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Thoughts on the article? It's advisable to read the whole thing to get a better idea.

Strikester101

November 24, 2019
5 upvotes
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
https://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/14/us/14iht-letter14.html
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Post Information
Title Thoughts on the article? It's advisable to read the whole thing to get a better idea.
Author

Strikester101

Upvotes 5
Comments 18
Date November 24, 2019 6:40 PM UTC
(6 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/e12i50/thoughts_on_the_article_its_advisable_to_read_the/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/thoughts-on-the-article-its-advisable-to-read-the.1202502
https://theredarchive.com/post/1202502
Top posts by Strikester101

So, how much damage did women's groups cause to anti-rape activism regarding female-perpetrated abuse?

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A misandrist ad for Virginia Slims cigarettes. Thoughts?

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How much do women perpetrate child abuse of all types?

75 upvotes
August 21, 2022
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TwoX: "It makes no sense to me that feminists are blamed for male rape victims not being taken seriously. The vast majority who mock them are men" | AKA being a flounder and focusing on the men

73 upvotes
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What are the general rebuttals to "Men Commit the Vast Majority of Crime!" talking point?

67 upvotes
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Genuine question: Do male rape victims get punished/incarcerated by the legal system?

66 upvotes
August 22, 2022
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OK, is anyone else bothered by how they are stereotyping the COVID-19 situation as "women are more effective than men"?

65 upvotes
July 17, 2020
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates

Comments

[–]mtcapri 12 points13 points14 points 6 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I just see more sexist hand-wringing from the NY Times. "Women are doing better than men, but this means their dating/marriage prospects are shit. Such injustice women continue to endure!" Even when women are winning, they're the victims.

[–]LacklustreFriend 4 points5 points6 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah I'm so sick of it. Started reading the first paragraph thinking, "maybe this will be a nuanced take on how changing gender expectations has resulted in some negative outcomes for both genders".

But no, it's just garbage "women are doing so great, but men aren't, which sucks for women". Men can literally not have problems. Everything is a problem for women.

[–]mewacketergi 3 points4 points5 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The essentially religious unfalsifiable nature of this worldview is why I personally mentally model feminism as something closer to organized religion than to network of diverse political movements.

[–]Oncefa2left-wing male advocate 9 points10 points11 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

There's probably a dichotomy created by the fact that men (and society) on average support women, but not the other way around. A woman who is unemployable and not good at anything can at least be a mother or a wife. And even if she's bad at those roles, nobody will judge her or compare her against a man who is homeless (which is what would happen to the woman if the genders were swapped).

When men fail it's obvious. When women fail there are safety nets and a modern "you go girl" culture that sees anything a woman does as positive, essentially by definition.

[–]Sewblon 5 points6 points7 points 6 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

What is to come out of this new world? “I think women are going to have to abandon the traditional 50-50 everything-must-be-equal feminist mind-set,” Ms. Mundy said, “and learn to value husbands and partners who are becoming more domesticated and supportive.”

In other words, economic inequality is fine as long as it benefits women. Part of me wants to know how many people really think that. But the other part of me is afraid to find out.

“Women here are doing the same jobs as men,” she said. “They are getting paid almost as much or sometimes more and doing the jobs better, and on top of that, women are the ones who have children and who care for children. What’s there for men to do?”

How does she know that the women are doing the jobs better?

Also, men still out-earn women at all age groups. https://www.moneyunder30.com/the-gender-pay-gap-in-the-21st-century So we can't rule out the possibility that single women earning more than single men among people under 30 is just selection bias: i.e., the men with impressive income are all taken. But the women with impressive income are not all taken because men don't assign as much weight to their partner's earning potential as women do. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mating_preferences

[–]Oncefa2left-wing male advocate 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Also, men still out-earn women at all age groups. https://www.moneyunder30.com/the-gender-pay-gap-in-the-21st-century So we can't rule out the possibility that single women earning more than single men among people under 30 is just selection bias: i.e., the men with impressive income are all taken. But the women with impressive income are not all taken because men don't assign as much weight to their partner's earning potential as women do. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mating_preferences

I never thought of that before. It's actually a really good point.

[–]WikiTextBot 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Mating preferences

Mate preferences in humans refers to why one human chooses or chooses not to mate with another human and their reasoning why (see: Evolutionary Psychology, mating). Men and women have been observed having different criteria as what makes a good or ideal mate (gender differences). A potential mate's socioeconomic status has also been seen as having a noticeable effect, especially in developing areas where social status is more emphasized.


[ PM | Exclude me | Exclude from subreddit | FAQ / Information | Source ] Downvote to remove | v0.28

[–]Melthengylf 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Paywall

[–]StoicBoffin 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Paywall

[–]hatefulreason 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

let them eat cake !

[–]Strikester101[S] -1 points0 points1 point 6 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Let me be open about this. Are we redundant as a gender? Are we detrimental to them? Because the article points out how women are doing better job than us AND are taking care of children.

[–]apeironman 4 points5 points6 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No, the article claims women are doing a better job. Evidence, please. Doing better at raising children? Again, evidence please. Just because women are generally the child-raisers by default does not mean they will do a better job.
Which gender do you think is going to do better from the start: the one that faces grading discrimination, stiffer penalties for acting out in school, and has fewer scholarships, or the one that has those advantages along with positive discrimination in fields where they are underrepresented? Men aren't redundant, they face bias at almost every level. The only reason for a wage gap is because women work fewer hours and choose lower paying jobs, on average, and men also tend to work more overtime and choose the higher paying professions on average.

[–]Melthengylf 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

We are humans. What does it mean to be redundant? In any case, corporations are happy for us to exist, since they do need labour.

[–]Sewblon 1 point2 points3 points 6 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

We are humans. What does it mean to be redundant?

It means that if we were to magically disappear, then no one else would be inconvenienced.

In any case, corporations are happy for us to exist, since they do need labour.

Corporations are not "happy" corporations are just legal fictions created for the sake of their owners. Only living creatures experience happiness.

[–]Melthengylf 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

It means that if we were to magically disappear, then no one else would be inconvenienced.

Don't you have friends or a family? It is not normal to feel this way. It is the way people feel before getting suicide.

Corporations are not "happy" corporations are just legal fictions created for the sake of their owners.

It was a joke

[–]Sewblon 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I do have a family. They would be sad if I disappeared. I guess what I should have said is that I interpret men being "redundant as a gender" as there not being anything that is true about men that is good, that isn't true about all other genders. In other words, that if men were to all become women, or non-binary, that people would only object because they are androphilic, i.e. straight women and gay men.

[–]Melthengylf 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What is it good about women that isn't true about other genders? I don't seem to get you.

[–]shit-zen-giggles 0 points1 point2 points 6 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I can understand your feelings of unease (and potentially even fear). That's a very understandable reaction. Let's take a look at whether such thoughts as "we are redundant" and "we are detrimental to them" are anywhere near realistic.

Redundant?

Having a high flying career (80+ hours / week) and children all on your own, without any family (partner, parents, siblings) or staff (nanny, daycare etc) is next to impossible. There's a reason most single moms work part time in a low income job (less than 24K/year) or are on welfare.

Detrimental?

Depends. An unemployed drunk is certainly detrimental. A guy who works and does his fair share of chores? Definitely not.

​

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