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Game Of Thrones Is Relentlessly Sexist... But Not Against Women

desmay

May 21, 2015

33 upvotes

/r/MensRights

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Title	Game Of Thrones Is Relentlessly Sexist... But Not Against Women
Author	desmay
Upvotes	33
Comments	50
Date	May 21, 2015 3:57 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/36rmai/game_of_thrones_is_relentlessly_sexist_but_not/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/game-of-thrones-is-relentlessly-sexist-but-not.979653 https://theredarchive.com/post/979653

Comments

[–]Keiichi81 14 points15 points16 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]bertreapot 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]Vandredd 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]Vandredd 2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

I'd think if anything the drogo rapes are far worse.

Ramsay is an evil human being. Him raping makes sense. It fits the narrative: rapists are evil.

Drogo though is presented as a good and noble character. He never repents and apologizes for the rape. Instead she uses sex to turn him in to a loving husband. He stopped raping her when she started consenting and then he turned in to a wonderful husband and everything was great for a bit (longer than average in that world).

That right there glorifies rape and domestic violence. How many women are in situations like that thinking that they can change him. If they just put up with a little more he'll come around.

That is a hell of a lot more concerning message than "known sadists will hurt people they have power over".

Dany and drogo read like the fantasy many abused women live with: take a few more hits and I can change him in to a loving husband and we can have a happy family. That shit leads to people staying in abusive relationships.

Ramsay and sansa? That will lead to nothing. That guy was already hated and creepy.

And yet feminists were largely silent there. Clearly there was some other factor involved.

[–]Demonspawn 2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

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[–]DavidByron2 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

There was no sign at all that she wanted to have sex

(1) she just married him

(2) she was taking off her clothes

Short of a signed document in her own blood I think those are about as good a signs as you can get.

she gave no consent

as above.

she had no ability to say "no"

Except to say "no".

due to his implied threat that she would be tortured or killed if she displeases him

Which she knew was mostly bullshit because his father would have him killed for doing something that stupid. In any case you can't force a volunteer. She wanted to be there so what is the purpose of pretending he threatened her? Let's say in his own mind it was a threat. So what? She was there under her own plan of action.

If you think that isn't rape, I don't know how else I can explain it to you.

Well you can show she didn't consent. You know like the definition of rape?

[–]chocoboat 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]DavidByron2 -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]fameisforassholes -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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[–]DavidByron2 -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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[–]climate_control -2 points-1 points0 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

The problem is that the people in that thread are incapable of separating the events of the show from real life in medieval times, and real life in modern times.

Marriage was a defense against rape in England and Wales until 1991, which was about 700 years after the show's approximate IRL time period. As such, its very difficult to see how Ramsay could be accused of committing a crime, in the context of the show or that time period IRL.

Did Sansa consent? In one sense yes, she consented at the marriage ceremony, where she was fully aware of the implications of that consent.

Did she do it under duress? Yes, of course, but nearly everyone in the show/book does everything their forced to due under duress of some kind. Her marriage and its consummation were certainly more consensual than Daenarys with Drogo, where she was essentially sold to him like an object.

So why does everyone care all of a sudden? Because they associate with Sansa. Daenary's marriage / consumation was done when we barely knew her. Because Sansa had been here before, with Tyrion, and he couldn't do it. We thought she had plot armor, we were wrong.

But also because Theon watched. That's one of the big reasons here why everyone is so upset. Even if she consented to marriage and the sex she knew went with it, she didn't consent to an audience, right?

Wrong. She knew it was a possibility. Remember the Red wedding? Remember when a group of people went off to watch Catelyn's brother's wedding night sex?

This was a common medieval custom, for high status semi-arranged marriages to have their consummation witnessed. Look at what Tyrion did, abdicate his duty due to empathy/weakness depending on the point of view. Often times it was the Bride's own mother who witnessed the events, so having it be a close "family" member wasn't even that unusual.

So lets just get to the real reason people are upset, and why Sansa's marriage night was controversial, but Daenery's wasn't. Its because we liked and new Sansa. Its because we thought she'd always be safe. Its because we hate Ramsay, but loved Drogo, even though their both remorseless psycho killers, but Drogo was hot and stupid, while Ramsay is cunning.

[–]DavidByron2 -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]climate_control -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]DavidByron2 -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]climate_control -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]DavidByron2 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link