Advice/thoughts on signing a prenuptial agreement

TempestTcup · 2016-07-14T14:20:33+00:00

Back in the day, couples had a lot of different bank accounts: a joint savings account, Christmas account, vacation account, household account, separate accounts for each spouse, college accounts for the kids, etc. Each payday, different amounts were deposited into each account.

The SAHM generally handled the household account and payed the bills, bought the groceries, etc. There was usually an amount to handle her personal expenses included in the household deposit or it was deposited straight into her personal account. The husband kept a certain amount for himself, and the remainder was divided among the other smaller accounts.

The husband's allowance goes into his account and is his to spend as he likes. The household/wife's allowance goes into the household account, and she pays all of the normal expenses plus her personal expenses out of this account. Whatever she saves by being frugal is hers. That money can be transferred into her personal savings account. All extraordinary expenses like plumbing problems come out of the joint savings account.

Have you asked him about how the finances will be handled? Will all of the money go into a joint account that is considered his money? Will you have separate accounts? Will you receive an allowance that is yours alone, that you are free to spend or save how you want? Will you have to ask permission to get a manicure or some new eyeshadow? If he is going to be hard core about the prenup, you need to also flesh out the living expenses to make sure that your needs will be met.

StingrayVC · 2016-07-14T11:05:20+00:00

You've been together for 5 years. I don't need to know the answer, but in that time, have there been any red flags? I'd assume no major ones, since you want to marry him.

The risk is there. I don't know if it's substantial or not. He's taking a risk as well. Now, I don't know who's taking the bigger risk because I don't know divorce law, but the bottom line is, is it worth it? You are putting yourself into his hands. Do you trust him enough to do this? If no, then you shouldn't marry him prenup or not. If yes, then, while admittedly scary, it doesn't matter.

Marriage is for life. I understand that it's not today, but think of it that way. Do you trust him enough to marry him and make it work for the rest of your life, regardless of what this piece of paper says?

frozen_strawberry · 2016-07-14T11:10:18+00:00

Can you ask your lawyer what he would propose if it was possible you could see him as a team, not individually?

2016-07-14T15:10:09+00:00

the relationship is solid. you've had a great career. this is the man you want to marry anyway. if the only thing standing between you and the man of your dreams for life is a financial contract that can only be implemented should yall divorce, i'd just sign the contract and crank my married girl game up to 11 for the rest of my days.

In the meantime, while being a SAHM, just volunteer and keep your skills and references sharp. Depending on where you live, you'd probably not be that atypical as a woman returning to the workforce in her later years.

2016-07-14T12:45:37+00:00

Basically, it set a cap on how much I would be paid out, in the event of a divorce, instead of a percentage

Am I right to interpret that it is the above that has you worrying, together with the fact that you won't be able to have any savings of your own as a SAHM?

Have you communicated this particular concern to your SO?

Heyitstuesday · 2016-07-14T12:52:53+00:00

Hi there! First time poster here, I actually finally created an account after months of lurking just to respond to your post.

I'm a lawyer, and although my country's laws are really different from US ones (I'm Spanish), I work in the Spanish branch of a North American firm so I do have some knowledge on how US civil law works. I just graduated last year though, so I'm by no means an expert.

Anyhow, Spain does not have prenup agreements. Instead, if couples want separate finances here they can choose that option when they marry, but this works the same for every couple who goes down this route, and if you could word your prenup to work like it does in Spain, I think it would be fair for everyone:

Basically, each spouse retains sole ownership of everything they had at the start of the marriage, and of everything they acquire through their own means during the marriage. Things purchased jointly are divided 50-50. Each spouse is also the only one authorized to administer their own money. Both spouses are required to contribute to marriage-related expenses proportionally to their income.

In the event of a divorce, in order to divide the assets, if one of the spouses is a stay at home parent, housework is taken into account as a contribution to household expenses, and the judge will be the one to decide the amount of compensation that spouse is entitled to, which usually ends up dividing the savings earned during the marriage pretty equally. This is obviously only accounting for the spouses, since child support is factored differently (eg.: the parent who has primary custody gets to stay in the family home so the children get to stay there). I think that's mostly fair, since your economic circumstances can change at any time, but consult your lawyer since I don't know if that would be feasible in the US.

I agree with your lawyer that the prenup your husband gave you leaves you a bit unprotected in the event of a divorce. I don't agree with Stingray in that you should trust him regardless and hope that you never divorce. In a perfect world, I'd completely agree, but you never know what the future might bring you. Pardon me, but that cap on how much you will be paid makes it really unfair to you. What if you end up divorced through no fault of your own? You would end up being the biggest loser in the divorce, and you would probably look back on the moment you signed it with regret. There is no way to know who would be most at fault in the divorce or how much money you will have, so both your interests need to be protected equally.

Don't let this taint your view of your husband, though. His lawyer probably wrote that trying to protect his interests overzealously, but you have the right to be protected too. Let your lawyers fight it out so you and your husband don't have to.

Anyway, sorry for the long post, and best of luck!

plein_old · 2016-07-14T15:25:42+00:00

Does he spend time every day reading stories on "The Red Pill" about divorce rape?

Just curious if there's a rational explanation.

Raising a happy family seems like it is something that requires a level of trust and cooperation and so on, rather than paranoia and fear and hedging one's bets and looking out primarily for oneself, etc.

Maybe you can write a response to your husband, explaining your concerns, and then edit it to remove any unnecessary emotional stuff, and to keep it brief and succinct. Ask him to spend time thinking about it before rsponding. Sometimes writing can be less emotionally charged than having an argument where someone feels the need to defend their position immediately.

cats_or_get_out · 2016-07-14T19:28:39+00:00

Something to consider. Being a SAHM (I am one currently) can affect your income-earning potential. Say you are applying for a job after five years on the job market, then you are competing against people who are IN the market. Your last salary earned is probably under current market value (5 years ago dollars), but it will be used by the company as a guide in determining compensation.

That being said, I am in full support of being a SAHM. I think the advice offered by others here is sound. What does your lawyer suggest?

My thoughts? Marriage is all in. What's mine is yours, and what's yours is mine. What is earned--either by him or you--belongs 100% to the both of you. I view a prenup as protecting pre-marriage assets. Once you are a family, it is community property (50/50).

Marriage is high stakes. Children are high stakes. It's a pretty serious deal. In a positive note, both of you are taking this very seriously.

Heyitstuesday · 2016-07-14T14:52:34+00:00

In my perfect scenario, we would sign an agreement that protects any gifts and inheritance we might receive (those wouldn't count as marital assets) and I would be entitled to a percentage of the marital assets, assuming I stopped working.

Does this mean if you're married and living in a house with a savings account, he'll legally be able to divorce you and keep the house and ALL the marital assets? Car, house, savings, retirement, etc? That doesn't sound reasonable and I'm surprised a lawyer would put that in a prenup, and it doesn't sound like something that would hold up in court.

2016-07-14T13:05:33+00:00

Does he want you to stay home only when they are small? Like can you go back to work when they turn 4 and go to preschool? Also, can you keep your retirement fund and maybe talk about incorporating adding to it weekly or monthly to the budget? I'm assuming your going to go under his benefits at his job (eg insurance). But his attorney is looking at it pragmatically. I would say do the same. Suggest a 70:30, 60:40 or whatever in percentage in his favor or the cap to be paid out (whichever is higher) as the average over the top two years of his earning career while you were married. Unfortunately I don't agree with the idea that any gifts or inheritances you get remain yours. Once you're married any financial windfall you get is yours and your husband's. What has your attorney suggested. I mean I can't believe he just was dumbfounded by what your fiance suggested and didn't make any recommendations other than it being a percentage. Ask what other options are available.

trapped_in_a_box · 2016-07-14T13:24:20+00:00

I wouldn't marry anybody I didn't feel comfortable enough to sign a prenup like this with. Yes, you will miss out on the things you listed, but you would be receiving a portion of the marital assets, you do have a career to fall back on (albeit at a lower position than if you'd have stayed single), and you will be well-supported. Is there any possibility that you would be able to begin a savings in the meantime to help you feel more stable? In addition, don't forget that there will be a period of time while you are trying to get pregnant that you could be working - that money could also go to your savings.

Being a SAHM also gives time for part-time work when the kids are older and smaller income potential - I don't SAH anymore, but I went back to college full-time and sell on eBay and pick up old unwanted furniture to rehab and sell on Craigslist/Facebook. It's not the same, I totally get that, but if it makes you THAT uncomfortable there are other options.

On the whole, it goes back to my first sentence for me - don't marry the guy if you think you're going to end up with nothing. I know VERY few well-off men with more alpha than beta in them that aren't going to try to protect their assets.

QueenBee126 · 2016-07-14T13:15:31+00:00

I get the feeling that you are nervous because you won't have any savings if you guys divorce. He also will not budge. If this is the case than here is what I would do: You can improve your position by not paying your student loans down as much, and just paying the minimum, having your husband pay the debt after you are married. This will give you at least a little savings.

Title	Advice/thoughts on signing a prenuptial agreement
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	16
Comments	53
Date	July 14, 2016 10:04 AM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWives
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWives/comments/4ssip7/advicethoughts_on_signing_a_prenuptial_agreement/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWives/advicethoughts-on-signing-a-prenuptial-agreement.209799 https://theredarchive.com/post/209799

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