The total obliviousness to men's issues.

reverbiscrap · 2024-12-28T06:01:31+00:00

I heard a fairly learned man say 'Empathy is not an innate talent, it is a learned skill that must be taught; if you are not taught to empathize with a specific group, you will not be able to empathize or understand them'.

Using that as a basis of context, and knowing that women tend to objectify (a harsher person would say 'dehumanize') 'Men The Group', it makes sense. Add to that, the light bulb turns on when she has a son, and realizes 'males are people, too!' because 'male' includes that bubbly product of her efforts that she loves, rather than the scary n-word in the alley or the her sleazy white corporate boss.

Edit: my spelling was atrocious!

wroubelek · 2024-12-28T05:51:23+00:00

We all live in our little bubbles, absolutely.

👏 Very true.

Yes, if you read the 2006 book by Norah Vincent called 'Self-Made Man' (that basically describes her 1.5 year experience of dressing up as a man and infiltrating male communities), on the cover it says something like "Men don't have it easier, they just have different problems". As if anyone needed reminding. But apparently people do.

Not long ago I witnessed a similar pronouncement from a female member of my family, and I sent her this video.

Also, we need to create an antology of this sub and publish it as a book. It would be a go-to resource for everyone facing similar issues of awareness. All the women who got a lenient sentence or escaped jail altogether due to pregnancy, all the spitting in the face of male IPV victims, all the "men are not a protected class" approaches, all the stuff concerning the conscription, divorce, custody etc.

Clockw0rk · 2024-12-28T08:19:03+00:00

Well, ask yourself... when would she have been encouraged to think about men's issues?

We don't talk about gender roles in school. Unless there's a special secret girl's class I wasn't invite to, I don't remember public school discussing gender-specific issues at all. Going off to war and dying for unjust political causes... it's just what men do. What they're expected to do. It's their duty, as citizens.

And no one ever stopped to explain, nor question, why that standard of sacrificing our bodies and the expectation that every young, "able bodied" male should do so with no regard for being philosophically or religiously against war. And then we're told in the same breath, this is the country of freedom and we value equality.

The public schools don't teach about the reality of male disposability or suffering. Feminism has wedged itself into the nation's legacy thanks to the decidedly discrimitory positions of the founding fathers to limit the vaunted freedoms for citizens to wealthy land owners, and eventually soldiers, and eventually black people (sort of~) and finally women (and everybody-ish). Say what you will about the cancer of Feminist thinking and propaganda, but they wouldn't have been famous in the first place if not for horrible, systemtic bigotry requiring the civil rights movement to correct course.

So what about higher education? Well, aside from the fact that it's not a right but a pay to pay privledge of getting to partipate in higher paying labor (pretty impressive scam, tbh), the entire concept of "Gender studies", which might've been the perfect place to finally take serious study of male roles and issues in modern society... it's optional. And almost entirely Feminist dogma. I didn't bother to take this course myself because I feel like any rational person would see the course description in the catalog and spot a feminist academic scam when they see it, I laughed a bitter laugh of another example of socially acceptable female supremacy social engineering trying to pretend to be scholastic or informative and did something better with my time.

What about the news or the work place? Well no, why would they? "Men" are not a special interest group. They don't turn out to vote as much as women, they don't spend as much as women, they aren't as self-interested as women, they aren't given the variety of choices as women, they aren't given the special health care or social services or mental health acknowledgement of women... Why would profit driven businesses care about the less attractive market segment when the goal is to maximize profit?

Men work longer hours, with more physically demanding labor, often for less benefits, than women. And that's a standard. It has been for ages, and it's due to biological "advantage". Some see it as a blessing, I've always regarded it as a curse, but the demand that men's natural inclination to be stronger thanks to testosterone means that they should tackle the hardest jobs, and we don't even reward them fairly for the obvious long term damage we do to their bodies and minds?

It's not an accident that men have higher suicide rates. It's not a fluke that men's life spans are shorter. When you spare the rod from the 'good child' and then beat the shit out of the 'bad child', it's no wonder that the 'bad child' gives up living first, one way or another. (continued in reply)

EricAllonde · 2024-12-28T10:58:56+00:00

Assuming she's not a feminist, it's not her fault.

Our very gynocentric society has handed feminists an immense amount of power and influence, on the basis that they are supposedly protecting women and raising women up to a position of equality. None of that is true of course, because we're talking about feminists here.

For decades feminists have used their influence to push the messages that:

only women have issues and disadvantages;
only women's issues and disadvantages are important and men's are not;
no matter how objectively privileged over men women become, they will always continue to be oppressed and need to be given an endless amount of additional cash, prizes and privilege to make them OK

Feminists utterly control the education system, the media and many other institutions. So they're able to push their propaganda and disinformation onto kids and adults alike throughout their entire lives.

mrmensplights · 2024-12-28T20:04:43+00:00

Attack me or hate it if you want, but women do not consider men generally. They just don't. The only thing that changes that as far as I've seen is having male children or seeing the system brutalize someone they care about first hand. (father, brother, etc.)

There are also grand societal narratives involving women and their struggles that propagandized everyone. Women in particular as the 'oppressed' and 'victim' group in these narratives become even more hostile to the perspective or suffering of the 'oppressor' scapegoat group (men) which makes the problem much worse. I'm glad your female relative is nice, but most average women have been conditioned to respond with skepticism and even anger towards any discussion along these lines in regards to men.

I believe the main target of our efforts should be other men. Men are not as quick to solidarity as women due to a lack of in-group bias that women have, but if we make education and alternate viewpoints available many men will free it. For young men, this work can be the only buffer between them and fully embracing an identity as an inherently evil being who must subjugate their happiness to women to make up for the original sin, shame, and guilt of being born male.

mrkpxx · 2024-12-28T07:12:23+00:00

Most women are solipsistic.Empathy is for self-pity.

juuglaww · 2024-12-29T01:28:20+00:00

Women love to feign ignorance about the status quo and their protected status. But deep down they know of their privileges and protections if they ever need to employ them.

cautiousCray · 2024-12-28T21:32:16+00:00

That's great that she asked you! I think being open to listening is the first step toward developing empathy for another group. Did you share anything specific with her?

tristanthompsonbeast · 2024-12-28T07:04:53+00:00

Yes this interview confirms:

https://youtu.be/Zp7FLHKyWbk?t=1339

RoryTate · 2024-12-28T17:11:06+00:00

This question was asked by a female relative after she saw news articles that stated 'young men are feeling lost' (after young men voted farther right in the recent US election - but that is beside the point of this post).

Did this relative of yours happen to vote differently than those young men? If so, then the question needs to be asked if her newfound concern is actually just being done out of self-interest, rather than empathy or compassion. Especially considering the fact that, in your own words: "She just simply didn't ever think to ask it before.".

Though she could still be "an incredibly nice person" as you say. There's actually a way to find out: approach her with some examples of solutions to issues that men face. A good few to use for a litmus test are as follows:

The average men's sentence/punishment for a crime should be normalized to be the same as the average women's sentence/punishment for the same crime. (Men currently receive around 60% longer or harsher sentences for the same crime.)
If a man informs a pregnant woman carrying his child that he does not want to be a father, provided he does so within a time frame before birth where she can decide if she wants to raise the child herself without any support or not, then he should have the reproductive right to have a "paper abortion".
All children born must undergo mandatory and automatic DNA testing so that men can be reasonably certain that they are the biological fathers of the offspring for which they are held responsible.

If she recoils from these suggestions, or reacts with negative emotions of any kind, then she is not interested in "helping" men. She only desires to "fix" men, unfortunately, for her own perceived benefit.

However, if she considers these proposals rationally – even if she ultimately decides she can't support these specific suggestions and wishes to compromise in other areas instead – then she is indeed a fair and nice human being as you claim.

In my life, I've known very few women who would not describe themselves as caring, compassionate, and loving people. The problem is that many – or even most – of them do not consistently act in ways that support this assertion. In those cases, as soon as the perceived interests or needs of Women (with a capital W) as an identity are threatened, they become cruel, uncaring, and cold towards anyone in the "out group". You must be aware of this duality before moving forward with any belief or trust that men's issues will be treated fairly in the cutthroat world of human politics, and not be naïve in thinking that male problems will be approached by implementing real, effective, and practical solutions without a lot of hard work holding people's feet to the fire first.

Hour_Zero · 2025-01-01T13:43:50+00:00

The problem is that when we point out issues in which men are the primary victims (commiting suicide, homelessness, being victims of violence and murder, social rejection and isolation, mental illness like depression etc.) you inevitably get doofuses in the replies who say "BUT THOSE PROBLEMS AFFECT WOMEN TOOOOOO" Yeah, but not at the disproportionate amount that it affects MEN, that's the point. Just because a smaller percentage of women can also be victims of those things doesn't mean that it isn't an issue that is predominantly hurting men and should therefore be treated as pressing issues for the male community seeing as we make up the majority of the affected victims

Roge2005 · 2025-01-02T13:02:11+00:00

I really like seeing stuff like this, having more women care about men’s issues too.

Like in my case most of my female friends talk a lot about women’s issues, but sometimes they’ve also talked about some men’s issues.

imperialBane · 2024-12-28T13:20:58+00:00

That's why the feminist hold on mainstream media is a serious issue

Available-Reward-823 · 2024-12-29T05:42:42+00:00

I think because most of the attention is on women’s issues. Not saying men don’t have issues either. Also the male loneliness epidemic doesn’t make sense to a lot of people - and tbh I don’t blame them.

ilovelifeforeva · 2024-12-28T16:13:20+00:00

Ya know what women did when they felt displaced by society? Built the kind of platonic camaraderie and intimacy that has sustained us for generations. They organized. Showed their faces and fought even as men and women called them ugly feminist lesbians. And they leveraged collective power for good, like advocating for gender equitable policies that have allowed men to benefit from parental leave and two-income households so they can be more present and active fathers than their fathers. You should maybe get off Reddit and do something about it. The pathetic group you hate so much managed to do it 60 years ago.

Nouvel_User · 2024-12-28T10:00:22+00:00

Such a little victim.

Title	The total obliviousness to men's issues.
Author	TwerpOco
Upvotes	270
Comments	94
Date	December 28, 2024 5:36 AM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1hnyzn6/the_total_obliviousness_to_mens_issues/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/the-total-obliviousness-to-mens-issues.1539712 https://theredarchive.com/post/1539712

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