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Disturbing rise of the women child sex predators: What's behind it? And would they be punished so leniently if they were men?

xynomaster

October 15, 2015
278 upvotes
/r/MensRights
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3274956/Disturbing-rise-women-child-sex-predators-s-punished-leniently-men.html
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Title Disturbing rise of the women child sex predators: What's behind it? And would they be punished so leniently if they were men?
Author

xynomaster

Upvotes 278
Comments 35
Date October 15, 2015 10:54 PM UTC
(10 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/3ox2xt/disturbing_rise_of_the_women_child_sex_predators/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/disturbing-rise-of-the-women-child-sex-predators.969314
https://theredarchive.com/post/969314
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Comments

[–]cymrich 19 points20 points21 points 10 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

pretty sure it's not a "rise" so much as they are simply getting caught more often now and it's being recognized as a crime whereas before the worst that would happen is some kids parents would tell you to stay the hell away from their child. "rise" implies they weren't there, or were there in smaller numbers previously.

[–]ExpendableOne 10 points11 points12 points 10 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

Exactly. Women didn't start raping kids more, society has just started acknowledging that it's rape. Before that it was just considered to be innocent fun(because female sexuality is good and male sexuality is bad, therefore if a woman forces the act, it has to be good!).

[+][deleted] 10 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]ExpendableOne 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

the idea of women enjoying sex has been morally repugnant for much of our history

That is literally society accepting the notion that women see male sexuality negatively, and that men see female sexuality positively. The idea of women seeing sex with men as repugnant, is the idea of women seeing men as repugnant. That is misandry, not misogyny. Even slut-shaming, which has historically been considered to be a form of hatred against women, is somewhat rooted in misandry. It is shaming heterosexual women for embracing male sexuality(or, essentially, for embracing something that society deems to be vile, worthless and repugnant, and tainting their own pure/sacred sexuality in the process). People don't slut shame women who have sex with a lot of women, and genuine homophobia against homosexual men is more prevalent for that very reason.

The idea of female sexuality being viewed positively by society is a fairly recent change, in the grand scheme of things.

There's a pretty long and well documented history of women, and their sexuality, being treated as something pure and sacred, and male sexuality as vile and violent. Female chastity devices were essentially created with the idea of protecting women from male sexuality, and male chastity devices created with the idea of protecting women from male sexuality(often in the most painful way possible). This is not some recent thing.

[+][deleted] 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Rethgil 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Rubbish! What on earth do you think Paganism involved? Please stop spinning for feminism here, its faintly embarrassing.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's the last thing I'd do, but I'm not so blind that I can't see that people are shit regardless of their genitalia, and have treated each other like shit for longer than we've had basic language.

Y'know, fuckit though. This sub is getting a bit fanatical for my taste. It's really starting to sound like a mirror of the feminists we all despise so much. I'll cut my losses and unsub now.

[–]Rethgil -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No, you misrepresent what you refer to. The point made was men were seen as "lucky" to be the focus of female attention in any form. Perhaps dont be so pedantic next time. And even on your own terms, even Shakespeare's plays have 'comedic moments of women coming on to men' in a way that, were the situation reversed today, would be considered rape. So culturally it has been considered as harmless for centuries.

[–]Stink186 10 points11 points12 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

That dad is such a dumbass. The kid said he knew it was wrong. But he was probably covering the sitters ass because he had an affair with her.

The judge, Tim Mousley QC, described it as ‘an exceptional case’, saying that while the defendant was ‘immature’, the victim was unusually mature — which ‘narrows the arithmetic age gap’.

What fucking bullshit. So the intelligence of the adult predator is stacked up against the child victim? So what if she's a fucking idiot? The son could be traumatized for life.

[–]JohnKimble111 6 points7 points8 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That dad is such a dumbass

Doubt the feminist author would have written this piece were there not at least a few opportunities to take a swipe at men. So in a roundabout kind of way he's done us a favour here.

[–]azazelcrowley 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I mean I dunno. Is she literally severely mentally handicapped? No?

Oh. Then why the fuck is he bringing it up? You're right, it's stupid.

[–]Dippin_Dahtz 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

"is seems the victems iq is 180 and the abuser is mentally retarded, 40 years dungeon for the victim then

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I think they're just getting caught more and a lot of it has to do with cell phones. It seems like every time one of them gets caught it's because she was sexting her target constantly. Women and their phones....

I'm 50 years old and I can recall during high school women that I knew of who were chasing teenage boys for sex. I remember being in a high school play and adults from the community were also involved in various ways - makeup, sets, etc. There were three women who appeared to just join the play for the sole purpose of having access to teenage boys. None of the five women I knew about was ever busted or otherwise outed.

[–]MRA-automatron-2kb 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Excellent point about the texting (sexting) leaving behind a written admission trail!

Before that nobody would believe a boy because women are so idolized.

[–]Landjo 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It is the opposite of disturbing: it is comforting, is it not, that we are finally taking these crimes seriously. Not by far as seriously as we take those perpetrated by men, but the progress is all the same stunning.

Why in the world would we interpret this as a rise in sexual predation? Is the explanation that we are simply increasingly recognising this as a crime not the more likely explanation?

I would even expect female perpetration to predominate. Not because women are in any way more evil or lasvicous than men (quite the opposite). But because, unlike men, they have not been taught their entire lives that their sexuality is predatory - on the contrary, they are taught that it is valuable and that the objects of their desire is "lucky". That, combined with our traditional unwillingness to take abuse by women seriously, let alone penalise it, provides for a range of incentives. And, as we all know, human beings react to incentives.

[–]plainwalk 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Well, for a bit there, I thought I'd absolutely hate the article -- when the author began offering excuses for the rapists -- but when she began quoting Dr Burrowes, I was quite pleased by the tone.

[+][deleted] 10 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Dippin_Dahtz 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

been watching porn since i was like 10.. the craziest thing i do in bed is doggy style... so brutal /s. and no one believes it is theirs to enjoy by right, they know they shouldnt do it, but do it anyways

[–]DailMail_Bot 10 points11 points12 points 10 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Non-Daily Mail Mirror

Code on github.

[–]RedditorJemi 5 points6 points7 points 10 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

I'll paste the portion after Dr. Burrowes is mentioned here:

Dr Nina Burrowes, a psychologist who specialises in the psychology of sex abuse, agrees that more female sex abusers than ever before are appearing in court. It may not be the case, she warns, that the numbers are increasing - rather that the crimes are being reported more often. Perhaps most chilling of all, she says, it’s not uncommon for victims of historical abuse to reveal that they were once abused by their mothers. We’ve been reluctant to acknowledge this fact because we don’t like to think of a mother as a danger to her children. But women, says Dr Burrowes, have a capacity for cruelty equal to any man, although it’s rarer for the cruelty to be sexual. Infatuation: Yvonne Preston, 49, admitted falling for a student then showering him with gifts - but can appeal her classroom ban as soon as 2016 +6 Infatuation: Yvonne Preston, 49, admitted falling for a student then showering him with gifts - but can appeal her classroom ban as soon as 2016 For men, she says, sex is a very direct way to express masculinity and power, but for women, too, it can satisfy a need for control. There is, though, a more pernicious strand to that recent case of the 11-year-old boy and his 21-year-old babysitter - and that’s the response of the boy’s father. Surely we’ve learned enough about the harm suffered by boys at the hands of sexual predators to understand that their gender does not protect them from profound and long-lasting damage. Surely only the most outdated, unaware father, still steeped in the old macho values, would fail to recognise his own child’s sensitivity. This particular parent, who claimed that he had also slept with the babysitter, seemed to think that his little son was something of a stud. He told the court that he was ‘totally unaffected by it’ and had counted it as ‘a notch on his belt’. All this despite the boy having told the court he had felt uncomfortable because he knew it was wrong. Dr Burrowes stresses that children are not sexual beings, but that offenders will often claim sexual activity was the child’s idea. This she describes as ‘cognitive distortion’, where an abuser, or, perhaps in this case a father, tries to make the world fit their own ideas. Children, she says, are at the mercy of the adults around them and when an adult, male or female, hurts them, boy or girl, the experience is horrific. And if the abuser is a woman, says Dr Burrowes, the boy may very well wonder if anyone will even believe them, so unlikely does the notion of a female perpetrator seem. After all, if the judge in this month’s case can be so lenient in the face of such a seismic betrayal of trust, what message does that send out to other young boys and, crucially, potential female predators? Today’s boys face quite enough problems as it is, not least the proliferation of pornography and wrong-headed ideas about what sex and being a man is all about. We’ve struggled for years to help boys understand that becoming a man doesn’t necessarily mean accepting the old stereotype of the cold, distant, insensitive pater familias who expects a woman to pander to his every need. Yet if we ignore the harm done by the exploitation or sexualisation of boys and set aside their emotional feelings, we doom ourselves to producing yet another generation of males with little respect for women. Similarly, if we afford female abusers a level of leniency that we would never condone in a male, how can we possibly instill a sense of self-worth and respect in this generation of boys? Which brings us back to that poor 11-year-old. This boy needs kindness, love, education and an understanding that sex is for grown-ups who have the ability to consent with the full knowledge of what they’re letting themselves in for. Otherwise he too risks growing up to be a man who sees being ‘sex mad’ as a badge of honour. Most importantly we need to acknowledge that women can be sexual predators and can do serious harm to the children they abuse. It was Margaret Atwood, discussing her novel Cat’s Eye, about girl bullies, who said: ‘We must never assume that women are gooder.’ The potential for evil doing is in us all - male or female - and we shouldn’t be surprised that an embittered or cruel woman, who generally has less physical power than an adult male, may well choose a child as her victim. Equality means equal treatment for men and women and that includes the severe punishment which, in this kind of case, undoubtedly fits the crime.

[–]RedditorJemi 19 points20 points21 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Dr Nina Burrowes, a psychologist who specialises in the psychology of sex abuse, agrees that more female sex abusers than ever before are appearing in court. It may not be the case, she warns, that the numbers are increasing - rather that the crimes are being reported more often.

And this, I believe, may well follow directly from the increased awareness of female sex abusers that has been generated by the men's rights movement. A big win for us, in other words.

[–]xynomaster[S] 7 points8 points9 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

But this trend can be shut down if these boys see other boys who report their abuse being laughed out of court and having to watch their abusers go free.

Reporting sexual abuse is tough, and you only do it so you can watch your abuser be punished and put to justice. If the courts repeatedly show that boys who come forward with abuse by women will not be protected, these boys will just stop coming forward.

[–]RedditorJemi 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Ok, I understand your point here. But even if a female abuser gets a suspended sentence and a few years on the sex offender registry, this at the very least means she cannot contact the victim. She will be legally removed from his life, and he'll be safe from her influence.

What he will not be safe from are the victim blamers he's likely to encounter anywhere he goes - and I don't think these victim blamers will behave better towards him if the female offender gets a long sentence. If anything, it could be just the opposite in some cases, where the offender's long sentence is used as ammunition by the victim blamers. So it's clear to me that the victim blamers are the real problem here, and this means that a huge amount of focus needs to be placed on services for male victims of female perpetrators. This is not to say that we should not be holding judges accountable for denying justice to the victims. They absolutely should, and I think this means we should be examining case histories of bad judges and trying to get them disbarred.

But if the offender gets a lenient sentence but is not allowed any kind of contact or interaction with the victim, usually this means the judge has not actually caused additional harm to the victim - and we should make a very big and very public fuss over any and all exceptions to this rule that we find. But it is changes to the culture itself that we primarily need to address, and address it primarily, I believe, by making services more available to victims as well as potential victims, encouraging them to speak about their experiences and thereby emboldening other victims to do the same. The white knight judges who allow female offenders to get off easy are just a product of the culture. Our male hating, male victim blaming culture is the root cause the changing of which we need to place a priority upon.

[–]xynomaster[S] 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't disagree that services for the victims and to make them feel valuable and know that the abuse wasn't their fault and all that should be of primary importance.

And, as you say, women getting let off without even a slap on the wrist is a product of this culture. But that doesn't mean it doesn't hurt boys to have to watch their abuser walk free from court. That trivializes the abuse they experienced and lets them know that they aren't worth protecting, which is disgusting.

But you're right, we're seeing more victims speaking out against this kind of thing now. I just posted an article where a 15 year old boy who was abused by his social worker said in court that he felt abused and was worried she was going to rape him, then got scared afterwards and called his mom for help. The 15 year old boy abused by his teaching assistant went on TV to talk about how he was scarred for life by the abuse. It's good that this is starting to happen.

But while on TV he also said that he was "disgusted" by the fact that she walked free with a suspended sentence. All I'm saying is that this is an important component that shouldn't be ignored - every victim of sex abuse deserves to see their abuser brought to justice. The attorney general has been absolutely great about appealing these rulings lately and hopefully will continue to do so, but that's only in the UK and eventually there and in the US as well we need judges that will actually give these kids justice the first time around.

You could argue that changing the culture would fix this as a result (ie if people see the abuse as serious judges will as well), but I'd say the reverse - getting judges to start sending these women to prison is a key element in getting society to start seeing this kind of abuse as serious. The other elements are changing the disgusting approach the media takes in reporting these cases, and getting more and more of these boys (and sometimes girls) to share how this abuse caused them serious harm.

[–]mwobuddy 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I was about to say this.

Its not that there's more. Its that there's more visibility of it.

[–]xNOM 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

For men, she says, sex is a very direct way to express masculinity and power, but for women, too, it can satisfy a need for control.

One of the stupidest things I have ever read. Are nocturnal emissions about power? Only the female sex drive is about power. The male sex drive is about sex, and gives women power.

[–]RedditorJemi 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Well said.

[–]Stephen_Morgan 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

"gooder"?

[–]RedditorJemi 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Seems like a useful linguistic innovation. 'Better' would be wrong because it doesn't seem to refer to the moral sense of 'good'. 'More good' sounds clunky. 'Morally better' sounds awkward. I think 'gooder' makes sense here.

[–]Hedhunta 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Well when you are able to get away with it for decades with zero repercussions sociopaths start to feel brazen and that they will never be caught. Until they start treating it the same for both genders it will continue to get worse.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't think there is any significant rise I think most of them just go un-noticed or get away with it.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Probably because they know they can get away with it

[–]McFeely_Smackup 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What's behind it?

an almost iron clad knowledge that they won't be punished seriously, and instead of being called a monster, people will say "Nice!" if they're attractive, and if she's not hot she can always blame it on her damaged emotional state caused by a man.

would they be punished so leniently if they were men?

That's not a real question, is it?

[–]MRA-automatron-2kb 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It's mostly teachers we see in the news but IMO female family members and babysitters and medical staff have been doing this for ever IMO.

[–]Not_An_Ambulance 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I mean, purely anecdotally.... I stumbled across the part of a somewhat popular website where child rapists hung out. It seemed to be equal numbers of men and women. No, not Reddit.

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