Loyalty & Hypergamy

bsutansalt · 2015-01-29T21:38:37+00:00

On a side note this may also explain why so many men instinctively have a hard time trusting women. Overall though it's a great topic. I've said it for years now that loyalty, honor, and integrity are masculine traits. Think about how we raise boys and girls differently, there is no female equivalent of bros before hoes and there's no female equivalent of bro code (eg. not banging a buddy's ex or sister without asking if he's okay with it). And as you stated, hypergamy is in direct contradiction with loyalty so it's opposite their very nature.

When looking at masculine vs feminine behaviors and ideals passed down from generation to generation, what men have been indoctrinated with has been pretty much the same over the years from what I can tell going as far back as the silent generation.

Honor
Loyalty
Integrity

These qualities are drilled into little boys from early childhood, but women do not receive the same indoctrination/upbringing. I think this is why there’s no female equivalent to “bros before hos”. Now how does this apply to the military? Just look at the Air Force’s core values:

http://www.airforce.com/learn-about/our-values/

Integrity First
Service Before Self
Excellence In All We Do

These are masculine qualities, especially the first and second one. It stands to reason that women are going to be out of place in a culture that values these clearly masculine qualities. The grand irony is that the military continues to be try and feminize itself even as we speak. There are task forces sweeping through the AF right now taking down Maxim posters and whatnot to make the workplace more welcoming to women. Is stuff like that even going to matter when the core values the service espouses are things that are contrary to the feminine imperative and the solipsism women are raised into?

Give these threads a look for more info:

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=164338

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=162546

The real kick in the balls is that women’s grooming by society and their elders has drastically changed over the generations. No more are days of women being brought up to be become good housewives and mothers, ready to settle down shortly after high school. Nope, these days it’s girls growing up emulating their favorite reality show sluts and being pushed into solipsism and hookup culture, I think mainly by their single mothers, many of whom want to live vicariously through them, and the lack of a father figure to temper these desires.

The rampant unchecked hypergamy running rampant in our culture is truly something to behold, especially if you’re the lucky 5-10% of guys who are benefiting from it. What’s worse is the millions of men get contradicting messages about how they’re supposed to behave. They get the ideas I mentioned above drilled into them, while at the same time being demonized and told how toxic their masculinity it. Meanwhile most see the minority of men getting showered with sex and female attention, but told that acting like those men do is a bad thing, and that that there’s a set of female approved qualities they should espouse, but it doesn’t get rewarded anymore thanks to how what women value having changed over the years. This is the cognitive dissonance that drives many men to the seek out alternative dating strategies, MGTOW, PUA, and Red Pill chief among them. Thankfully the number of men waking up from The Matrix is growing every day. How that will play out in the military remains to be seen though, but I most certainly do agree that the military is ripe for a red pill revolution. They already have masculinity in spades, a very defined culture that hasn’t changed too much over the generations despite feminine imperative thinking and attempts to make it more female friendly, even though women are a stark minority amount their ranks (the AF has the best ratio and it’s “only” a 5:1 ratio of men to women).

Men in the military are the front-runners of our society who could wake up en mass and stop failing the shit test of feminism if enough of them take the Red Pill in time. I think as more younger men snap out of it and see things for what they are, and they join the military themselves and take their knowledge into the already heavily male dominated ranks, that it could be the first demographic to see an end of the Misandry Bubble at an institutional level.

Bottom line, my prediction is that when the military stops being led around by its noses by feminist thinking we’ll know the Misandry Bubble is bursting on a widespread level since the military is the first responder to social upheaval of the liberal variety. The MRM and Red Pill is truly a liberal movement, despite the appearance that it’s a shift back to traditionalism. Men breaking free of traditional gender roles, playing video games, hooking up, NOT settling down, NOT being chivalrous, NOT sacrificing in the workforce for women’s benefit, that’s the 21st Century changing of the guard of gender roles for men much the same way women rejected being homemakers and entered the workforce in the 70s. Doing so is contrary to traditional conservative values, which is why I see that aspect of our culture as being a new type of liberal mindedness. Anyway, once you add in the eventual advent of a male birth control and men are going to see a new kind of freedom it’s hard to imagine what it’ll look like. The drawback is that it’ll largely be the end of western civilization as we know it since as men drop out of the jobs that make the world turn, and all the evidence tells us women are NOT filling in the gaps.

When men say enough is enough and would rather enjoy the welfare state instead of taking out our collective garbage, who will keep the lights on? Who will be willing to join the military in service of the feminine imperative when they know what it’ll mean for them if they do? Long-term ramifications of where society is heading does not paint a pretty picture. In the short term, it’ll be great and fantastic and see all kinds of men going their own way, in whatever form that may take (going ghost, adoption PUA tactics, or something else entirely).

MattyAnon · 2015-01-29T21:51:53+00:00

I wish I could break up with a woman before choosing whether to date her or not.

the99percent1 · 2015-01-30T05:18:55+00:00

I still don't know how to fully cope with hypergamy.. My plates are attractive enough that they will be hit on 24/7.

Heck, my current main plate is flirting with a handsome actor that has 200k female instagram followers.. You. Just. Can't. Compete.

I put up a brave face and act like this sort of behavior doesn't faze me. But be damned, does this 'bitches aint loyal' shit suck. So now i'm emotionally sharing my main plate with an actor.. At least I get the sex.

This is the reason why you HAVE to keep managing other plates and not get into one-itis mode. The beta me would've crumbled at this massive shit test, begging her to come back to me.. At least now, I hold frame, show that I can walk away with a positive & up-beat nature. She instinctively knows this and it's why I'm still fucking her whilst she dotes on this actor.

DRMMR76 · 2015-01-30T09:28:41+00:00

Spot on. And this is one of the reasons why I find the whole Dark Triad thing to be deplorable. Men built civilization. Through war, peace, industry, achievement; all by working together. Honor, Integrity, and Loyalty are inherently masculine traits and I think are directly responsible for us moving from caves to skyscrapers. We a man decides to deal with other men with Honor, and not through duplicity and backstabbing, great things result. When we result to this "I'll get mine and laugh when you don't get yours" mindset, only destruction follows. Now this is not a defense of socialism, communism, or any other form of forced cooperation or feigned equality.

Consider an ideal financial transaction. Free men who understand honor and integrity deal with each other through the appreciation and reciprocation of value. Ideally, you work your best and the person you did the work for pays you what that work is worth. You then take that money and purchase items that others have made to the best of their ability. You are free to discern and choose which you think is best, and they are free to choose what they think the price should be. Either you agree or disagree. With honor and integrity, you don't try to pay with counterfeit money or try to lowball the seller, and he doesn't try to sell you shoddy or broken items. Just as your sense of honor makes you work your best at your job and your bosses sense of honor makes him not try to screw you over. And it's not out of selflessness. It's actually the height of righteous selfishness. The honorable and prudent person knows that to get the best they must give their best, on either side of a transaction.

These are masculine ideals. They may not always be apparent in life, but I think most honorable men can say that if given the choice to have things work this way, they would. Contrast that to how women tend to work. Always looking for a way to get something unearned, using someone else's resources, dealing with perception and social projections over hard reality. They want the product that appeals to their emotions, not that which is most fucntional. They view men not by how they can honestly deal with them to the benefit of both, but as disposable batteries to be used and cast aside before moving to the next one.

It is in the best interest of men to not sink to that level. As the gender that is really the only one capable of having honor, integrity, dignity, and loyalty, it is folly to cast those values aside in some nihilistic fashion in order to get ours right now even while we set civilization to flame in the process.

We can be better. We have the ability to pursue real values that transcend our caveman instincts. If we didn't, we would still be bashing each other over the head with rocks to steal food or mates. Yes, some still do that. And we invented law and society to stand up and say "Stop. We can be better. We should be better". But it's still a conscious choice each man must make on his own. And the men who choose not to are only harming themselves in the end, no matter how many ONS notches from other men's wives they rack up in the process.

NeoreactionSafe · 2015-01-29T22:59:19+00:00

"Young men entering into military life out of high school have (in most cases) 4 years to learn an idealism based on the Old Set of Books, is it any wonder they become suicidal after they are forced to come to terms with the disillusionment of that idealism in the face of the feminine-primary reality they enter when they’re discharged?"

This is so true.

Many military guys come back and still believe in the Old Books and will behave like White Knights until they wake up.

The shock is far worse for these guys because they were the Band of Brothers who really learned what true love is about while in combat.

Red Pill is a blessing and hopefully we can get as many ex-military into it as possible so they realize they are not alone. It's not worth dying over. Waking up shouldn't create suicide.

Hypergamy has always existed, but was mostly repressed in the past. It's only in the last 20 years that Hypergamy has gone on steroids. Blame the laws, Feminism, the whole Marxist decline.

That's another irony about military men:

What side were they fighting for?

...a sick Marxist system?

GRRMkills · 2015-01-30T03:56:21+00:00

This is something many men struggle with: judging women according to standards set for men.

Loyalty is not a feminine trait. Trust is not a feminine trait. Honesty is not a feminine trait. Yet many men expect it out of women because they personally believe in those attributes, and in return they are disappointed over and over and over.

I've learned to expect a woman to act like one, not like a man, and that was one of the biggest steps towards full acceptance of TRP for me. It's given me a bit of bittersweet bliss though, because now I'm not disappointed when a woman is disloyal or dishonest, I expect that. I do not hate women because they are not like men, I just accept that they're different and appreciate what positive qualities they have.

thenarrrowpath · 2015-01-30T19:56:50+00:00

I spent too many years of my life hoping that I could find a relationship with a woman that would be on par with the relationship I had with my male military friends in terms of honesty, loyalty, trust, forthrightness.

Mind blow. Its like you know exactly how we feel and think, and put it down on paper in such a succinct way. I love the way you write Rollo, keep them coming!

LifeAtPeace · 2015-01-31T11:44:44+00:00

Men look at fellow men as human beings whereas women look at fellow men as utilities/ resources. So when the man becomes less useful or the woman finds another man more useful, she will swing the branch or the man becomes invisible. I am not saying this just about women in relationships but even women at work. I have observed that my former male colleagues still treat me as a person and I can rely upon them. But female colleagues just look at me as a resource to extract knowledge or work from.

Moldy_Gecko · 2015-01-30T12:31:15+00:00

If you are still in, I would suggest Asia. They give that kind of loyalty usually.

smokingmonkey420 · 2015-01-30T18:06:01+00:00

What is the chance that women develop some self-awareness in regards to hypergamy? TRP was able to open the eyes to many beta men (myself included) and allowed us to see the errors of our ways so that we can be better men.

We even see the development of RPW and other women like Karen Straughan, Christina Hoff Sommers who seem to be well aware of what's going on with men and women today.

Quite frankly, I think it's the only way forward. We're not going back to traditional values or using religion to guide our morals. Both men and women need to gain a sense of self-awareness in order to live virtuous and fulfilling lives. I hold out hope that it is not beyond them. At least for the ones who are not too far gone.

HelloJapan1 · 2015-01-31T18:15:53+00:00

If you want loyalty .....buy a dog

foomfoomfoom · 2015-02-01T15:37:47+00:00

Right. Unfortunately, we come to each of our new relationships trying to fit them into the metaphorical molds of our other relationships. An immature response to female hypergamy is thinking that women should be loyal or honest or have integrity. I value having someone in my life who, in her eyes, my value is always an open question. It makes me work hard. In fact, after spinning plates for awhile, I've recently started to form a more serious relationship with the most hypergamous and manipulative woman from the bunch. I've told her my plans and ambitions knowing with certainty that if I don't always work to live up to them and creatively fuck other people over along the way, she'll lose interest. It motivates me.

MrExpress · 2015-02-02T03:22:27+00:00

This made me sad. The love I have for my brothers will never be the love I'll share with a woman. It's a shame, and a hard truth to swallow. I just have to remember to be a man. Honor, courage, commitment in everything I do, go my own way and find a woman to follow.

Title	Loyalty & Hypergamy
Author	Rollo-Tomassi
Upvotes	98
Comments	39
Date	January 29, 2015 9:16 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2u4gjf/loyalty_hypergamy/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/loyalty-hypergamy.28527 https://theredarchive.com/post/28527

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