What is this movement about?

bufedad · 2017-04-14T21:31:57+00:00

it's about men and women being treated equally under the law.

William__F0ster · 2017-04-14T21:51:05+00:00

Personally I am a feminist ...

What does that mean to you? And I'm curious as to why you felt the need to explain that

What is this movement about?

From the margins (I am not an MRA, but am interested in their cause), I would say broadly that it is a movement which addresses discrimination against men (and boys) as men (and boys), but where that discrimination has a negative impact on society as a whole.

Suicide, for instance, is devastating to all those who are intimate with the person who ends their life - as men are three or four times more likely to take their own lives than women then this is a significant issue.

Reasons for suicide are highly complex, but being deprived of access to one's children and finding oneself financially ruined are both contributing factors of suicide to some of those men and both of the latter are pushed through by government and law courts.

Whether they are sons or daughters, being deprived of access to their father is as cruel and damaging to the children as the parent - the whole 'feckless/deadbeat dad' shtick is blown out of all proportion. Yes, there do exist mindless assholes that ditch their kids, but they are hardly representative.

If you are new, one thing you should know is that very few people (if any at all) are banned or blocked from posting here so it is worth bearing in mind that just because a post appears on this Sub does not make it representative of anything other than the views of the OP.

Edit Typos plus sentence for clarity

Mallago · 2017-04-15T00:41:11+00:00

Equality is exactly what the MRM wants. The reality of inequality is not what most people know- sexism and discrimination against men actually exists far more than most people know. When you look at statistics for things such as employment, education, health, homelessness, etc, you say that men actually fare worse than women. Society accepts disparities against men because of the perception of how inequality manifests itself.

oshout · 2017-04-14T21:52:33+00:00

I offer that it's about equality.

Not everyone here is a man. Neither the sub nor notion is about making men universally better than women.

Though in the context of what's frequently posted, it may seem like men are promoted above women, the sub is often used for highlighting perceived inequalities, sharing negative experiences and/or drawing parallels in which men are the victim - which I think helps to reinforce the notion of men above women.

But, there's also activism and people being genuinely thoughtful. Though to counter that segment of nice-ness, there are a wide variety of people here and not many things are censored (it seems). Though there are groups of people (/r/redpill) who would see to put men above women, and though the users may participate here, I'd like to think they're not generally welcomed. It's fun to see people agreeing on a topic to find they have irreconcilable viewpoints, but realize they're not in complete disagreement. (IE hardcore conservative vs hardcore liberal).

If you go through the content history of the sub, say top of the last year, and read the comments, you'll see what I'm talking about.

You may want to check out reddit.com/r/femradebates

Here's one I wrote (Score of 1!) about /r/redpill-esk men and -- ahh, whatever the alternative is, ahaha

https://np.reddit.com/r/FeMRADebates/comments/4craf5/should_mra_treat_male_pua_in_the_same_regard_as/

deathdragon5858 · 2017-04-15T02:47:01+00:00

The same? Men and women will never be the same. If you meant equality under the law, and equal opportunities, not shoehorned halfassed attempts at equal results; then I agree.

thrway_1000 · 2017-04-14T21:36:52+00:00

/r/MensRights/wiki/faq

Imnotmrabut · 2017-04-15T00:34:25+00:00

Why do you keep using the word "Same"?

There are fundamental biological differences between men and women. When all the evidence shows that breast is best, to be the same we will need all expectant fathers on mass hormones to promote lactation.

That "same" word leads to real dead end daftness. P¬))

mwobuddy · 2017-04-14T22:04:40+00:00

Is this movement about making men be better than women, or making them the same?

You mean the reverse of how it is currently in the law and culturally?

Badgerz92 · 2017-04-14T23:45:31+00:00

The men's rights movement was started primarily by feminists who recognized the other half of problems. It's always just been about treating both men and women as equals

Klytemaestra · 2017-04-15T17:37:24+00:00

"Personally I am a feminist"

Then you are an enemy to all men and will be treated as an adversary. Feminism is a disgusting hate movement that must be destroyed.

"now before I get hate, all I want is men and female.to have the exact same rights, no one gender gets treated better or worse than the other one."

That is NOT what feminism is about. Feminism is a leftist ideology that blames men for everything, and spends most of its energy on paranoid fantasies about an imaginary boogeyman called "patriarchy."

This sub is about ACTUAL equality under the law for men. We are not misogynists and we do not want to oppress women. We just want equal rights.

the_unseen_one · 2017-04-15T19:57:57+00:00

This is about men and women being treated equally under the law, as has been said.

I would add an addendum: it is also about men and women being treated equally socially as well. Things like men being expected to make more, men's worth being based off their earnings and social status, men being expected to financially support women even when they both work, men being expected to throw their lives away for women and children, etc. are not legally enforced ideals, but they are nevertheless important social inequalities. Men are universally treated as less valuable than women, to the point that hundreds of us can die and it won't even make the news unless one woman was also in the death toll.

This is a harder thing to fix, as it has millenia of societal constants behind it and millions of years of evolution supporting it, but I firmly believe that humans can overcome their baser instincts with logic and thought, and this is no different. I want men to be treated and considered equally, and not being seen as a disposable commodity for money or blood. Barring this, if feminists and society in general find the thought of a woman being thrown away with as little care and hesitation as a man, I think men should regain the privileges they once held in the past. If we are not going to treat the genders equally in terms of cost, then why should women get equality in terms of benefit? It's inherently unfair, and I think this movement is egalitarian, which means at its core its about fairness.

To clarify the above, the old dynamic used to be that women had fewer rights and privileges than men, but also had more protections and fewer responsibilities than men. Although it seemed like women got the short end of the stick, the fact was that the relationships were equitable, if different, and this is a fact that feminism has desperately tried to cover up and hide. Men undoubtedly had more rights and freedoms, but they also had far more responsibilities. They had the lives of their whole family in their hand, they had to work themselves to the bone to support their family at any cost even if they hated their job, they often chose dangerous jobs to make ends meet and risked injury or death, and if it came down to it they were the protector of the family and was expected to die for the women and children, even if they were not their own. We had a heavy burden put upon us as men, and the privileges were our reward for such a heavy cost. Women did not have these costs, and simply had to rear children and maintain the home. Not an easy task of course, but far safer and easier than men's, and as a result their freedoms and privileges were proportional.

Now, however, women have all the privileges of men but none of the costs, and men have all of the costs they had before, but fewer privileges. Even worse, their remaining privileges are devalued by the fact that women enjoy the same luxuries without earning them. Women now have the right to work, to vote, and to do anything they want, but do not hold any of the responsibilities that men hold. Men still work the dangerous jobs, they are still obligated to be the breadwinner, they are still obligated to court and pay for women, they are still obligated to sign their lives away in the draft, and they are still considered disposable compared to women and expected to get hurt or die for women and children. Women hold none of these obligations, but still enjoy all of the privileges that used to solely be male ones. This devalues our privileges, because while we still have to EARN ours, women are handed them, to the point that some things like voting are mistakenly called a "right", even though it is only a right for women, and a privilege for men. There's a lot of talk about privilege, but what feminists tend to leave out is that male privilege was earned, and a reward for being disposable work horses for society.

So that is why I think that there are really only two paths an egalitarian can support here: A) women keep all of the traditionally male privileges they enjoy, but are forced to take on the male burdens that they have been spared from. This goes from signing up for the draft, to working in dangerous jobs, to no longer being considered more valuable than a man in an emergency. Or, B) women lose the traditionally male privileges they were given, and continue to be spared the male burdens that they have never been saddled with. I am not sure which is better, but realistically I doubt either will ever occur. What woman would ever vote to take on male burdens when they can get all the benefits with none of the danger or cost?

I know I wrote a lot and kind of rambled, but I'd like to hear your response to this, even if it is much shorter. Thanks for reading.

cld8 · 2017-04-16T06:13:52+00:00

This movement is about equality.

The men's rights movement only fights against feminists when the feminist movement is demanding preferential treatment for women.

For example, if you take child custody, NOW (Natl. Organization of Women, which is one of the largest feminist groups in the US) opposes equal custody because it would separate children from their mothers. They recently defeated an equal custody law in Florida.

DavidByron2 · 2017-04-14T22:15:35+00:00

about making men be better than women

Civil rights isn't about making anyone better than anyone. It's about treating people with respect and fairness.

Personally I am a feminist

So you come on a civil rights board and declare you are a member of a hate movement.

all I want is men and female.to have the exact same rights

Total bullshit. Name one example where feminism stands for equal rights in ANYTHING. You people are hatemongers and are against equality.

Title	What is this movement about?
Author	UnlawfulFoxy
Upvotes	11
Comments	31
Date	April 14, 2017 9:27 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/65fce0/what_is_this_movement_about/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/what-is-this-movement-about.925795 https://theredarchive.com/post/925795

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