Is divorce ever okay?

ButterMyBiscuit · 2013-12-03T19:40:38+00:00

The vast majority of divorces are initiated by women. This seems sort of odd to me, since women's value decreases as they age and men's value increases.

Most women don't realize or accept that. You're on RPW, which is by no means a normal sampling of women.

LadyLumen · 2013-12-03T20:22:49+00:00

When is divorce okay?

That's a subjective question. I think the more important question is, "What should people do before they get married?"

In our culture, there is little preparation for marriage aside from a big expensive wedding and lots of false hope. It should be the norm for people to sign prenups and get some kind of premarital counseling before they get married.

People should date around a bit, as our grandparents did, before they chose THE ONE. Don't make a hasty decision. Live with the person you're going to marry for at least a year before you make the commitment.

This would be better insurance against divorce.

Also, I don't think divorce in of itself is always such a terrible thing. It's just our societies approach to divorce is very punitive of the male and expensive in general. If divorce happened without alimony and a litany of court battles it wouldn't be so bad.

However, children change everything. If the couple has kids, they should do everything in their power to make the relationship work, since divorce is hard on children. If divorce still happens, they should do everything in their power to create a balanced and fair environment for their children.

I was actually pretty happy when my parents got divorced because they never really got along. But what made the divorce hard was the endless court battles, battles for child custody and trash talking that they did of each other. If the divorce could have happened without all those things, I don't think I would have minded as a kid.

TempestTcup · 2013-12-03T19:59:26+00:00

Yeah, I'm torn on the divorce thing. I won't do it, but I've seen some miserable marriages.

Pink_acetaminophen · 2013-12-03T20:23:15+00:00

Psychological abuse and cheating are pretty valid reasons to want to get away. I don't know if you can work those things out.

sugarcrush · 2013-12-03T20:35:46+00:00

I would divorce over infidelity, abuse (to myself or children), the more terrible criminal offenses, and if for some reason he decided upon an extreme lifestyle change (ex: no longer wants children). I might be willing to work it out in a case of infidelity if it was a one time, drunken mistake while we were going through a bad time, confessed immediately, etc. type of thing, but I learned in the past that being cheated in turns me into a crazy person and it's not good for myself or my partner to be together anymore.

My parents divorced when I was ~20 and I feel like they could have worked harder to stay together, but I'm not a part of their marriage so... who knows. I do think most people are too hasty to call it quits, but I try not to judge others' relationships since there are often things going on behind closed doors that I don't know about.

cardigansandcookies · 2013-12-03T23:59:34+00:00

I think you sign up for life, with the partner you marry. Should that partner change dramatically, and you can't resolve it, then divorce may be appropriate. That could include drugs, cheating, abuse.

FleetingWish · 2013-12-04T03:40:17+00:00

I guess being in a family where I constantly wished for my parents to get divorced (no abuse... at least not physical...) I'm a little biased, but I want to say yes, but also qualify that. Marriage is supposed to be a life long bond, "for better or worse, 'till death do we part". With divorce, it's just not... it's basically a joke. No one takes their vows seriously anymore. No one cares about whether or not a relationship is really going to last forever because marriage is the end goal for a lot of women. Marriage is supposed to be about sticking together no matter what. It's about learning to work together, and growing together. It's not supposed to be an infinite power struggle for dominance in the relationship.

In my opinion a few things should happen with marriage.

People should take their choice of partner more seriously than they do. He beats you? She cheated on you? You don't get along? Why didn't you pick a partner that was going to work? Why didn't you know this was going to be a problem before you got married?
People should care more about the person than about the marriage. This is mostly a woman problem, but there are a lot of beta men who say they "want to get married someday". Marriage is just a piece of paper and a ceremony, if that's on your list of life goals, then your life should be reevaluated. Instead your goal should be "meet someone so awesome that they will make me want to spend the rest of my life with them". I once heard a radio personality say "there's no good reason to get married". There's a lot of truth to that, marriage should be a natural extension of where you already are in the relationship because it does not add anything.
Divorce should be taken more seriously. In legal terms, I don't know what that means. If you were stupid, and if you picked a bad partner, you shouldn't have to be celibate the rest of your life in dead-bedroom marriage because you made a bad choice. Divorce should be an option, and should be a harder in a way that makes sure you're really serious. It's hard for men, they don't want to get divorced for the most part, but it's too easy for women, they do want to get divorced because they get rewarded for it.

Honestly, I really think marriage is an outdated concept that's really no different than a serious LTR. I don't know if it's even worth saving. To me a real relationship stays together even when you could leave, not because you're chained together by some sort of contractual ball-and-chain.

LadyLumen · 2013-12-03T20:14:26+00:00

The vast majority of divorces are initiated by women. This seems sort of odd to me, since women's value decreases as they age and men's value increases.

What women don't realize is that their sexual market value is not the same as their dating market value. There are lots of guys around who would be willing to fuck a woman in her 40's if there were no strings attached, but few of those men would actually be willing to get in a committed relationship with her unless she was above average in looks or had a great personality.

Yet many women don't understand this. They see the vast horde of men willing to sleep with them as an indicator of their worth, and think that they would have no problem scoring another man.

Why do more women get divorced than men? Simple. Because the divorce courts and the laws heavily favor women. There are many men who would like to get divorced and are miserable in their marriages, but don't for fear of losing their children, their house, their pet, and more than half their money. I see many examples of such men in r/relationships.

Younger women now are paying the price for their mothers' actions. While many older women have decided to go the eat, pray, love route, many younger women are getting knocked up and abandoned, because young guys are starting to wise up to the scam of this marriage business.

So while more women may get divorced, less men in general are getting involved in relationships. The Alpha males have an informal harem of endless sex they can enjoy well into their 40's, without the strings of marriage and children attached. Beta males conversely, have a much more enjoyable existence available in the world of video games and the solidarity of their guy friends, then the rejection and abuse that awaits them in the modern day relationship. As a young 20 something year old, many of my guy friends either sleep around or don't even try at all.

Bakerofpie · 2013-12-03T21:03:52+00:00

we have a motto "No One Gets Out of This Marriage Alive". i am going to cross stitch it under a pair of crossed pistols with roses

peolerson · 2013-12-03T22:10:29+00:00

People grow and change. Sometimes things happen to us that change us as people and not always for the better, and that's okay. My parents divorced when I was 10 because my mom is a really difficult person to get along with and she realized (a little late) that she wanted a different life than the one she had with my dad. They had a pretty amiable divorce, and are both happy now. That's kind of the problem with marriage; there's no real way to see if it works out than just diving in and seeing what happens. Although usually you assume it will. :P

The one thing my parents did during their marriage that really helped me was that they never fought in front of me, never pulled me into the crossfire, never pitted me against the other parent, and most importantly they didn't "stay together for the kids." I know friends whose parents tried to do that and it just created a household full of tension and toxicity. I'm fortunate in that my parents handled their divorce with a lot of grace and set a great example for me, should that ever happen.

Edit: As for women being the initiators, I think with feminism on the uptake in recent decades, women realized that they had other options besides being trapped in a marriage they didn't fully want. My SO's grandparents divorced recently for a similar reason. My mom initiated my parents' divorce and she's a radfem (and not in a good way). I think your emotional handling of the situation is great, and I hope things turn out well for you and your parents. :)

2013-12-05T00:21:14+00:00

In my case it was when I wanted to do whatever it took to make the marriage better, and my ex-husband simply just couldn't be bothered with the entire thing.

Clearly, my massive error was picking the wrong spouse. However, it's just not going to work when only one person gives a shit, and the other just wants a kind of human pet that they only have to interact with when they feel like it.

2013-12-04T16:21:05+00:00

Divorce and giving up on the marriage are two different things. I'm not saying you should never get divorced or never give up on a marriage - real abuse or complete abandonment for instance. However, if you have the mindset marriage is written in blood, then you quit thinking "I'll try to see if I can make this work" and instead, simply have the attitude "how do I make this better". It seems like a small change, but it's generally the difference between a shit marriage and a happy one.

boydeer · 2013-12-07T21:42:49+00:00

Do you think it's just the prevalence of feminism and women thinking if they are unhappy it's the man's fault?

my father had a client who was a couples' counselor and she told him that she knows when the couple comes in how it's going to go based on whether or not the woman hates men. take that for what it's worth.

thr0waway33 · 2013-12-06T00:24:02+00:00

I don't get how everyone seems to think it's "normal". Wedding vows are usually something along the lines of: "I, __, take you, __, to be my lawfully wedded(husband/wife), to have and to hold, from this day forward, for better, for worse, for richer, for poorer, in sickness and in health, until death do us part."

until death do us part

And still, regardless of this promise, divorce is seen as acceptable. As a man, I'd be COMPLETELY EMBARRASSED if I had to announce a divorce. On the wedding, I PROMISED IN FRONT OF FRIENDS AND FAMILY how we'd be together until death do us part. [I could avoid breaking this promise by killing my wife - or myself, but not a huge fan of either option]. Even if I didn't initiate the divorce, it would still prove my lack of judgement (regarding my wife/marriage).

Alimony is one reason why marriage isn't attractive to men, but I'll probably make enough money to easily afford paying an ex-wife. The odds of divorce, however, are so ridiculously high nowadays, that I'll always tell women I don't want to get married; even though I'd love a Red Pill marriage.

I definitely think divorce should be a legal option, I just don't understand why people seem not to be embarrassed by getting a divorce.

Title	Is divorce ever okay?
Author	Bakerofpie
Upvotes	11
Comments	44
Date	December 3, 2013 7:11 PM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/1s0hdb/is_divorce_ever_okay/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/is-divorce-ever-okay.84079 https://theredarchive.com/post/84079

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