Thoughts on dominating group social situations

RedPillSafe · 2014-10-01T02:38:44+00:00

Very good observations.

Yes, I agree.

The Red Pill is at the core a self awareness and improvement philosophy.

Real Alphas seek to combine like a "Wolf Pack" and while there is the establishment of dominance within the group those contests are infrequent and team play benefits the group as a whole.

Betas are constantly trying to change their status within the group and so there is too much needless infighting. The group never "feels" like a group but instead it's like a family of spoiled children.

White Knights are the worst.

BloodyPhallus · 2014-10-01T02:07:33+00:00

I've noticed an undercurrent of insecurity coming from "negative social dominators". I think it comes from deep-rooted insecurities and inexperience and seems to result in a "cold" and inorganic style of leadership.

If you're submissive and want to become dominant, you probably need to go through a "cold" phase, but don't wallow there for too long lest you risk losing significant social capital in your social network.

whinemoreplease · 2014-10-01T04:21:10+00:00

Biggest thing I learned from PUA is to always give value. Doesn't matter who what where when or how, but as an individual I am always trying to bring value to any situation, work, social, or other.

Second biggest thing is to get rid of toxic people in your life. Negativity is infectious. Get rid of people who aren't adding value to your life.

Basically what I'm saying is that your observations are spot on.

wheyapartment · 2014-10-01T02:13:30+00:00

wannabee/fake alphas do this; best solution is to cut ties

I knew a perpetually broke guy who burned a $20 bill in front of me to impress me and some other guys. The guys been a bottom feeder his entire life, bullied small kids in school, is overweight, and he puts on this big shot act at all times.

flexiblehold · 2014-10-01T03:31:08+00:00

If we're talking about wolf packs, you become dominant or influential in them by demonstrating your equality to the other men of the group. Another way of putting it is you must demonstrate your worthiness to the others.

If you come off too supercilious you will be ostracized, or you will have others in the group looking to cold fight you to bring you down a notch (by cold fight, I mean challenge you in non-physical ways). Depending on the scenario, you might even have someone attempt to beat your ass.

Once you've demonstrated your worthiness, you must allow the lower ranking men to feel like they belong by treating them with a certain level of dignity and respect, which includes being supportive of their stories and jokes, and having a good time with them.

The kind of guy you describe above sounds like a lower-ranking person trying to cut the line and become respected with men in the way men become attractive to women, by acting disinterested and superior -- but men do not respond well to other men who do that.

I don't think it can be stressed enough that the way you gain social influence with men is very different than how you do so with women. I think the classic beta pitfall of, e.g., supporting a woman's stories, laughing at her jokes, making gestures of equality, being non-confrontational, lacking tension and hostility, being open and honest: this is learned behavior for how to be with men in the pack that we misapply to our interactions with women. The person described above is basically someone foolishly applying alpha -> woman social tactics to men.

RedPill115 · 2014-10-01T05:53:25+00:00

Wow, this is a insanely interesting post. This is exactly what I've been going through lately, except I'm the unpleasant social dominator. It's not the kind of unpleasant where I'm actively unpleasant - no one can call me on it. No one (well, almost no one, who knows) looks at me and thinks "that guy is being a jerk" or something like that. It's a very subtle thing. I've noticed that some of the players I know do it to, and some don't. It definitely works for maintaining an alpha status and appearance...I walk into stores and I get more respect. Seriously...people have mostly immediately pay attention to me, jump to help me, and have stopped trying to oversell or "guide" me in my decisions in that frieking annoying way. At my job, when I talk, people listen more and more, and ask me more and more for advice. I appear confident, in control, like I know what I'm doing.

Unfortunately, it has all the drawbacks you listed above, except #3 - I can still completely reprimand others. What I do is based on my continuing to be the expert, knowing what I'm doing, and being right.

But I'll tell you what the advantages are:
1. It's easier to shoot down happy idiots. This is...sigh...why I adopted it at my job.
2. People don't spend their time trying to sell you on pleasant sounding, but ultimately stupid ideas.
3. It's easier to pass shit tests, whether from a girl or from some guy who may or may not know what he's doing.
4. It's far harder to emotionally manipulate you.
5. It's far easier to keep track of what's happening at a sociopathic level - a level above what's immediately happening in front of you
6. As long as you look pleasant, people still seek out your attention and validation. But it's not nearly as much work. You just sorta sit there, look confident, occassionally demonstrate it, and people see you as alpha without nearly as much effort.
7. It's easier to pursue girls, and somehow it's clearer to them that I'm interested in them. There's far less of both my own insecurity, and their's to deal with.

The drawbacks are that it's kind of unpleasant to constantly maintain this state. That people don't feel emotionally drawn to wanting to hang out with you more. They leave and they know the feel less pleasant, but they don't seem to pin it on you. Your actions can inspire people to follow you, but there's little loyalty to it. The moment you aren't useful they drop. It's harder to get what I really want from girls. The old way of emotion and fun was insanely difficult, but if you connected, you really connected. It lasted for a long, long time. That doesn't work like this.

FortunateBum · 2014-10-01T02:19:28+00:00

I think you're on to something.

It's way easier to make yourself look good by putting everyone else down than it is to raise everyone up. It's the shortcut bullies take to high status.

[deleted] · 2014-10-01T04:37:47+00:00

You're describing the difference between posers and pros, and I'd agree, the posers are fucking annoying to be around.

It's not really negative social domination either, it's social incompetence. These guys are really just dragging themselves and everyone else around them down, are usually very insecure, and are best to just cut out of your social circles completely.

It's definitely an aspect of male-male social interaction that deserves a bigger spotlight. As I have noticed that every true natural ive met is very very comfortable and non-threatened around other men. To a level that's quite fascinating even, and they tend to bring people to their side as allies rather than push people away.

KarmaEnthusiast · 2014-10-01T11:02:38+00:00

I have a tactic I call 'switching'. I'm far from mastering it but it's very very interesting how it plays out with people. It's like, having a room with a light on and all your friends in it. But then suddenly you switch the light off and then back on again really quickly. There's been a sudden change but then everything's back to normal and if you keep talking then people will probably not ask questions.

Works for guys and girls. For girls it's sexual, for guys it's aggressive/assertive. Be talking normally to someone, gaining a rapport, then throw in a curveball and act like it never happened. I've found it easier with girls since they're less likely to call you on it.

Just be chatting away with a lady and be like "So yeah I met <such and such> through an orgy, it was neat, we had rules and everything. How do you know everyone by the way?

You're not giving away personal information (a commodity way too easily given by men), you're being playful with the 'rules', you've put a sexual topic into the conversation and she has a question in order to deflect away quickly from the sexual notions of the conversation.

I find she laughs at the first part, gives me a sly grin and then moves on with the question.

Not sure if you'd consider that vampirism or not, but it's a cool technique I like anyway.

Complecs · 2014-10-01T13:40:21+00:00

I've noticed this lately, in myself. I think I am what you are describing as a social vampire. I should fix that

favours_of_the_moon · 2014-10-01T03:53:46+00:00

Yeah, "negative" type people do not have your back. They think "power" derives from lying and underhanded manipulation.

And they're probably obsessed with it. Be wise as serpents, but be men. Don't rely on that type of bullshit, but be able to cope with it.

Padre55 · 2014-10-01T03:04:26+00:00

Hmm, the more interesting question are they really being negative or is that the perception of the person who that is being directed towards.

Alpha can be situational with different dynamics for each situation, IF it is a different social group or scene with different people involved. As an example, things that may go on the job could be completely flipped outside of the work environment with it's imposed social order.

Darthstacker · 2014-10-01T13:03:32+00:00

If you want someone to like you it is pretty simple. Ask good questions of them, listen, and be genuinely interested in what they are saying. I work in sales and this works all day long. It is also useful for being a PUA or just friendships in general.

You can get an in-depth study of this art form by reading "How to Win Friends and Influence People" by Dale Carnigy

HalfysReddit · 2014-10-02T03:39:26+00:00

Being dominant in social situations isn't about beating your chest and intimidating those around you into putting up with your bullshit.

It just means that when you want to speak, you speak. When you want to tell a joke, you tell a joke. When you want to argue against someone, you argue. You don't just allow the flow of social interaction to take you for a ride, you help steer social interactions and hopefully improve them.

caliboo · 2014-10-01T10:06:59+00:00

There's a trick here though, and it really depends on the kind of group you're in.

A lot of you guys are teens or early 20's, but this is a scenario that you'll find very common in your 30's and older if you're social:

If you're at a house party, and the majority of active participants are female- say wives and LTR girlfriends of other guys, or otherwise maybe / maybe not sexually interesting women- crack jokes, neg, be sarcastic, even "negative," and you'll generally be good.

If you go in the other direction with this kind of group, be too "positive" you might end up being perceived as a beta, boring, or even creepy depending on how "intellectual" you get or think you're getting.

So too negative, yep vampire. You get "positive value" from others.

Too positive, other way around. You lose "value" by giving it away. Give too much value away and you'll end up "needy." Who's needy? Betas. Got it?

Positive and negative - neither are bad by themselves but don't go too extreme in one direction or another.

Navigating the grayscale:

You'll be pretty safe if you default to two things:

Amused mastery - any shit test you get from anyone, diffuse the argument and drop it like you don't care - works great with betas / women.
Non-threatening AMOG - when you talk, assume everyone is a child; agree with their positions, repeat back the things they wanna hear, etc - works great with everyone, but only once you have their interest.

Once you get a read on the situation you're in, you can take it either positive or negative as needed.

Title	Thoughts on dominating group social situations
Author	redsbedbaby
Upvotes	132
Comments	30
Date	October 1, 2014 1:02 AM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2hy3l3/thoughts_on_dominating_group_social_situations/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/thoughts-on-dominating-group-social-situations.22117 https://theredarchive.com/post/22117

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