Male Contraceptive Pill Found 99% Effective in Mice, With No Observable Side Effects

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[–]Valzemodeus 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link

The sexual "Freedom" you are eluding to (ie without "judgement") requires responsibility bordering on the unilateral.

I think your view of reality is skewed by a lens of envy, which fails to grasp the Tykhe and Nemesis of the situation (the upside and the down side).

When you are a man, you are responsible for your sexual well being.

Nobody else is.

Period.

Men are not "judged" because they can not weaponize sex socially with anything remotely near the same devastating results.

Essentially, the narrative that "every guy wants it" makes them 100% vulnerable to sexual assault and even rape, with no consequences to the perpetrator should it be a woman. Rape victims can even wind up paying child support to their rapist, among potentially worse things.

Even a 12 year old boy taken advantage of by his babysitter bears more responsibility than a grown woman. He has no choice but to be burdened by HER predation.

"Consequences mitigated".

...

Riiiiiiiight....

And whether a boy barely entering puberty or a full grown man, he is assumed to be fully responsible for any sexual encounter.

The reason men are not "judged" for sleeping around is because they bear that responsibility, while women play a game of "shroedingers sexuality", which men can not.

"Rawr, I'm a sexual creature" (an agent)

"omg, I got drunk at a bar and taken advantage of" (an object... like a child... under the age of 12... and not a boy.)

...

She can then use the accusation of being a "predator" to hurt the "offender", which can result in ostracism, loss of job (and home/family/etc), imprisonment and worse.

A man has no such recourse.

He is judged to be responsible by default.

He has no other option.

He is always responsible for his own well being. No one will punish his assailant.

He could be passed out cold and no one would care if he gets taken advantage of or the consequences to his life and future as a result of a woman taking advantage of him, whether it's emotional trauma (ignored/denied), child support to his rapist or worse.

He's a man.

Being born a man means he was "asking for it" in the eyes of society (and thus the laws), and that he is nothing but an animal looking to breed as much as possible. Just ask the "red pillers"... that's all they aspire to.

...

I'm going to point to something a feminist said to try to express this better.

At one point, some guy on twitter said that if a woman doesn't want to be taken advantage of she needs to not put herself in those situations (ie get drunk and go to some guys apt, etc).

The feminist said "you would never say that to a man".

One person then went on to say that rape laws needed to be addressed so that predatory women face the same onus as a predatory man.

The feminist argued no such change was necessary because men are physically larger.

So... if a man doesn't want that to happen to him (which is more frequent than far too many people want to talk about), he should "not put himself in that situation".

If that guy would never say it to a man it is because any man with two brain cells already knows this.

Unilateral responsibility.

But only for men.

The reason a man isn't "judged" is because he is on his own.

Women want to be protected.

You can't have it both ways.

You either bear the same unilateral responsibility, or you deal with being looked down on for "putting yourself in those situations" and then crying when something bad happens and expecting the "adults who have to stand on their own because they tend to be physically larger" to fix it for you by punishing someone who "took advantage" of you.

And it is not always true... also more frequently than too many people want to admit.

And thus weaponized.

You become a burden and a hazard to those who are forced to stand on their own, and anyone who actually cares about them, who will tell you to avoid putting yourself into those situations or shut up because you accepted the risks when you took them... like a man.

Freedom has it's price.

Responsibility.

Most women are not willing to pay it.

And I can't say I blame them entirely because men are generally physically larger.

But, if you want things to change you will have to discard that excuse.

Smaller men (or even boys going through the emotional turmoil of puberty) don't get exempted from these social rules. They are still men in the eyes of society and the law.

They don't get a pass, and they aren't given "justice" when bad things happen to them.

Why should you?

[–]VioletFoxx 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

This could be a "me" problem but I'm finding that this reply is far more complicated (could be the formatting) than it needs to be so while I will do my best to respond in full I ask you to forgive any misconceptions I have about what you're saying.

Yes, I agree that the framing of men as beings who want sex all the time is very harmful. I grew up in a religious setting where this view is very prevalent, where women are oppressed into modesty to avoid causing men to "stumble", which also frames sexual assaults as the fault of women. "What were you wearing?" etc. This view of men as rabidly sexual is bad and I am sure it feels like a burden. It isn't something I personally can understand so thank you for explaining how it feels. Societally we need to do more to change that perspective. We agree on that.

Women take so many precautions to protect against sexual assault and your take here comes across very flippant. Sure, there will be outliers where a woman changes her story to accuse the man but sadly the majority of sexual assault accusations are genuine. "Putting oneself in that situation" is usually just trying to go about daily life and it's sad to hear how little understanding you have of the ways in which women try to avoid being assaulted. It's like there's a secret code we all follow, which is why you hear "even though she did all the right things..." when a woman is harmed. Women have been taking responsibility for their sexual wellbeing since the dawn of time, my friend. It's OK that you don't know, because it doesn't affect you in the same way, but this is a really bad faith take.

I agree that seeing articles where a woman has sexually assaulted a minor or a teacher assaulting a student is jarring when compared to the articles where the roles are reversed. This is very bad and I do call it out where I see it.

Men are not judged because historically men have been the arbiters of who is judged and for what. Let's not forget that. One of the reasons men are feeling more vulnerable now is because women have more power than we have ever previously had.

I don't feel you have addressed my initial question at all, really. I understand and agree with your perspective that the assumption men will enjoy any and all sexual attention is very harmful but ultimately I don't feel you have explained why sexual freedom itself is not something men have. This could just be a "we define things differently" thing, but hyperfocusing in on assault just ignores all the other elements at play, especially when the truth is we know that there is a lower risk of sexual assault of men by women.

I appreciate the time you took to reply and explain your perspective.

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So you’re basically saying the woman and child aren’t people? They are potential? What?

Why would you bring women and children into this? I'm talking about the zygote/fetus. It's not an actual person yet, no. It's a potential.

An actual person's rights trumps that of a potential. If a woman is going to get pregnant and carry it to term without his permission, he shouldn't have to pay for it. It's that simple.

Not sure why you're talking about the "woman" in the context you did. If anything, you should be talking to women and asking them why they're popping out babies that men do not want.

Don’t want a child? Use a condom or don’t have sex with someone.

We are talking about reproductive rights for men, not taking actions that only help the woman with her responsibility of pregnancy.

Forcing someone to have an abortion is an act of violence.

I never said anything about forcing anyone to have an abortion. WTF is wrong with you? I said men shouldn't have to pay for a woman's choice/actions. Pay attention.

How did you grow into these views?

You mean equality? I use my brain. I'm governed by logic and reason.

It’s obvious you’re a troll or a new (not yet banned) account.

You don't know what a troll is. A troll is someone who says things they do not mean. I mean what I say.

And yes, Reddit tends to be a really crappy leftist forum. I wouldn't be surprised.

Just curious how you got here.

I think of what would be fair for men. Making them pay for stuff they never wanted is not fair. Thus, they must be able to NOT pay for something they never wanted. Pretty simple stuff, yea?

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Does the side affects of female birth control cause suicidal thoughts in 70% of participants or permanent sterilization, no it doesn't. There are side affects but they're no where near as bad as what I just stated, so you can't use that as a comparison.

As for the reproductive rights, what they're trying to say is giving men birth control pills isn't going to fix everything. Your still going to have women baby trapping men because the guys in love or naive and thinks she wouldn't lie to him when she says she on birth control so he doesnt need to be. Your still going to have men who are raped who are not on birth control and thier rapist ends up pregnant. Making male birth control won't fix those problems, so we have to find other ways to fix them, because as it stands those men could still be put on the line for child support of a child they did not want and were forced to pay for. This not taking into account other reproductive rights like how most doctors won't perform vasectomies on men unless they have a partners permission, are above 35 or have two children already.

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[–]WillCuckSmith -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Birth control has been the responsibility of women since it existed because it's women who get fucking pregnant.

Yup, but it's not as much of their responsibility as it should be, imo. If it was enough, then the courts wouldn't make men pay for children they never wanted.

We don't need "help".

Well that's what condoms and such are for - to help YOU with avoiding pregnancy, for one.

I would have thought - based on how many comments here are about baby-trapping - men would want to be able to control their reproductive rights without a surgical procedure or a condom.

Again, condoms only help the woman with her responsibility of pregnancy.

Sexual mutilation, or as you call it "surgical procedures", is not a reproductive right that we need to be happy with and live with only.

The only way to give men reproductive rights is to make child support opt-in.

Yes, baby-trapping is a real thing.

[–]VioletFoxx 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Well yes, men have to play a role in being responsible for a pregnancy they caused. Contraceptives are not 100% effective and unplanned pregnancy is not possible without sperm.

Condoms also protect against the transmission of STIs, although this is less relevant in long term relationships.

If you're having sex with a woman with no plan to get pregnant then you both have a responsibility to avoid that possibility. As discussed, women cannot have unplanned pregnancies without men, hence men having to be responsible in cases where they cause one.

Sexual mutilation 😂 you realise that if a woman wants to become permanently sterile she also has to undergo a procedure like that, right? If you want to remove the possibility of either impregnating or becoming pregnant you have to perform a surgical procedure.

I actually don't disagree with you on the opt in thing but if that were the case there would need to be abortion access/proper health care/some form of government assistance available for the pregnant woman.

Baby-trapping is nowhere near as common as this sub would have you believe.

[–]WillCuckSmith -1 points0 points1 point 4 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Well yes, men have to play a role in being responsible for a pregnancy they caused.

Why should men have to play a role for a pregnancy the woman caused?

Contraceptives are not 100% effective and unplanned pregnancy is not possible without sperm.

Yup. Women should seriously take this into consideration before they have sex. You're right.

Condoms also protect against the transmission of STIs, although this is less relevant in long term relationships.

Not relevant to this discussion.

If you're having sex with a woman with no plan to get pregnant then you both have a responsibility to avoid that possibility.

Pregnancy is, once again, 100% the responsibility of the woman. So no, men do NOT have a responsibility for the condition of the female body... nor should they.

As discussed, women cannot have unplanned pregnancies without men, hence men having to be responsible in cases where they cause one.

Pregnancy is a condition of the female. We are all responsible for the condition of our own bodies. It doesn't matter if she got a donation of sperm or not. Getting pregnant and having it to term, AND keeping it are all her choices because it's her body and her responsibility. Men play no part in those choices.

Sexual mutilation 😂

Yes, getting fixed as a man is sexual mutilation. That's exactly what it is. For you to laugh and make light of that is just disgusting.

you realise that if a woman wants to become permanently sterile she also has to undergo a procedure like that, right?

So what? What does that have to do with this discussion?

If you want to remove the possibility of either impregnating or becoming pregnant you have to perform a surgical procedure.

Not a part of this discussion, once again.

I actually don't disagree with you on the opt in thing but if that were the case there would need to be abortion access/proper health care/some form of government assistance available for the pregnant woman.

I don't care if there is government assistance for that or not. However, we don't NEED it to have the reproductive right for men.

Baby-trapping is nowhere near as common as this sub would have you believe.

It happens quite often, and even if it didn't, we'd still need to be protected from it.

[–]VioletFoxx 1 point2 points3 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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[–]shit-zen-giggles[S] 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Mysterious-Example85 0 points1 point2 points 4 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Title	Male Contraceptive Pill Found 99% Effective in Mice, With No Observable Side Effects
Author	shit-zen-giggles
Upvotes	153
Comments	89
Date	April 17, 2022 4:47 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/u5qza3/male_contraceptive_pill_found_99_effective_in/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/male-contraceptive-pill-found-99-effective-in-mice.1210144 https://theredarchive.com/post/1210144

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