How do we make real progress?

Any-Bottle-4910 · 2023-04-04T23:15:06+00:00

I said this elsewhere, but:
Most women, and indeed most feminists, already know this. Most just don’t care, or won’t admit it, while some are even gleeful about it.
The only way this gets fixed is when enough moms watch their sons’ lives go to shit. Then, miraculously, this will get addressed.

Not one fucking moment sooner than that either.

In a male dominated society like Iran, it took the fathers getting angry for change to occur. They’re now in the midst of a mini-revolution.
The women tried it themselves in Afghanistan without male support, and they were flogged out of the streets quickly.

In our society, it will take moms to elicit change. We just need to wait, and apologize to those who’s sons will suffer in the meantime.

Title_IX_For_All · 2023-04-05T19:05:04+00:00

I think that the best way is to specialize in specific issues, prioritizing the issues where we can get the most leverage. For example, areas of discrimination where we can file complaints. Education, the workforce, etc. This will help make progress that can be measured and get advocates into the trenches.

Maybe establish a non-partisan "League of Men's Voters" that build coalitions to vote for candidates based on men's interests/needs.

This is really a marathon, not a sprint, so we need disciplined, skilled people in it for the long haul to lead specific efforts. And that will also mean people who lead that are willing to put their names on it.

tzaanthor · 2023-04-06T05:26:03+00:00

I, maybe naively, believe that the way to winning an ideological battle is to change people's hearts and minds

Objectively wrong. The ideologue's head is the only commercially viable material that can cut glass.

To defeat one's enemy, one must use guile. All conflict is deception, thus one must appear far when they are near, near when they are far, many when they are few, few where they are many, etc..

Read Sun Tzu's art of war.

You can go through all the statistics, the journals, the tweets, blog posts, news headlines, and threads but even seeing evidence is impossible when you are blind to the truth.

There are none so blind as those who will not see.

For the record: I think the best path forward is advancing men's issues wthout labeling them as such, because all that does is attract negative attention to no benefit. They will label it as sexist still, naturally. But that makes them look like paranoid fruitcakes when they say it out of nowhere, which discredits feminism.

With time this will corrode the image of feminism, while advancing men's interests. Then after feminism is disregarded in its extreme, we can finish off the remaining inequities in a blitz.

And we can have cake.

KatsutamiNanamoto · 2023-04-05T08:30:07+00:00

Seize all the world's political power (and means of production, of course). Abolish capitalism, borders, armies. Erase all discriminatory laws/rules/traditions. Teach all the children in the world egalitarian, humanist values. And, in 1000-10000 years things maybe will get better.

Blauwpetje · 2023-04-08T16:34:48+00:00

I’m afraid first the left implodes due to people being fed up with feminism and identity politics in general. In the Netherlands this clearly is already happening; instead of 40 or 45%, like in the past, the left gets barely 25% of the votes. Then there will remain confused, populist movements who defend the poor against neoliberalism, which hopefully will slowly become something like left-wing, or something quite new, that will be both for equality and sustainability.

Cunari · 2023-04-09T03:55:16+00:00

The easiest victory would be against the feminist terminology like male fragility and toxic masculinity but nope can’t even some to get anywhere there

How do we make real progress?

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