ny,nc,nd,oh,ok,or,pa,ri,sc,sd,tn,tx,ut,vt,va,wa,wv,wi,wy

2011-08-02T20:42:17+00:00

I am gonna cover the US, because that is what I know best.

This new father's rights emersion in the GOP is still to be judged. Lets not forget they played the father's rights card to make abortion ridiculously difficult http://riseofthezetamale.blogspot.com/2011/07/republicans-put-up-new-barrier-to.html

And then there is every non-gender issue, and the fact that many of us look at the big picture and don't side with them for many other things. Many of us want reforms to include benefits to men, not to simply destroy any and all social actions of the government.

By default being a liberal also does not make me a fan of every liberal politician.

Being involved in these groups and fighting within them is more effective than just trying to squash them. I can get more done from the inside working on our own programs than from the outside simply screaming down with feminism and the left.

The political left is also not "owned" by feminism. Feminism is a part of the left but it is not the dominant force.

Greekfire · 2011-08-03T07:27:20+00:00

I'm a pretty liberal guy, so let me explain my stance as both a progressive and a proponent of mens rights.

I don't want this to become a political debate.

I don't identify with conservative ideas very much. I believe society would be much better with universal health care, safety nets for citizens and actual regulation of many industries.

I believe in equality, and I don't support any laws or agencies that support unequal treatment. Basically, I'd rather have a NWHIC AND a NMHIC than have neither.

disposable_human · 2011-08-03T05:42:55+00:00

the political left is owned by radical feminists

I reconcile my liberal politics with this the same way a conservative would reconcile his with the christian orthodox wing of his party. If I had a party to vote for that had my views AND didn't have that stuff, I'd be thrilled.

2011-08-03T06:11:02+00:00

Liberal politics aren't expressly incompatible with men's rights. Just because liberal leaders tend towards feminism doesn't mean anything about individual beliefs.

NickRausch · 2011-08-03T15:23:32+00:00

I don't reconcile the two. I dislike state based social engineering as a matter of principle.

2011-08-02T22:49:35+00:00

"liberals are hostile to men's rights everywhere"? Don't listen to rush limbaugh or whatever ideologue is telling you that.

Worker's rights is a strong liberal area, even when gender isn't highlighted, the working roles often have a very male nature. Conservatives often give little besides lip service and a springsteen song while they sell out for Wal-mart and screw the male majority of laid-off workers. You're free to debate the efficacy of liberal intentions, in practice- but as a tax paying business owner I find conservative rhetoric about creating jobs and trickle-down to be dubious.

Conservative religious and traditional chivalrous attitudes can be quite anti male too. The public sector, business regulation, and social safety net all have strong value in democratic society. Those involve liberal politics and can't be ignored if "equality" is what you're after.

Father's rights, family court reform, and gender oppression on poor men are things that should rightfully be "progressive" issues but often get blocked because of PC bullshit. If conservatives are good on those, great. If they give liberals a kick in the ass to catch up, I'm down with them.

No party is right. There's just issues. Some individuals are good on them and some aren't.

sTiKyt · 2011-08-03T02:33:00+00:00

Because most conservatives believe in a traditionalist view that seeks to return things to the way they were. I have no interest in supporting this view. I tend to agree with feminists that men and women should be free without social constraints to seek their own gender role, this I believe strengthens the rights of men greater than any pre-feminist traditional society. I'd rather not like to see men's rights being used as a mouth piece of social conservatives to get women back into domestic roles and force men into paternalistic ones.

I believe there's a misguided view that if you enforce the most concentrated liberal viewpoints then you continue to hold a true progressive voice. When it comes to equality, supporting black power supremacists and Scandinavian extreme feminists to the point of inequality, means you aren't for equality. And if progressivism view is one of equality, I don't think you're holding legitimate progressive views. In the same way that American libertarian/conservatism has been hijacked by the religious, social conservatives and racists. I believe that liberalism has been hijacked by extreme feminists to the point of not staying true to its original purpose.

ThePigman · 2011-08-04T06:04:05+00:00

The Dems have a bad record on men's issues, but you also have to take into account the Right's hoarding of wealth, warmongering, attacks on porn, prostitution and sex outside of marriage, and white knighting.

2011-08-02T20:52:03+00:00

I find nearly all politicians to be sorely out of touch with the people. In Canada, the House of Commons is supposed to be populated by 'commoners', (ie, not lawyers, judges, and career politicians like it is now - that was reserved for the Senate). This is simply not how it is.

In every single instance, each political party has opportunistically eroded the rights and freedoms of it's populace away, and voted themselves more power and money.

No political party is immune from this accusation. And simply because these political parties take certain aspects of political thought for it's own, that does not mean those parties actually REFLECT those beliefs.

For example, the Left 'believes' in equality, yet ignores half the populace. The Right believes in 'Family Values' but ignores No Fault Divorce.

They are Gynocentric, because that is what wins elections. They simply choose different methods to achieve the same results.

This does not preclude individuals from placing more emphasis, say, on social justice than fiscal responsibility, and still advocate for men. In fact, in that case it would seem MORE likely a 'lefty' cause than a 'righty' cause.

The motivations for fighting for the rights of men are as varied as there are MRAs. The fact that so many different ideologies find common ground on these issues is a testament to their veracity and their importance....

And that is what I would take away from this discussion, frankly.

Title	How do you reconcile liberal politics with Men's Rights?
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	1
Comments	19
Date	August 2, 2011 8:35 PM UTC (14 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/j71es/how_do_you_reconcile_liberal_politics_with_mens/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/how-do-you-reconcile-liberal-politics-with-mens.1036363 https://theredarchive.com/post/1036363

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