Why if men "Don't want kids, don't have sex" is an entirely moronic argument

_Eggs_ · 2015-09-27T00:09:17+00:00

As a pro-life argument, "don't want kids, don't have sex" is logical. Pro-life people believe that once you make the child it is a person and therefore you can't simply relinquish your responsibility for it. That would go for men and women.

But when it's said by pro-choice people, such as in the article, there is a double standard whereas they retain their pro-choice stance for women but not for men.

I guess it depends on where you're coming from. It's certainly a moronic statement if you're pro-choice (as it sets up a double standard), but if you're pro-life you could logically apply that statement to both men and women without a double standard.

HugeSaladFork · 2015-09-27T04:02:30+00:00

That gene wilder meme should say WANT instead of HAVE.

Ser_Rodrick_Cassel · 2015-09-27T16:23:26+00:00

I'm not arguing the message but frankly nothing spells "credibility" any less than advice animals memes

Stephen_Morgan · 2015-09-27T12:40:49+00:00

And don't get raped or sperm-jacked either.

Rockbottom503 · 2015-09-29T21:42:06+00:00

I had so many arguments over this on yahoo answers! I made the same arguments for paper abortions and was laughed at consistently. Regardless of how it's looked at, consent to sex and consent to having a child are 2 entirely separate things - abortion makes that so! How is it reasonable or fair to say to one party 'you had sex, deal with the consequences regardless of what you think - it's in someone else's hands now' and to the other 'you had sex, this is potentially what happens if you want it too - if you do, you won't have to bear the burden of financial ramifications for it, if you don't we can make it all go away regardless of what the other person wants or says'. Women have choice - men are told 'man up' and deal with the consequences of the choice that's made for you. This is not equal in any sense. What's even more worrying is the concept coming out that when a man ejaculates anywhere, his sperm becomes an irrevocable gift - there was a case I read recently where a woman had given a man a blowjob, spat it out and then successfully inseminated herself with it - first the father heard about it was when a child support claim landed in his lap. I've read several cases where women have emptied used condoms and attempted the same...... What I'm saying basically is the argument 'don't want a kid, don't have sex' has no bearing! You can be as careful as you like with sex, it makes no difference and even if it did the glaring difference in choice after the event creates massive inequality! What of a man who is sexually assaulted (I have to say that as the definition of rape in English law still makes it impossible for a woman to rape a man) and a pregnancy happens as the outcome of that assault - why shouldn't a man have the same choice to have those consequences dealt with so he can move on with his life in the same way as a female rape victim??? How much uproar would there be if a female rape victim was made to pay their rapist a regular sum for the next 18 years?? Yet it's fine to do this to a man where the female perpetrator decides they'll keep the baby. I know I've gone a bit off point but I'll leave you with that thought!

TheWheatOne · 2015-09-27T08:31:19+00:00

Stop stop stop. That statement is perfectly fine on its own. This isn't about pro-life or pro-choice, or abstinence or reproductive rights. Its not even about equality or responsibility. Nature does not give one shit about any of this. Its the FACT of sex leading to children, since the dawn of life making up the sexual system of reproduction. Sure we can get into technicalities of being infertile and/or having artificial pregnancies, but the act of sex for the vast majority will always involve the risk of children, even if that risk is 1/10000 or less with birth control.

If you seriously, 100% don't want that risk, while still being fertile, while having sperm or eggs/womb that work, then that statement "Don't want kids, don't have sex" is without doubt totally logical.

Tons of MGTOW do it, virgins (willingly or not) live without it, asexuals don't have to give one shit about it, and the celibate obviously commit to at the very least, not having children naturally through sex. Even those extremist feminists who think all sex is rape, avoid it. We are not 100% pure sex machines that MUST have it like air or food or water.

Its as if people can't accept the reality of trade-offs, where the economics of opportunity cost, and the pendulum of pleasure verse risk is always ever present in almost all choices we are forced to face, can just magically disappear if we don't like it. That's just dumb. Its always been like this, for both men and women.

Snowfox2ne1 · 2015-09-27T06:22:43+00:00

"Don't want kids, don't have sex" is just reality. Sex makes babies.

Contraception exists, vasectomies exist, hopefully a magic pill will exist shortly too. Condoms are damn near perfect, especially if the woman is on birth control.

When you choose to have sex with a woman, you are choosing to be a parent. I don't care if you're male or female.

Now, if you want to talk about how women have "outs" like abortions or putting their baby up for adoption, sure they have more options than men and ultimately a larger say in whether or not a baby is born. But seeing as they take the lions share of the burden of creating the baby in their own body and having the effect of that process on their life, I think it's fair that they should get to choose to abort it or not. Sex is an inequal exchange. A woman is in a historically disadvantage position because they have more of a burden when a baby is made. Therefore they have more rights. Sex is not two equal people making the same decision, the male is making a much lighter decision. Safe haven laws are their own form of bullshit though. (That really only exists so people don't throw their babies in dumpsters.)

Egregious child support and societies views towards "deadbeat Dad's" is a separate issue from sexual reproduction.

tiltedrea · 2015-09-26T22:04:56+00:00

I might get hated for saying this but I don't support "financial abortion". And I don't think "financial abortion" is a reasonable solution to fix reproductive inequality between men and women.

People tell us that if we don't want a kid, we should use a condom. Perfectly reasonable for casual dating. But in a long term relationship, both men and women choose to give up on using condoms. At that point, the only protection is on the woman's side. It's really unfair to blame the man for not using a condom when this decision is made by both the man and the woman in the relationship.

I think a good solution to reproductive inequality would be the male birth control pill. God knows when or if we'll ever have one :/

Title	Why if men "Don't want kids, don't have sex" is an entirely moronic argument
Author	mrminibagel
Upvotes	67
Comments	29
Date	September 26, 2015 7:33 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/3mhyhh/why_if_men_dont_want_kids_dont_have_sex_is_an/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/why-if-men-dont-want-kids-dont-have-sex-is-an.970595 https://theredarchive.com/post/970595

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