Marriage proposal

Rkingpin · 2019-03-17T22:55:13+00:00

I was thinking about this the other day

Through a purely red pill lens yes you are correct.

However when you expand your view and consider things through historical contexts the proposal isn't as bad as you're making it seem.

In traditional patriarchal societies, hypergamy and general slutiness wasn't as rampant. And men in general would marry virgin women.

In that aspect it could be framed as a strong man inviting a submissive feminine woman to accompany him in his life journey for the rest of their lives.

I'd argue a successful marriage isn't impossible but the vetting process must be solid. I'm talking low n-count, strong father figure growing up, financial health, submissive etc etc

Project_Zero_Betas · 2019-03-17T23:01:12+00:00

and asking for the biggest amount of commitment possible in life.

I'd say raising a kid together is the biggest commitment you could make in life. Marriage is just a legal contract, can always divorce/annul and move on. But a kid? Means she's going to be with you until the day you die (or become a deadbeat dad).

Ponder3277 · 2019-03-17T23:36:52+00:00

>You’re genuflecting in front of her

As a Catholic this made me chuckle.

BlackFire68 · 2019-03-17T23:55:28+00:00

she'll take it out of your ass from that point on... no need to ask

zxcvb7809 · 2019-03-18T05:53:15+00:00

Pledge fealty to your new keeper!

masterpiece00 · 2019-03-18T08:47:43+00:00

Whomever has the pussy has the power.

civilizedfrog · 2019-03-18T09:25:18+00:00

The ones that make the girls go "awww" is absolutely blue. Like on the knees with a ring with diamond the size of the moon.

Ridabewa · 2019-03-18T13:10:15+00:00

Genuflecting is a physical manifestation of putting her on a pedestal.

alpha-zach · 2019-03-18T14:16:33+00:00

Not if done correctly.

When you move a woman into plate status you have to be more aware of comfort tests. Beyond plate status you have to introduce some level of “beta-ness.” A better way of saying this is actions that are generally beta moves, but done from a place of power.

Think about this. An 80 year old, well accomplished, wealthy man is being a awarded a major prize in his field. On stage, he accepts the award, makes a few mentions of appreciation or excitement about the future of the field, and then takes 30 seconds to “gush” about how he couldn’t have done it without his wife. “She’s amazing, beautiful, funny, hard working, etc”

Now take those same gushing, emotional words and put them in the mouth of a guy who recently met and started dating a girl. “She’s amazing, beautiful, funny, hard working, etc.”

Same words. But instinctively, we know one is beta, drying up the pussy, prob gonna lose the girl. The other is alpha and prob gonna have a heart attack when she fucks his brains out that night.

Why?

Clearly the wife of the accomplished man had nothing to do with his success(with the exception of supporting him, which can be done in various ways, but is indirect help.) Everyone in the crowd knows it. He’s the brilliant one, he worked hard, he attained the goals. But it’s kind, generous and humble to give credit to those you care about when you are in the lime light.

Being a kind man is attractive to women. Being nice is not.

Kind vs Nice

Kindness is genuinely giving something to someone. Nice is disingenuously giving something to someone.

Accomplished and successful people generally GAIN respect by speaking highly of those around them because this is perceived as kind. Amateurs generally LOSE respect by doing so because this is perceived as nice. The amateur may genuinely be giving, but because he lacks power, his words have very little value and it appears disingenuous.

A good analogy would be with charitable giving. Someone who donates silently gains respect from those who find out who the donor was. Someone who donates and tells everyone does not. This is because subconsciously we know the donation had an ulterior motive. Likewise someone who is wealthy and gives a small amount loses respect and someone poor that gives a large percentage is respected for their sacrifice. Again genuine vs insincere giving. Kind vs nice.

Back to the accomplished man, if he only made a passing mention of his wife, it would appear insincere, and he would lose respect. He is wealthy in respect and should either give an appropriate amount away to someone he cares about, or simply not mention her at all.

So back to your question, if you do the traditional proposal, you have to do it right, from a place of power. I’m a fan of surprising her, but you want to make sure she was begging you for it. Make sure she’s the one that regularly starts sentences with “when we get married,” and playfully suggest that that’s not in the cards. I’m also a fan of making sure she says “I love you” first. Vet her thoroughly, and make her work to earn her ring. Keep the carrot in front the horse to make her improve herself(workout, eat right, fuck whenever you want it) Bonus: this sets the frame for the marriage and how she must act to keep your attention and her ring. Etc. etc. and when she’s done the work, earned the ring, and proved herself, then you can give her 30 seconds of “gushing” praise on one knee.

She’ll know you aren’t submitting to her because you’re the boss. But she gets a her little moment of happiness in exchange for years of work for you. You set the tone of the marriage as I’m the boss, you work for me, but I’ll make sure you’re taken care of.

This kind, but dominant man is the dream every woman wants.

LordMarkStark · 2019-03-18T00:56:20+00:00

What. the. fuck? Dude - you're asking the chick to put up with your shit and your good points and/or their limits for the rest of her life - its not beta.

Unless you mean a marriage rejection - I wish there was more discerning, and differentiating.

Nah, man, its not beta. Its a genuflection. (yes I had to look up that word when I thought to use it myself after reading). Following tradition/culture is not beta either. Sometimes it's lame, and paying too much respect to her in such a process would indeed be creepy (or from her point of view by that stage - out of place probably). But she's just as likely to see it as feeling special.

This is something for society, not individuals. If all her friends are getting huge genuflections, like his knee is going deep into the earth for her, she may expect it.

Thats not beta either - thats expectation.

And it depends who you make that proposal to. I'm more likely to think of it from that angle. If its some crack whore with a bad father figure, a litany of personal problems, and she's been banging everyone plus she's on every dating site ever made when you found her and she likes you because you support her kids and stop her from suicide - THATS beta. Because you didn't find the best partner and its for all the wrong reasons.

But not the process mate. You could also make the case asking such a girl gives you iron balls. 100% red pill is not needed, just common sense.

We all look around the world to get reinforcement from society, tradition, etc about how to act and what to believe. You may have seen from those around you or on tv things that shape your views, beliefs and life.

But the process is not beta, unfortunately the world is just wack. Its between you and her. But I will contend that roles are slightly switching, so the things I saw growing up for example may not be appropriate in 50 years - but the next 20, no.

Sometimes girls ask guys to marry them. It would be rare though to explicitly do that, but a girl will try to make it known when she is ready, in various ways or simply hide it out of insecurity/because she understands a guy should ask mostly of his own accord so she knows the dynamic of submission/his will to commit and treat her in a certain way is preserved; protection obviously increases in a marriage, there's that too, so he needs to be willing. So a guy is not fully acting of his own accord in any case. A blatant and obvious example of that is if a guy got her pregnant and she said you better marry me you bastard/ don't want the kid to be a bastard, etc, do the right thing. Those types of things can backfire on chicks and there's a very good reason the traditions were like they were. Its a survival/best chance thing.

Its not beta. It takes a lot of balls to take on a woman, because as you can see from things in life, they often reject would-be husbands, guys before they can be the husband and even cheat. It is what it is. What you might be saying is a false dichotomy; and without reference points which I am trying to provide, its easy to fall into a black and white thinking/false dichotomy mode of thinking about it.

Do I advocate marriage? It takes a brave or naive person to marry these days, but I am not against it. Sometimes ignorance is bliss. There is no notch on your belt in life or badge for marrying or avoiding it, do what you want to be happy.

_____

The trouble is guys on here think before they act too much. In girls you don't need to think too much. Just do, usually until certain points. If she is bad cut her off, if she is good open up to her. I say ignorance is bliss - think of it like that. It doesn't matter if its alpha or beta, just so you are experiencing life. You cross those bridges/dilemmas when you come to it.

The thing to do these days is really a long engagement and to not marry young if possible. I think thats where society is at in my view on marriage in terms of general policy today. Once you're in one the dynamic shifts - you're no longer going anywhere and being avoidant and all that other shit that got the red pillers ahead morphs a bit. If you don't go to sleep beside her each night she'll be pissed off, etc. Its about two people then, never mind what you want, its what she wants. But if you can't look at her with love then its your problem, not hers, though idirectly. And vice versa.

I dont think ATRP is an ideology. Its not even a complete scientific theory or validated in full. There's no need to make pieces fit. Its on a whole other layer. Its definitely got truth in it, but to suggest its a law composing of many facts/theories like gravity or quantum physics is a bit of a stretch. Therefore it would be unwise to allow TRP to stomp out your own personal beliefs completely, or run an agenda based exclusively on it.

Example. A girl says you should feel lucky to have her. Is that making you beta. Or is it her way of helping you to treat her alpha and stay on point for her. Basically a good marriage should be a good team effort. Sorry trying to wrap it up. That's what genuflecting is meant to represent, not be. In that case, nah it's probably not necessary these days except via an expectation. It's probably no big deal. Think back to times and its probably the timing of it. If a guy does it at a hockey game like in the meme/video there once was, thats probably bad timing. And she says no. Its too complicated to think about wholistically, but its why many guys fret over the timing. Its only sensible to do so. Thats something you might have to one day think about but probably not now.

Title	Marriage proposal
Author	patacsiipse
Upvotes	17
Comments	40
Date	March 17, 2019 10:47 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/askTRP
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/asktrp/comments/b2b3eg/marriage_proposal/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/askTRP/marriage-proposal.222373 https://theredarchive.com/post/222373

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