MRAs: Stop Screwing Up the Argento Story

EricAllonde · 2018-08-22T07:19:33+00:00

Always nice to have a member of the feminist hate cult drop by and school us all in how to have empathy for men.

Even better if you're doing it while wearing your "[Kill off 90% of all men], the future is female" t-shirt and drinking from your "Male tears" mug, for added irony.

EricAllonde · 2018-08-22T08:39:09+00:00

there's reasonable enough evidence that the claims are correct and she should pay the same price as others have.

I think everyone here is agreed on that point.

However, she won't pay the same price. She'll get a pussypass. Feminists are already doing the mental gymnastics necessary to argue that punishment isn't warranted in her case.

you think she should just go down for being part of the #metoo movement.

Given Argento's history of misandry and leadership in a push to deny due process to accused men, anyone could be forgiven some schadenfreude at seeing her get a taste of her own medicine.

And it's also an encouraging sign of progress because, as we all know too well, "No problem is ever solved until it affects women too".

Argento and Ronnell being publicly shafted is giving some of the worst, most misandrist feminists pause for thought. For the first time they're realising they too could become the target of this outrage machine they've built, and for the first time they're questioning if doing away with due process was really a wise move.

'#MeToo could have destroyed a million innocent men's lives and the feminists wouldn't have had a single second thought about it. But now that some prominent feminists are going down, the feminists are getting worried and #MeToo may get an overhaul as a result.

This is all good news and there's nothing wrong with MRAs celebrating that.

HotJohnnyTabasco · 2018-08-22T14:46:37+00:00

they don't really care about men so much as feel attacked by and hate feminism.

What if we care about men who are attacked by feminism?

Argento may have sexually assaulted a 17 year old boy, or he might have made the whole thing up. I don't speak for everyone here, but I know that to be the truth. She might be guilty; she might be a victim of a false accusation - we don't know.

But that's the beautiful thing about this story, that it points out the hypocrisy of feminism. Because the exact same thing can be said about Harvey Weinstein, Matt Lauer, Chris Harwick and the thousands of other guys (famous and not) that have been accused in the #MeToo movement: They might be guilty; they might be the victim of a false accusation - we don't know.

But the hypocrisy of feminism is that when a man is accused, feminists assume guilt (listen & believe, after all). It is only when a woman - especially an outspoken feminist woman - is accused, that feminists suddenly realize that the MRA response of "They might be guilty; they might be the victim of a false accusation - we don't know" is actually the correct, rational and reasonable response.

We don't relish this story because it knocks Asia Argento down a notch. We relish this story because it points out (yet again) the hypocrisy of feminism.

It's not that we don't care about Asia Argento's alleged victim. It's that we recognize, just like we've always recognized, that when an accusation is made - whether again Asia Argento or Les Moonves - we have no idea whether or not there is an actual victim for whom sympathy is needed, or if the person being accused is the actual victim.

Asia Argento is one of the few people accused of sexual impropriety that feminists have actually stepped back and said "whoa, hold on a second here, let's make sure she's not a victim of a false accusation before we go jumping to conclusions".

foot_kisser · 2018-08-22T08:20:36+00:00

If all you do is shit on feminism,

Think about what you're doing right now. All you're doing with this troll post is shitting on MRAs.

"Awesome, this #metoo advocate deserves to go down!" Yes, but then that requires us to believe her accuser in spite of this not having been proved beyond all possible doubt and also that people should go down for this sort of behavior

No, actually. She deserves to go down for advocating for judgment without evidence. That's what the metoo campaign is about, making it possible to take someone down without evidence or a court proceeding.

She created a monster. Now the monster is biting her. Only she isn't saying "Oh, God, I've created a monster, won't somebody please help me stop this monster!"

If you create a monster, and it bites you, and you still support the monster, that's on you.

This is confirmation bias in it's purest form: if a feminist/(group you hate) says something bad, all feminists think/say that.

No, I know that not all feminists say everything that some feminists say. Christina Hoff Sommers and Julie Bindel are very, very different people.

I think feminists are hypocritical (in general, not without exception) because I've caught them being hypocritical about a lot of things. I think they're hypocritical about the metoo movement, because I didn't hear about any of them talking about evidence and not judging too quickly when the victims of the movement were men, but now there's a woman who's being victimized and suddenly they care. Am I wrong? Have there been any feminists criticizing metoo when it victimized men, and I just didn't hear about it?

Extremely few of the men accused have faced any legal charges.

Right. That's the problem. People are being judged unfairly by a twitter hashtag. Courts have safeguards built in to avoid injustice. Twitter doesn't.

Many lost career opportunities, but many didn't at all. Many haven't faced much consequence at all, save perhaps for an unquantifiable hit to reputation,

An unquantifiable hit to reputation is serious damage, especially for folks who make a living off of their reputation.

Assuming one is automatically a victim because of their gender is our thing. Get your own.

We aren't trying to copy your sexism. Promise.

Otherwise you're validating #metoo by accepting its premises and/or paying feminists, with all our hypocrisy and hateful overgeneralizations, the highest complement: imitation.

We aren't assuming she's guilty because she's female. From what I've heard it seems likely, but what I think is likely doesn't matter. What matters is that she helped create this form of injustice.

89peters · 2018-08-22T07:42:41+00:00

Begone bigot. You belong to a hate movement.

nforne · 2018-08-22T22:39:34+00:00

What strikes me is how Rose McGowan didn't see the hypocrisy in her tweets. To me it's just another symptom of unconscious gynocentrism.

We see it all the time, male deaths are accepted with a shrug, without even the need to mention that we were male. Female deaths are newsworthy and elicit shock and sympathy.

I don't blame feminism for this, as it happens. But I do think it's fair to say that gynocentrism is far more prevalent among feminists than the general population. They are conditioned to look at every issue from the female perspective. And because Metoo was mostly about women, they viewed it as a men vs women issue, rather than a power issue.

I'm glad that Rose McGowan made this tweet, as it has made the news and will hopefully make people aware of their biases.

mikesteane · 2018-08-22T08:10:30+00:00

Occasionally, someone let's slip that the purpose of metoo is not what it is stated to be (protecting ~~women~~ people from harassment) and that its real purpose is altogether more political. This is something most of us here sense automatically. We do not need to be told that the metoo campaign is not about justice it is about exercising power i.e. it is a feminist weapon.

For example in this article we read the accidental giveaway: Most of the dozen women who spoke with The Canadian Press were hesitant to discuss the unintended consequences of Me Too because they didn't want to detract from the progress they hope the movement will make towards improving opportunities for women.

With respect to your final paragraph, you should probably take your own advice. Thus you should delete your reply in this exchange:

5th_Law_of_Robotics • 5 points • submitted 5 hours ago

Well for starters her career needs to end. Immediately and permanently. msleeduon • 1 point • submitted 2 hours ago

Plenty of people with more accusers and more evidence against them have kept their careers. I didn't crunch the numbers, but I'd say probably a majority of them, although some lost jobs/parts.

tenchineuro · 2018-08-22T10:21:57+00:00

But MRAs are saying a lot of stupid things about this, and most of it is grounded in the cardinal flaw most online MRAs have: they don't really care about men so much as feel attacked by and hate feminism. If all you do is shit on feminism, you're not being pro-man. Here's how:

Ah yes, the now weekly you're doing it wrong PSA.

Or is it becoming a daily?

aussietoads · 2018-08-22T10:08:17+00:00

Feminism, for those times when being a hypocrite is simply not being hypocritical enough.

tenchineuro · 2018-08-22T10:24:16+00:00

No, it shows how hypocritical Argento, McGowan and some others are. The founder of #metoo came out immediately in support of the victim in this story.

No, she did not, she gave some general blather, never mentioned his name, and said maybe it's time to look beyond punishment, the complete opposite of what #metoo has always been about, aka 'believe the accuser blindly' and 'punish the accused as harshly as possible'.

DavidByron2 · 2018-08-22T20:10:17+00:00

So you're a man hating feminist (forgive the redundancy) and you're criticizing other people for not caring about men?

If a feminist says something right, it's ignored

How would you ever test this since feminists never say anything right?

thrway_1000 · 2018-08-22T07:23:54+00:00

Archive -- https://archive.is/rZTqa

DavidByron2 · 2018-08-22T10:53:44+00:00

Obvious troll is obvious. But not obvious enough for the mods, apparently!

2018-08-23T00:32:13+00:00

[permanently deleted]

antilopes · 2018-08-23T01:03:49+00:00

I may be an evil, nasty, hateful feminist,

And what brings you here?

but there's an obvious right answer on the Argento issue: there's reasonable enough evidence that the claims are correct and she should pay the same price as others have.

So what's your problem then? This is equality. Like what your movement has been banging on about for a long time.

Her gender isn't the issue, her behavior is.

Funny how you forget this when talking about male abusers.

Awesome, this #metoo advocate deserves to go down!

As it should. Vigilante justice does incredible damage based on the countless men who have been put on the list because they did something like touch a woman's arm or make an inappropriate comment.

By the way, before you go crying about "Female victims having no voice", the fact of the matter is that society has bent over backwards to give them support and places to go. They'll still be there whether or not Metoo does eventually die out.

You can't say the same for male victims. Oh and another reminder: Male victims of female abusers were never welcomed by your movement when they used the hashtag. Another reason why it will soon fail.

Yes, but then that requires us to believe her accuser in spite of this not having been proved beyond all possible doubt and also that people should go down for this sort of behavior.

And just what do you think YOU'VE been doing with men who have been accused? Please stop with the cognitive dissonance. It's so bothersome.

This is the world you helped create and suddenly you have a problem with it. Critics warned you but did you listen? No. So lie in the bed you messed up.

This shows how hypocritical feminists/#metoo is!

Yeah, you are hypocrites. Every single one of you fuckers chased away male victims from the hashtag and now, you come waltzing in here asking us to not believe a victim because he's male.

Fuck you and your double-standards.

No, it shows how hypocritical Argento, McGowan and some others are. The founder of #metoo came out immediately in support of the victim in this story.

Oh whoop-dee-doo! Where were you when other men were speaking out?

Oh yeah, scaring them off.

This is confirmation bias in it's purest form: if a feminist/(group you hate) says something bad, all feminists think/say that.

It's not just your words, but your ACTIONS that give you away. You want me to list the ways in which you've added to the mess we are in?

But if this were a man his life would be ruined!

Not necessarily.

Not every single man getting falsely accused is as powerful and cushioned by piles of money. You're hyper-focused on the rich and powerful that you ignore the ones at the bottom of the heap. And on those rare occasions when you grace their presence, it's all about reminding them about how they're more privileged over women. Shows the lack of empathy you posses.

"Blargh, Blargh, Blee-bloo stop with the notallmen!"

Shut up. I'm going to keep notallmen'ng until your eardrums can't take it anymore.

Here's how to support men: If you're egalitarian and want true gender equality, take stories like these, blind yourself to the gender of the accuser/accused and ask yourself what the right response would be to the particulars of this case in either circumstance.

Okay, here's my analysis:

Argento knew Jimmy when he was young and violated personal boundaries, grooming him into a relationship in his teens. She fucking took advantage of him. And you have the fucking audacity to attempt to deflect the issue.

Otherwise you're validating #metoo by accepting its premises and/or paying feminists, with all our hypocrisy and hateful overgeneralizations, the highest complement: imitation.

Uh, could you repeat that in English please?

Title	MRAs: Stop Screwing Up the Argento Story
Author	msleeduon
Upvotes	0
Comments	69
Date	August 22, 2018 6:38 AM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/99b1ee/mras_stop_screwing_up_the_argento_story/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/mras-stop-screwing-up-the-argento-story.1185629 https://theredarchive.com/post/1185629

Comments